Page 8 | To be sick of the police!!

Noangelbuthavingfun · 2024-02-22T18:39:11+00:00

Yet another one .... rapist ..before He even joined the force. WTAF is going on ? You can't trust the very people that you are supposed to ! Add to that the failings of the police "force" dealing with Grace and Barnaby case recently and the awful disrespectful texts that we heard about .... and you just think what de hell is going on !! Unforgivable!

DriftingDora · 23/02/2024 21:56

MenArePeopleToo · 23/02/2024 21:54

Sorry but if you read my previous post I actually made it clear I wasn't denying anyone's experience and explained why I was offering my own. You seem unreasonably angry at me however without people like me willing to go to work everyday your children, friends and families would be far less safe. Who do you think investigates crimes committed against them and puts the thousands of people into prison everyday? I'd rather take the abuse from the public and know I was doing my bit than not but sometimes it's too much, I don't appreciate or want to be slagged off all the time. There's someone on my team who was beaten to a pulp by an ex, she could have slagger off the police forever but instead she put her trauma aside to help other people in that situation. Can you imagine how she feels when she dedicates her life to putting people like that in prison and people continue to just abuse us saying the police aren't fit for purpose, females are as bad, they love power etc? It's disgraceful and you cannot deny that. There's a reason people are getting defensive on this thread and that's because when you are giving so much of yourself day in day out ( hello literally 20 shifts in a row with rest days cancelled and no this isn't on a spectacularly rare department where only a few of us have this happening ) and take violence, abuse and so much pressure people like you who haven't experienced it having a go just cut that bit deeper.

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I rest my case.

Oh, and don't tell me what I have or haven't experienced - yet another assumption that you know best. It seems to go with the job for some.

RosieTheChi · 23/02/2024 21:56

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 21:16

Gbh is defined by the cps as a wound which goes through all 8 layers of skin . So a stabbing - gbh . Section 18 assault - either with intent or not .

Abh- that's a black eye or a tooth knocked out

Common assault- a push or shove without injury .

I have been pondering whether to comment on these definitions but decided to for the benefit of victims who may be reading this.

Assault - an assault is committed when the offender intentionally or recklessly causes the victim to apprehend imminent force under s.39 Criminal Justice Act 1988. The victim must fear an immediate attack and an assault does not have to include physical contact.

ABH - All that needs to be proved is that actual bodily harm followed an assault. This harm is not limited to physical injury but extends to any hurt or damage caused to the body and does not need to include a bruise or break to the skin.

GBH - This is a charge whereby the criterion must result in 'really serious bodily harm'. The CPS charging standards lists examples of such serious harm which includes serious psychiatric injury. The difference from the charge of ABH is that there is no necessity for an assault to have been committed before there could be an infliction of GBH. The CPS advises that life-changing injuries should be charged as GBH injury which can also include psychiatric harm and doesn't need to result in breakage of the skin.

I was told by an officer that for a charge of ABH, you have to physically put your hands on someone. I genuinely do not understand why they are misinforming people like this. It is also deeply concerning that the above offences are not properly understood within the force (not meaning you personally).

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 21:58

Gbh - grevious BODILY harm - the definition the cps use

There is attempt gbh which can be psychological.

I took a statement yesterday for a job - attempt gbh- no gbh committed but made the victim feel in fear of violence .

I can't comment on individual grievances. Complain to the force you're in .

MenArePeopleToo · 23/02/2024 21:59

Balhammom · 23/02/2024 21:47

I think there is a bit of a jump here.

Im not police, but some of my colleagues are arrogant or unpleasant. That doesn’t mean there’s grounds to fire or discipline them, less still to assume they’re rapists or murderers.

Surely it’s the same with police? Other officers may think certain colleagues are odd and unpleasant but still not have grounds to report them or believe they’re a danger to the public.

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Absolutely this, can you imagine the bullying complaints if everyone who was a bit odd or unpopular or even had a harsh management style was disciplined and managed out. Nobody wants to work with these types but it's not to dissimilar to when I was at school and the creepy teacher who everyone, even other staff knew was a creep eventually got the sack for having a relationship with a student. Awful and we all got a bad vibe but until then did he do anything to warrant being sacked? No he didn't. Was he harsh on students? Yes, that isn't a sackable offence. Was he a bit odd and not as popular as other teachers? Yep he was. I would still send my children to school despite this and from what I've seen many many other people in similar positions who pose a real risk in the jobs they're in because ultimately you actually can't tell who is a wrongen and who isn't.

RosieTheChi · 23/02/2024 22:00

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 21:58

Gbh - grevious BODILY harm - the definition the cps use

There is attempt gbh which can be psychological.

