AIBU that our friends are much richer than they've let on?

[richmanpoorman]

Long and weird one, that has completely split a friend group.
18 years ago we attended antenatal classes and met a lovely group of people. Out of 8 couples in the class, 5 have stayed in the same location and we’ve all become super close. We see each other all the time in big and small groups and go on a holiday once a year. The children are all very close.

Now all our oldest are 18 they’re all looking at university. The kids were all out having a drink and the subject of funding came up. They’re all doing a combination of loans plus parental contribution except one lad who drunkenly admitted that his parents have a fund for him and his younger sister, for university and house deposits, of around £850k.

Under any other circumstances this would have been none of our business… except for the last 18 years they’ve pleaded poverty. As a group we are all in a relatively comfortable situation, with the exception of this couple who despite quite impressive sounding jobs were very open about struggling financially with a big mortgage etc. Therefore we’ve all been really careful. Every time we’ve gone out for we pick a budget option. Every holiday has been planned based on the fact that they could only pay half what others could afford so we’ve spent 18 years staying in some pretty grim self catering places. In context, say they paid £500 for their share of the accommodation- another £500 (or even £250) from each couple would have been a nice upgrade holiday wise.

It turns out that they made a decision to only live on one income, and to totally save and invest the other income. Apparently they have just therefore never factored it into consideration as it went straight into various investment accounts, so they were technically broke as it wasn’t then easily accessible. One year we all actually paid for her son to attend rugby camp as they didn’t have the cash. It wasn’t a lot of money (£20 a day) but the audacity feels huge.

3 of the couples have stopped speaking to them. (Tbh it might have landed better if the last holiday self catering place hadn’t had been so totally grim, with the younger daughter of one of the families injuring herself due to some shoddy maintenance….)

DH and I are more on the fence. While as a group we all earn roughly the same we do come from different backgrounds- DH and I a more modest teacher/ nurse/ bookkeeper/ florist combo compared to some of the others who did have significant financial help early on in life. This early financial help is clear in the lives they live- with similar earnings we have a much smaller house, state schools etc. Family help early on has made a massive difference to the lives of some in the group. The couple in question have explained that they both come from very impoverished backgrounds, with a lot of financial insecurity. Good degrees and careers landed them in a group of friends where it was obvious the impact money had early in life (eg house deposits, no loans etc). So they made the decision to do that for their children. They’re not materialistic themselves so didn’t miss skiing/ nice clothes/ smart cars/ home decor etc, so they just decided to “hack” their kids into a fantastic start in life.

Our other friends argue that the impact of another £1-2k a year on a few nicer holidays and dinners etc wouldn’t have materially impacted the fund, and would have meant that we could have had better group experiences, plus there’s all the intangible stuff like not suggesting we stop for coffees because it felt uncomfortable that they wouldn’t get anything, and being careful talking about other spending in case it seemed insensitive.

I’m so upset. We had such a lovely group with such a strong bond and now it’s all a mess. We’re the only couple still talking to everyone which in itself is causing problems. I’m posting here because we’ve just been added to a group called “Skiing 2025” with all of the group except this couple, which seems pointed (because we’ve never even suggested skiing before because of the cost.)

The kids are upset. The son is deeply depressed that he started this and they’re trying to stay friends separately.

I suppose my AIBU is “am I being unreasonable to be pissed off that my friends were richer than they let on?” and more broadly what would people do?

Ps- I’m aware some of them are on Mumsnet….

@Gonnagetgoingreturnsagain I always pay for myself only (down to the last penny) when eating out. All my friends do too. Would never expect someone else to pay for me if I'd ordered more or was a drinker, that is CF behaviour.

I'd be really annoyed at that. Cheeky fuckers.

In reality their kids haven't ever been on a school holiday, don't have passports, aren't being taught to drive, did no after school sports training despite being talented, haven't had their bedrooms refurbished since they moved in....

They’re dishonest - it must be so upsetting.

And they’ve also negatively impacted their children’s lives with their need to save every penny. Less than 5% of those savings could have bought so many more experiences for their kids. Plus all the children are now caught up in it all.

Its up to them how they spent / Saved their money !!!

Seems rather miserable

I wound not be interest in socialising or maintaining friendships with them anymore. I think what they have done is dishonest, they gave the illusion of poverty when they are in fact the opposite. All they had to say was, sorry we can't make this trip, we're saving for X 🤷🏻‍♀️

Late to the thread but after reading all your updates OP IMO you all deserve to be fooled. I wouldn't have spent 18 years holidaying in shit holes to please someone else. What's wrong with only going out locally/meeting up at home with them if they couldn't afford it? It's a fact of life people have different incomes. Trying very hard to be inclusive has a limit.

After all of that you're STILL considering mending fences? Why? Just enjoy your lives with the remaining 3 couples.
I'm quite annoyed because a 'poor background' is used to excuse bad behaviour, like 'neurodiversity' on MN (I'm ND too) . I am from one myself, now in a good position myself. Most of us have some self-respect!

