AIBU that our friends are much richer than they've let on?

[richmanpoorman]

Long and weird one, that has completely split a friend group.
18 years ago we attended antenatal classes and met a lovely group of people. Out of 8 couples in the class, 5 have stayed in the same location and we’ve all become super close. We see each other all the time in big and small groups and go on a holiday once a year. The children are all very close.

Now all our oldest are 18 they’re all looking at university. The kids were all out having a drink and the subject of funding came up. They’re all doing a combination of loans plus parental contribution except one lad who drunkenly admitted that his parents have a fund for him and his younger sister, for university and house deposits, of around £850k.

Under any other circumstances this would have been none of our business… except for the last 18 years they’ve pleaded poverty. As a group we are all in a relatively comfortable situation, with the exception of this couple who despite quite impressive sounding jobs were very open about struggling financially with a big mortgage etc. Therefore we’ve all been really careful. Every time we’ve gone out for we pick a budget option. Every holiday has been planned based on the fact that they could only pay half what others could afford so we’ve spent 18 years staying in some pretty grim self catering places. In context, say they paid £500 for their share of the accommodation- another £500 (or even £250) from each couple would have been a nice upgrade holiday wise.

It turns out that they made a decision to only live on one income, and to totally save and invest the other income. Apparently they have just therefore never factored it into consideration as it went straight into various investment accounts, so they were technically broke as it wasn’t then easily accessible. One year we all actually paid for her son to attend rugby camp as they didn’t have the cash. It wasn’t a lot of money (£20 a day) but the audacity feels huge.

3 of the couples have stopped speaking to them. (Tbh it might have landed better if the last holiday self catering place hadn’t had been so totally grim, with the younger daughter of one of the families injuring herself due to some shoddy maintenance….)

DH and I are more on the fence. While as a group we all earn roughly the same we do come from different backgrounds- DH and I a more modest teacher/ nurse/ bookkeeper/ florist combo compared to some of the others who did have significant financial help early on in life. This early financial help is clear in the lives they live- with similar earnings we have a much smaller house, state schools etc. Family help early on has made a massive difference to the lives of some in the group. The couple in question have explained that they both come from very impoverished backgrounds, with a lot of financial insecurity. Good degrees and careers landed them in a group of friends where it was obvious the impact money had early in life (eg house deposits, no loans etc). So they made the decision to do that for their children. They’re not materialistic themselves so didn’t miss skiing/ nice clothes/ smart cars/ home decor etc, so they just decided to “hack” their kids into a fantastic start in life.

Our other friends argue that the impact of another £1-2k a year on a few nicer holidays and dinners etc wouldn’t have materially impacted the fund, and would have meant that we could have had better group experiences, plus there’s all the intangible stuff like not suggesting we stop for coffees because it felt uncomfortable that they wouldn’t get anything, and being careful talking about other spending in case it seemed insensitive.

I’m so upset. We had such a lovely group with such a strong bond and now it’s all a mess. We’re the only couple still talking to everyone which in itself is causing problems. I’m posting here because we’ve just been added to a group called “Skiing 2025” with all of the group except this couple, which seems pointed (because we’ve never even suggested skiing before because of the cost.)

The kids are upset. The son is deeply depressed that he started this and they’re trying to stay friends separately.

I suppose my AIBU is “am I being unreasonable to be pissed off that my friends were richer than they let on?” and more broadly what would people do?

Ps- I’m aware some of them are on Mumsnet….

I wonder if they really lied or if it’s more that they said they couldn’t afford things and people read different meanings into it.
’Can’t afford’ is a very ambiguous phrase- it can cover anything along the continuum from ‘There is literally no way I can do this unless I sell a kidney or go to a loan shark’ to ‘if I did this I would have to not do something else I would quite like to do’.

I think this is a question for me. Because if i
am honest and say I have the money but I would rather spend £40 on a theatre ticket than £150 on a ticket for the same performance I just get nagged at and told to live a little or do it just this once.

I don’t want to get into a discussion with friends about financial priorities. So I just say I don’t have the budget and can’t afford it. Rather than I can afford it, I’d just rather not.

I agree with this. You all chose to limit your budgets presumably because you wanted to spend time with them.

Some people can’t afford to eat out because they chose to spend more at the supermarket or opt for a car on finance which means monthly outgoings when they could have bought a cheaper one outright. It’s a personal choice what income goes on but would you judge them just as much for saying they couldn’t afford something because of their choices about what their money goes on?

Because people get defensive like you are passing judgment on their spending habits. Not everyone, but enough that it’s not worth finding out the hard way.

@saltinesandcoffeecups I’ve not experienced this & why wouldn’t you want to find out if your friends are actually your friends?

They're real cheeky fuckers, but very clever. It just shows that you can never trust anyone. I do think the green eyed monster plays a part in your anger though.

@paintingvenice the you buy the cheaper option and meet them in the interval. Do not lie to your friends. It never ends well.

Oh god… your friend group confronted them? Honestly I’m starting to think more and more they did the right thing. You seem ok and rational about the whole situation (and yes I can understand your disappointment if you made decisions on incomplete facts) but the rest of them seem unhinged

The rugby camp is not acceptable. As for the rest of it, they told you their budget for the holiday. Their reasons for having that budget are up to them. If the group holidays weren't working for you as they were there was no reason to carry them on.

Look on the bright side- you have all spent less on holidays and meals out than you would otherwise have done so you have more to give your own DC for university.

