AIBU that our friends are much richer than they've let on?

[richmanpoorman]

Long and weird one, that has completely split a friend group.
18 years ago we attended antenatal classes and met a lovely group of people. Out of 8 couples in the class, 5 have stayed in the same location and we’ve all become super close. We see each other all the time in big and small groups and go on a holiday once a year. The children are all very close.

Now all our oldest are 18 they’re all looking at university. The kids were all out having a drink and the subject of funding came up. They’re all doing a combination of loans plus parental contribution except one lad who drunkenly admitted that his parents have a fund for him and his younger sister, for university and house deposits, of around £850k.

Under any other circumstances this would have been none of our business… except for the last 18 years they’ve pleaded poverty. As a group we are all in a relatively comfortable situation, with the exception of this couple who despite quite impressive sounding jobs were very open about struggling financially with a big mortgage etc. Therefore we’ve all been really careful. Every time we’ve gone out for we pick a budget option. Every holiday has been planned based on the fact that they could only pay half what others could afford so we’ve spent 18 years staying in some pretty grim self catering places. In context, say they paid £500 for their share of the accommodation- another £500 (or even £250) from each couple would have been a nice upgrade holiday wise.

It turns out that they made a decision to only live on one income, and to totally save and invest the other income. Apparently they have just therefore never factored it into consideration as it went straight into various investment accounts, so they were technically broke as it wasn’t then easily accessible. One year we all actually paid for her son to attend rugby camp as they didn’t have the cash. It wasn’t a lot of money (£20 a day) but the audacity feels huge.

3 of the couples have stopped speaking to them. (Tbh it might have landed better if the last holiday self catering place hadn’t had been so totally grim, with the younger daughter of one of the families injuring herself due to some shoddy maintenance….)

DH and I are more on the fence. While as a group we all earn roughly the same we do come from different backgrounds- DH and I a more modest teacher/ nurse/ bookkeeper/ florist combo compared to some of the others who did have significant financial help early on in life. This early financial help is clear in the lives they live- with similar earnings we have a much smaller house, state schools etc. Family help early on has made a massive difference to the lives of some in the group. The couple in question have explained that they both come from very impoverished backgrounds, with a lot of financial insecurity. Good degrees and careers landed them in a group of friends where it was obvious the impact money had early in life (eg house deposits, no loans etc). So they made the decision to do that for their children. They’re not materialistic themselves so didn’t miss skiing/ nice clothes/ smart cars/ home decor etc, so they just decided to “hack” their kids into a fantastic start in life.

Our other friends argue that the impact of another £1-2k a year on a few nicer holidays and dinners etc wouldn’t have materially impacted the fund, and would have meant that we could have had better group experiences, plus there’s all the intangible stuff like not suggesting we stop for coffees because it felt uncomfortable that they wouldn’t get anything, and being careful talking about other spending in case it seemed insensitive.

I’m so upset. We had such a lovely group with such a strong bond and now it’s all a mess. We’re the only couple still talking to everyone which in itself is causing problems. I’m posting here because we’ve just been added to a group called “Skiing 2025” with all of the group except this couple, which seems pointed (because we’ve never even suggested skiing before because of the cost.)

The kids are upset. The son is deeply depressed that he started this and they’re trying to stay friends separately.

I suppose my AIBU is “am I being unreasonable to be pissed off that my friends were richer than they let on?” and more broadly what would people do?

Ps- I’m aware some of them are on Mumsnet….

The reason people are quiet about finances though is because as soon as people know how much money you have they become happy to spend it for you.

Unless they were borrowing money off you, making you pay for stuff for them the whole time, I don't see why you would care?

Some people are tightwads in certain ways. They won't spend out eating out, tech, 4 star holidays, nice furnishings but will save every penny to give to their kids. So they were probably feeling some sort of financial strain, even if was by their own doing. They don't value this stuff as much as you do maybe. They could have parents in care homes?

You say you knew they both have decent jobs, so surely the fact they never want to spend makes it more logical their kid would have a massive Uni fund.
It makes no difference to you on the grand scale surely.

I might choose to spend all my money on KFC and then moan I was broke for half the month, I wouldn't expect my friends to hate me for it. (I don't do that but everyone has their quirks with money, it's their money after all.)

Holding onto an 18 year friendship because of the length of it is a sunk cost fallacy.

Friendships can end after years.

People have different priorities on how they spend their money. I personally think its awful for their son if he is being ostracised.
Let it go and invite them over for dinner.
Surely you did have other holidays apart from the group ones ?!

Was the rugby only a one off payment or did other things like this happen where someone would pay for her coffee or lunch.
If your such good friends I'd say to her that you know and explain that it was because of them you had less enjoyable holidays.
I'd go on skiing trivandrum keep your other honest friends.
Tell her use want to make up to the kids for the less enjoyable holidays.

Friendship is based on authenticity.
We allow others to see ourselves and our vulnerabilities.

It’s not really about holidays, is it? It’s about knowing they didn’t feel they could trust you all with the truth.

And perhaps they were right.

The only thing I'd be annoyed about is paying for the rugby camp, other than that they've made different financial decisions/priorities to you. I doubt they ever told you all not to stop for coffee or to choose the cheapest place possible they would've just declined if they didn't want to spend their money on that.

