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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think this is a vote winner (though not election clincher) from Sunak?

1000 replies

Lion400 · 12/02/2024 22:36

Thought this was an impressive and clear response to the question, from Rishi. I suppose Labour will likely win by a landslide, because many people don’t care enough about women’s rights. Because I do care very much about women’s rights, I may vote Conservative for the first time ever (cue outrage for Lion). Will I regret it? Possibly. But I’d regret voting for Labour (aka women’s rights removers), even more.

https://twitter.com/GBNEWS/status/1757143443111841900

https://twitter.com/GBNEWS/status/1757143443111841900

OP posts:
Thread gallery
37
Dogfisher · 13/02/2024 17:52

You care about the Tory Party. That's it.🤷‍♀️

Laughable.

BIossomtoes · 13/02/2024 17:52

Please stop shouting @lifeturnsonadime. Yes, you can care about more than one thing but anyone proposing to vote Tory doesn’t care about any of those women I listed.

NoMoreFalafelsForYou · 13/02/2024 17:53

@blossomtoes careful, you'll get accused of tone policing 😬

AdamRyan · 13/02/2024 17:53

I wish people put the same amount of effort into criticising the use of the word "reasonable" as written into our rape laws, as they do to the Labour Party using it about sex based spaces.
I know which of those two uses is harming women the most.....

lifeturnsonadime · 13/02/2024 17:53

BIossomtoes · 13/02/2024 17:52

Please stop shouting @lifeturnsonadime. Yes, you can care about more than one thing but anyone proposing to vote Tory doesn’t care about any of those women I listed.

Most of us are not proposing to vote Tory though.

We are asking Labour to do better.

I'm shouting because it makes me angry that Labour voters are apathetic on this issue. We can't change anything for the better for women if we let things slide because 'at least they're not Tory'.

Kalevala · 13/02/2024 17:55

Hipnotised · 12/02/2024 23:09

The source is important whether you agree or not.

Obviously if you're watching that channel you're unlikely to support Labour.

Edited

I've voted Labour for two decades, I get my news from a range of sources.

BIossomtoes · 13/02/2024 17:55

NoMoreFalafelsForYou · 13/02/2024 17:53

@blossomtoes careful, you'll get accused of tone policing 😬

Don’t care. I hate shouting in the internet almost as much as I hate it audibly. It’s entirely unnecessary.

literalviolence · 13/02/2024 17:56

BIossomtoes · 13/02/2024 17:32

Of course it’s clear. It’s a fuck sight clearer than anything the Tories have said - or, more to the point, done. You just choose not to believe them. At least be honest and stop gaslighting.

Starmer says women can have penises. That's also pretty clear.

AdamRyan · 13/02/2024 17:57

Dogfisher · 13/02/2024 17:17

So for those posters who are so sure that Labour will keep single sex spaces for biological women - what do you think that they will do about this individual?

https://twitter.com/IndiaWilloughby/status/1559530487680569344?lang=en

Edited

Errrrrr......provide better legal advice to service providers and organisations supporting women, so they can exclude India if they deem India's presence unreasonable? Exactly as they are proposing?

How do you think India can be prevented from using womens spaces? Have any parties got an answer?

Happygirl79 · 13/02/2024 17:58

KellyJonesLeatherTrousers · 12/02/2024 22:48

YABU for posting a link from GB news to support your argument. Frankly, if that’s where you choose to get your news from, I already know we will disagree.

Who watches GB news ? It's just a politically biased mouthpiece for the tories!

lifeturnsonadime · 13/02/2024 17:58

AdamRyan · 13/02/2024 17:57

Errrrrr......provide better legal advice to service providers and organisations supporting women, so they can exclude India if they deem India's presence unreasonable? Exactly as they are proposing?

How do you think India can be prevented from using womens spaces? Have any parties got an answer?

Amendments to the Equality Act could do it.

AdamRyan · 13/02/2024 17:59

literalviolence · 13/02/2024 17:56

Starmer says women can have penises. That's also pretty clear.