Youv had 18 years of having entertainment on the cheap because you felt you needed to accomodate the ' poorer couple '
I think I would be angry too and I'd feel bloody embarrassed about all the times you've gone cheap to help them out.

So what do the couple in question say about it all.? Are they brazen about it ?

I think they might have not been capable of understanding the fuller picture of giving your kids a leg up either. It's not just about uni fees and house deposits. It's about giving your kids the opportunity to do well for themselves. Networking is why some kids do better faster after school/uni. And theirs has just exploded. Letting the kid(s) miss out on rugby etc will have an impact.

So they didn’t ask for the rugby money. One of the dads took it upon himself to go into the club/school and pay for the DS as well as his own son? That’s completely different actually.

When I was 15 my best friends dad really wanted their DD to go on a school skiing trip but we couldn’t afford it. She refused to go without me, so he paid for me to go too and told my mum afterwards.

This is sounding more and more like them getting ideas “above their allotted station.”

Feel for you, as I have a friend like this. She earns considerably more than me but chooses to put it all in Isa or savings that she can't touch (no kids). Without fail every month she asks to borrow money a week before her payday and totally guilts me into it as she's penniless (apart from the £1000s she saves).

Of course it's individual choice what you do with your money but when it affects others it isn't on. I'd be pissed off if I were you. Totally selfish of them to knowingly go along with crappy hotels, no coffees, pleading poverty. They should sit the holidays out or make it clear they are budgeting but that you shouldn't hold off doing what you and your other friends want to.

"Compromising for years without the correct information".
This is exactly how they feel.

Well that all depends on the circumstances. Did the frugal couple asked for the group to pay or did they say no, the kid can't go and the rest of the friends pressured the frugal couple to send the son to the camp and offered to pay? I would have probably said no anyway but I feel like the level of anger would be justified only if the frugal couple asked them to pay.

Smaller scale but my so called bestie pleaded poverty when she split from her dh. I subbed her lunches and coffees. Paid her car parking fees when we met up.. I was also a single dm with more dc than her and no family to help me. She had dps and an aunt... She rocked up on a personalised plate Mercedes convertible one day. What a fucking mug I felt. Friendship of 8 years dwindled after that for me. Haven't seen her. for 8 years now.

So you found out the rest about one income going in to investments from the wife of the impoverished couple? Because you only heard about the trust fund for dc from the son in a throwaway comment…

You need to be careful regarding their son. He could do something to himself due to depression, it isn’t his fault and it’s a tough age.

Tbh the couple did not do anything actually wrong. They choose their method and actually their dc will have something to show for it.

They should not have accepted the rugby payment, it is ultimate cf
However none of you should have offered to pay for their child anyway.

Your group wanted better holidays.
This is the problem with group hols I avoid them. Source of conflict.

Are you a tad jealous that they pulled off 850k for dc? It’s impressive. Maybe not having fancy things was worth it for them, and in the end your opinion is not really top on their list.

I get the whole wanting to help their dc but the vast majority can’t & don’t hand over 850k to their 18 yr olds.

Clearly not because they prioritise eating out and spending more on holidays.

I have a relative whose dh behaved like this. They lived in a freezing cold house, eating shit food, no holidays, everyone donated stuff to them - we paid for their meals out. When they got divorced she discovered how much he was actually paid and he’d put away hundreds of thousands. There was a sunny upside to this story, but what a miserable shit he was.

The afore mentioned mate had paid into a savings account for 18 years for her ds... He spent 6k in 10 months on nights out.. I hope she felt as pissed off as I did..

Blaming them for the burn is irrational they don’t own the holiday accommodation. It’s like blaming the rich family if someone has an accident skiiing. Bonkers!

To get a return of 850k in 18 years they are going to have been investing a minimum of 24k a year.

OPs update explains that one of the dads just paid for the “poorer” boy to go on the trip when he paid for his own DS. So actually they didn’t lie or do anything wrong at all as far as I can see.

Being really good friends for decades doesn’t entitle you to the details of other people’s financial situation. It’s not secrecy, it’s privacy.

@BMW6
I agree about accepting the payout for the rugby camp, that's not on, it should have been paid back or not accepted in the first place. But you don't need to tell anyone what your income is or how you spend it, that's your business. It depends on how they went about it though, was it a case of saying they can't afford it but happy for the group to go without them? Or as a group we can only do this?
I'm a single parent on one income, the majority of my friends are couples on 2 incomes and with much better paid jobs than I have but I wouldn't say we can only go to such and such because that's all I can afford, I chose whether to go or not depending on if I can afford it and they will and can go without me. And yes, some of my income goes directly into a savings pot that I don't touch for any reason. If people are only choosing friends on the basis of their income I think that's pretty shallow

Sounds like jealousy. They’ve been savvy and prioritised securing their kids futures. It’s totally up to them to have set a budget over the last 18 years and none of your business what they decided to spend their money on (or save). If you’re saving then you don’t factor that amount in to available funds. So if it was just that they set a lower budget for holidays, that’s fine and super weird that you’re now resentful it could have cost more ? Surely the important thing is time together - if you hadn’t fancied the group pick then you could have opted out.

the only thing that is a bit weird is them getting you all to pay for their kids camp. That’s shifty, but you said it didn’t cost much and a one off? In the scheme of a long friendship I’m amazed you are even remembering it tbh.

so I think your group seems nasty and petty and jealous. I hope you don’t exclude your friends but if you do decide to let this ruin a friendship then it wasn’t much of a relationship anyway.