I took a statement yesterday for a job - attempt gbh- no gbh committed but made the victim feel in fear of violence .

I can't comment on individual grievances. Complain to the force you're in .

I have never heard of attempt GBH in my legal studies. It's not a term that is used.

The brain is part of the body.

MenArePeopleToo · 23/02/2024 22:00

DriftingDora · 23/02/2024 21:56

I rest my case.

Oh, and don't tell me what I have or haven't experienced - yet another assumption that you know best. It seems to go with the job for some.

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I think you're coming across as quite dismissive and quite the closes minded bully actually. My.posts are respectful and answering your questions, it wouldn't be much of a discussion if you just wanted the thread to agree with you.

Lightnose · 23/02/2024 22:03

MenArePeopleToo · 23/02/2024 21:59

Absolutely this, can you imagine the bullying complaints if everyone who was a bit odd or unpopular or even had a harsh management style was disciplined and managed out. Nobody wants to work with these types but it's not to dissimilar to when I was at school and the creepy teacher who everyone, even other staff knew was a creep eventually got the sack for having a relationship with a student. Awful and we all got a bad vibe but until then did he do anything to warrant being sacked? No he didn't. Was he harsh on students? Yes, that isn't a sackable offence. Was he a bit odd and not as popular as other teachers? Yep he was. I would still send my children to school despite this and from what I've seen many many other people in similar positions who pose a real risk in the jobs they're in because ultimately you actually can't tell who is a wrongen and who isn't.

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School staff are obliged by law to report any suspicions they have about colleagues. It's down to the employers to find the evidence, or otherwise.

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:03

Rosie

You are wrong . I can't show you because it would breach confidentiality but there is attempt gbh .

The confusion here is the standards - crime recording standards differ to police and cos charging decisions .

That's half the issue . They need to marry up . And they don't .

RosieTheChi · 23/02/2024 22:04

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:03

Rosie

You are wrong . I can't show you because it would breach confidentiality but there is attempt gbh .

The confusion here is the standards - crime recording standards differ to police and cos charging decisions .

That's half the issue . They need to marry up . And they don't .

Can you show me the legislation or case law for attempt GBH please?

I know there's GBH with intent but that is a very serious charge.

RosieTheChi · 23/02/2024 22:06

@damnedwhatever Do you mean I'm wrong with regard to GBH including psychiatric harm? Not sure if you meant that or the attempt GBH thing I was wrong on.

marmaladeandpeanutbutter · 23/02/2024 22:06

The problem in the police is management and leadership. They just haven't been dealing with the internal problems.

MenArePeopleToo · 23/02/2024 22:07

Lightnose · 23/02/2024 22:03

School staff are obliged by law to report any suspicions they have about colleagues. It's down to the employers to find the evidence, or otherwise.

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Absolutely but they had no evidence it was just a bad vibe, until the worst happened. No fault of the teachers they were on the whole lovely but my point is that they couldn't do anything either just as lots of people can't without something solid to go on. Not to derail the thread at all but we all saw the poor man who raised concerns about Lucy Letby and how he was treated when he wasn't supported. People fear complaining about other people when it's obvious- what if they're wrong? What if they are portrayed as a bully? What if the promise to protect whistle-blowers isn't upheld?... let alone when it isn't obvious and someone seemingly out of nowhere does something abhorrent. Just as you can't predict a lot of human behaviours whether it be an affair, a suicide, things that people swear they never saw coming you also can't predict what your colleagues may or may not do. That's not to say turn a blind eye, absolutely definitely not but it's easier to critique from the outside in hindsight than it is on the inside.

TheChippendenSpook · 23/02/2024 22:08

MenArePeopleToo · 23/02/2024 21:54

Sorry but if you read my previous post I actually made it clear I wasn't denying anyone's experience and explained why I was offering my own. You seem unreasonably angry at me however without people like me willing to go to work everyday your children, friends and families would be far less safe. Who do you think investigates crimes committed against them and puts the thousands of people into prison everyday? I'd rather take the abuse from the public and know I was doing my bit than not but sometimes it's too much, I don't appreciate or want to be slagged off all the time. There's someone on my team who was beaten to a pulp by an ex, she could have slagger off the police forever but instead she put her trauma aside to help other people in that situation. Can you imagine how she feels when she dedicates her life to putting people like that in prison and people continue to just abuse us saying the police aren't fit for purpose, females are as bad, they love power etc? It's disgraceful and you cannot deny that. There's a reason people are getting defensive on this thread and that's because when you are giving so much of yourself day in day out ( hello literally 20 shifts in a row with rest days cancelled and no this isn't on a spectacularly rare department where only a few of us have this happening ) and take violence, abuse and so much pressure people like you who haven't experienced it having a go just cut that bit deeper.