I sort of understand where your friends are coming from. I’m part of a group of friends where one of them always pleads poverty. This means when we go out we have to choose cheap restaurants/hotels etc. Yes, we could suggest more expensive experiences but this would feel like we were excluding her. So often I feel like we don’t do things that I and other friends could afford.

If I actually found out she had large savings I would be really annoyed.

Just because they had the money to spend on better holidays doesn't mean they have to. They have saved their money for a genuine good reason. You don't have to spend your money on luxuries either. They chose how to invest their money one way and yourselves your own ways.

If someone says my budget is £500 it doesn't automatically mean that its because they can't afford it. But that, that's what they have decided is the budget as they have other commitments.

I would move on from one rugby camp subsidiary, that happened once.

You have different priorities. They had their outgoings which included saving because they didn’t want their children to need to get loans or struggle to get on the property ladder.

Would you have objected if they paid a huge mortgage and then sold the house to downsize, therefore, gaining the money that way or would that feel that it was a more genuine outgoing?

I think YABU because you are all indignant that they didn’t spent their money to do what you wanted them to do over the year when it wasn’t what they wanted to do. An expensive holiday is something to enjoy in the very short term but a deposit for a house is likely to be something their children will enjoy for life.

I’m posting here because we’ve just been added to a group called “Skiing 2025” with all of the group except this couple, which seems pointed (because we’ve never even suggested skiing before because of the cost.)

How do this couple feel about this ski holiday? Do they know about it ?

Really tricky as I can see both sides, but if I had to decide which couple were more “in the wrong” I’d nominate your frugal friends.
They were disingenuous, have dictated all of your experiences as a group and, most importantly, you’ve actually been left out of pocket due to their saving strategy. The latter is particularly crappy of them. They could have invested just a bit more of their money into the ‘now’ and ‘past’ rather than scrimping it away for the future.

Hmm, I can understand why people would be annoyed but equally it's up to them what they do with their money.

I had a friend. She was somewhat similar in that she wanted to save the vast majority of her disposable income. I went away with her a couple of times and made the decision not to again, as I like to do things like stop for coffees or have a meal out. While she saw cafes as a waste and would go round every restaurant in the area trying to find the cheapest. It was miserable.

Despite the financial situation, you and your friends did accommodate this couples frugality. That was a choice you all made. The group now feels they were misinformed but I think really everyone is more angry because they now feel foolish. Not because this couple actually did something "wrong".

Re the skiing
You don't have to go just because others in the group are going...

I missed the rugby camp bit. That was wrong

I couldn't move on from them not paying their way for things like the Rugby camp and the whole meaness and dishonesty of that. I'd ask for that money back. Are they both equally to blame? Or is one much tighter than the other?

It's been 18 years. Maybe it's a natural time for a change in the friendship? The kids can decide between themselves if they want to stay in touch.

They shouldn’t have let everyone else pay for rugby camp.

Other than that I don’t see why you’d be happy to do stuff frugally if it was because they had a big mortgage but not because they are saving. After all a mortgage is still a choice to some degree-it’s bigger if you are buying a more expensive house than a cheaper one-and a way of investing for the future.

Wanting budget options is less unreasonable. Presumably if you are good earners you have all been putting some money away anyway.

But it was utterly outrageous for them to get someone else to pay for anything for them if they had savings stashed away. Really grim behaviour and I would end the friendship over that

I don’t think the friends that have stopped talking to them will budge.

You make your own decision.

Unless they had fleeced me personally and I enjoyed their company I’d remain friends with them.

Teenage children should not be ostracised.

I'd just let it go for the sake of the friendship. Subsidising rugby camp would piss me off, but re: holiday budget, their budget is whatever their budget is. How much they earn overall is irrelevant.

The eating out issue is the same in my eyes, I guess they only budget a small amount for that sort of thing. This approach has really paid off for them! My personal income has doubled in the past five years but my holiday budget has not increased. Saving the extra is a huge priority for me, and I'm happy with the holidays we were having before.

Setting up a separate group for another holiday ia purely designed to exclude them and is just a petty adult version of bullying.

Perhaps now that they have their savings for their children in place they will have a much higher disposable income and want to go - not that I imagine they consider you as friends anymore.

Quite often very rich people are incredibly tight. That’s why they stay rich.

You don’t have the full picture e.g. they may have had inheritances that they ring fenced for the kids.

It wouldn’t bother me, but I don’t have any friendships that are this intense.

I think your wealthy friends are not willing to forgive because they are completely unable to understand how scary and at times traumatic it can be growing up in poverty. If they didn't have access to the other money they couldn't afford the holidays. It feels like a really extreme lifestyle choice but they really have sorted their children for the future and I admire them for it in a way. They were wrong on the rugby club front though I'd be really annoyed about that. Did someone insist on paying for them or were they quite happy to blag it? That would make a big difference for me. I feel really really sorry for their son though and the other kids

It may have only happened once but it was utterly shameless behaviour. I can't imagine staying friends with someone who was prepared to take advantage of me like that

They were dishonest.

That’s why they are facing the consequences. TBH I would be furious about the rugby club thing too. You were subsidising them.

I would feel very let down OP. Yes they have every right to spend their money as they wish, however, as you say, all these years you could have stayed in nicer places which they could have chosen to be part of or not, had they been honest with you.

It's disingenuous of them and for that reason I'm not surprised the friendship is affected.