The deceit will always cause an undercurrent of resentment. No matter how lovely they are. Good liars are often fun and charming.

but you do you. @LolaSmiles makes some really good points.

Anyway. They will probably not come on the ski trip so the issue is sorted.

Also, you've been very quiet about how they have reacted. Apologised? Dug their heels in?

How do you know they lived on one wage?

It's astonishing that they have saved this much money and sacrificed so much over 18 years for their kids and didnt invest any in their property ?

Nobody needs £400k for university

They have the money for a reason....I know a few affluent people and they very rarely dig into their pockets......

id research that before assuming the 400k

But they shouldn’t have pleaded poverty when saving £50k a year and let their savings plans dictate what everyone else did.

Also OP you 'managing' the family with the injured daughter. If I were them I'd laugh in your face and tell you to get lost. By running around trying to broker peace, you may find yourself deepening the fracture.
Others are right to be upset. You don't need to smooth everything over. Let them be.

Agreed. If I was that family I’d tell OP to bugger off.

It sounds like they have become obsessed with saving

It's not normal. Yes help your kids but that's 20 years of their own lives they wont get back

They have been cheeky to guilt trip the choices of the group (for 18 years!) by claiming poverty, rather than just making it clear that they have distinct priorities. I would be annoyed about that, but you must value their friendship or you wouldn't all have bent over backwards for them. Groups like this usually do drift apart when finances are different. So on this one for me I think it would depend partly how elaborate they were about pleading their poverty: did they just say 'our budget for the holiday is x' or did they continually make a big fuss about how hard up they were.

Taking money for things they could afford like rugby club and anything else you might have subbed them on is massive cheeky fuckery, regardless of whether they asked for it or not.

The rest of the group however have all been rather naive - in your position, after observing this song and dance for 18 years, I would have assumed they were either a) colossally tight; b) in massive non-mortgage debt; c) snorting, drinking or gambling it all away.

I think Genevieva's advice is good. Find a way to reconcile and move on without fallout that affects the children.

But the friends could have done what they wanted. Instead they were overly accommodating to this couple, and compromised their quality of lives as a result.

none of your business how they prioritise their spending. Admirable that they have been so singleminded in securing their kids future. You would have preferred more lavish holidays but you obviously preferred to slum it a bit and go with them than spend more and holiday separately - that was your choice.
I think you are being pretty unfair to most about it now.

Well that's me. I don't either!
But then again, unlike the OP, my friends include people who actually struggle to heat and eat. I couldn't face myself if I 'plead poverty' to their faces. I am quite clear that I spend my money judiciously. I never say that I 'can't' afford something and go on about how poor I am. I don't discuss money at all.

BTW, on other MN threads with higher earners people are so quick to shout them down, 'read the room' etc etc. So strange that people are defending the liars on here. I guess people just like being contrary regardless of the subject matter.

@richmanpoorman

Was the "poor family" aware that you, as a group, were making decisions re holidays etc based on their financial constraints?

Or did they just think that was the plan?

I think it would've been much more friendly of them to tell the group what they were planning to do and to say "if you want to do anything more expensive then feel free to but we won't be doing it".

If a friend of mine had said they were doing this then I would have talked to them about savings (what to do rather than how much).

I do think it seems very sneaky how they've done it but I don't know how none of you realised what was going on - did you think they were gambling it or something?

@richmanpoorman I dont feel that what they did was necessarily dishonest. they have stated that they saw the difference a bit of early money made to the lives of the people who got financial help. they came from working class background so were used to living quite frugally anyway. If they had said what they were doing to the group, then some people in the group might have been very embarassed and at that point the couple might have been called envious. they really could not win in the eyes of the group. they have done the very best by their children and good on them for making that valuable difference to their futures. what would you have thought of them if they had divulged this information way back when you all first met??

@richmanpoorman

I would seriously consider getting this thread deleted. Surely only a matter of time before someone recognises this situation or the Daily Mail picks up the story.

I agree with a previous poster that your group feels very claustrophobic.

I couldn’t tell you what any of my friends make or how they spend their money. They gave their budget and I agree with another poster: if the group had known there was other funds there, it sounds like they would have put pressure on them to increase it. In some ways the admission saved arguments about money because I think things would have come to a head just probably earlier.

As for what they have or haven’t given their children, if that’s how they’ve chosen to parent then that was their choice. Instead they have given their children the resources to make their own decisions (like if they want to learn to drive or go on holiday etc).

Two wrongs don't make a right.
The OP's group were doormats.
But the couple also lied if they deliberately went out of their way to project a false image of poverty. Not just about the holidays but for everything else, when money etc comes up in conversation. They could just have been open about how they had different priorities!

As a PP said yes people might be pushy etc but in that case they're not real friends. To me it's a good weeder and benefits me anyway. Why would I want to maintain friendships based on lies?