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the response that you got to this heartfelt reply just shows that you're wasting your time posting on here. There are some people who have an agenda and won't listen to what you're saying.

It's trendy to hate the police at the moment. People don't want to listen to serving officers literally telling them that there are more good officers than bad and that you don't want the corrupt/murdering/uncaring police officers working alongside you. They won't listen because they don't want to listen as it doesn't fit their angry little narrative.

MenArePeopleToo · 23/02/2024 22:11

TheChippendenSpook · 23/02/2024 22:08

the response that you got to this heartfelt reply just shows that you're wasting your time posting on here. There are some people who have an agenda and won't listen to what you're saying.

It's trendy to hate the police at the moment. People don't want to listen to serving officers literally telling them that there are more good officers than bad and that you don't want the corrupt/murdering/uncaring police officers working alongside you. They won't listen because they don't want to listen as it doesn't fit their angry little narrative.

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Thank you @thechippendenspook I truly agree. Only one person I know has ever admitted to being hateful to police in the past and now ashamed of it and thats a lady who joined as a special constable and cringes at her previous perceptions and things she said / did when she had a rocky patch in her life. I don't think anyone will ever really understand unless they've spent a good chunk of time doing the job. That isn't me being arrogant it's a fact, you can't imagine how different it is to how the media portrays it all. I haven't got time in those 20 shifts to see my mum I don't know what they want from us, it's so disheartening. Anyway thank you I'm signing off for now as I do finally have a rest day!

RosieTheChi · 23/02/2024 22:12

@TheChippendenSpook I don't think it's trendy, it's just people have had so many bad experiences (myself included) that they have no faith anymore.

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:15

Rosie

You said there was no such thing as attempt gbh . And there is .

Bicyclecycle · 23/02/2024 22:18

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:15

Rosie

You said there was no such thing as attempt gbh . And there is .

Yes I agree. You can attempt any indictable offence.

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:18

Rosie with respect what legal training are you having ?

There is most definitely a crime of attempt gbh - not the same as gbh with intent .

What law studies are you doing to
Say you've not heard of such ?

I'm sorry but if you're studying law you will know there is a crime of attempt - attempt criminal damage , attempt
Theft , attempt gbh .

You are incorrect about crimes involving attempt . Gbh with intent is something completely different. What are you studying ?

RosieTheChi · 23/02/2024 22:21

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:15

Rosie

You said there was no such thing as attempt gbh . And there is .

You are correct. I misread and the abbreviation threw me off as I was doing something else at the same time. Attempted GBH with intent, I agree that is correct. As in attempting to cause GBH but failing.

somebeesarebastards · 23/02/2024 22:23

damnedwhatever · 22/02/2024 23:11

I'm female police officer and these threads really hurt me and affect me.

What's your perspective on the inside ?

I'm also a female police officer . It's pointless trying to engage in these types of threads .

Don't bother is my advice .

Absolutely agree. I'm a power hungry bully apparently.

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:26

Gbh has 2 definitions - with intent and without .

If you throw a glass but it bounces off a table and hits someone in the face causing gbh you've still committed it even without the intent .

If you throw a glass at someone face and cut them then it's gbh with intent .

You can also attempt - as said by someone else here who knows the law - any indictable offence .

If you throw a brick at someone's window and it doesn't smash it's still an attempt at criminal damage .

If you are indeed studying law it's fairly basic .

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:27

Do people also not realise police officers have to gain a degree or bcg level 3 in policing which takes either 2 or 3 years of study ?

RosieTheChi · 23/02/2024 22:27

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:26

Gbh has 2 definitions - with intent and without .

If you throw a glass but it bounces off a table and hits someone in the face causing gbh you've still committed it even without the intent .

If you throw a glass at someone face and cut them then it's gbh with intent .

You can also attempt - as said by someone else here who knows the law - any indictable offence .

If you throw a brick at someone's window and it doesn't smash it's still an attempt at criminal damage .

If you are indeed studying law it's fairly basic .

I agree with you.

I didn't agree with your definitions on Assault, ABH and GBH previously though.

damnedwhatever · 23/02/2024 22:27

Not bcg - nvq my fucking auto correct

DriftingDora · 23/02/2024 22:28

MenArePeopleToo · 23/02/2024 22:00

I think you're coming across as quite dismissive and quite the closes minded bully actually. My.posts are respectful and answering your questions, it wouldn't be much of a discussion if you just wanted the thread to agree with you.

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.I think you're coming across as quite dismissive and quite the closes minded bully actually.

What's that saying about takes one to know one? Thanks, I'll stay 'closes minded' 😁and take it as a compliment considering where it's come from.