I believe some TW have had their penises removed. Do they become women?

EasternStandard · 13/02/2024 18:01

lifeturnsonadime · 13/02/2024 17:58

Amendments to the Equality Act could do it.

This is likely the only way

Unless someone wants to offer another, this is it

TooBigForMyBoots · 13/02/2024 18:01

literalviolence · 13/02/2024 17:56

Starmer says women can have penises. That's also pretty clear.

Sunak said women are whatever Boris Johnson says.
Boris Johnson refused to say that only women have a cervix.
Theresa May said anyone could be a woman if they felt like it.

The Tory position on this is very clear to me. They don't give a shit about women regardless.

BIossomtoes · 13/02/2024 18:02

literalviolence · 13/02/2024 17:56

Starmer says women can have penises. That's also pretty clear.

Has he said they’re biological women?

AdamRyan · 13/02/2024 18:07

lifeturnsonadime · 13/02/2024 17:58

Amendments to the Equality Act could do it.

How would amendments do it, in practice? Under the Tories, organisations haven't been using the existing act to protect women

ATerrorofLeftovers · 13/02/2024 18:12

lifeturnsonadime · 13/02/2024 17:52

But what part of this aren't you getting?

We are not all Tory bots.

Most of us are really want to vote Labour, want Labour to win the election and want Labour to commit to make the necessary amendments to the Equality Act to protect women.

Labour could really do this you know. Women's single sex spaces shouldn't be the price to pay for a Labour government. We need women to be angry with Labour about this to change things. Sitting back and saying 'well the Tories will be worse', is mind blowing to me. Women fought for the right to vote. We should fight for the right to be recognised as a sex class. We should be lobbying Labour Candidates and letting them know we won't accept this continued erosion of our rights.

Edited

Absolutely!

Why are so many so utterly craven about this? Labour are letting women down. Badly. Why let them get away with it??

Underthinker · 13/02/2024 18:13

EasternStandard · 13/02/2024 18:01

This is likely the only way

Unless someone wants to offer another, this is it

I don't know if this is a full viable alternative, but an idea that I think came up in the recent discussion on the upcoming legal action against a gym chain (David Lloyd maybe?) was that the key injustice was having a mixed sex changing room but labelling it female.
If a law was passed that said labelling of single sex services had to be transparent and clear, that might achieve a lot in some areas and be politically easier than rewriting the EA.
So a gym could have a policy allowing some bio males into women's changing room, but it wouldn't then be able to label the service as female only, which could make many businesses think twice about the popularity of such a policy with their customers.

User135644 · 13/02/2024 18:15

HRTQueen · 12/02/2024 23:20

I don’t think Labour dropping there 28 billion green investment pledge will damage them particularly so I don’t think Labour changing stance around what is a woman debate will either (though Starmers fuck up will be used against him)

these issues are not the most pressing issues for the majority

Certainly not the most pressing issue after the way the Tories have wrecked the place for the last 14 years.

Not to mention the whole Trans culture war has happened on their watch and they've not done anything about it.

lifeturnsonadime · 13/02/2024 18:17

AdamRyan · 13/02/2024 18:07

How would amendments do it, in practice? Under the Tories, organisations haven't been using the existing act to protect women

Are you saying that you don't think that laws can ever be amended to protect specific rights?

The fact that the laws were badly drafted and lobby groups have deliberately been misrepresenting them is not good reason not to amend laws to ensure that women are protected.

On the one hand you appear to be criticising Kemi Badenoch for not being 'quick enough' to make such amendments but now you are saying it's just too complicated !!

It will take careful drafting and working with organisations so that they understand that the Stonewall interpretation of laws don't continue. It won't happen over night but it is not insurmountable by any means. Labour really could do it you know.

You'd think they'd want to having seen the harms to women.

TooBigForMyBoots · 13/02/2024 18:18

AdamRyan · 13/02/2024 18:07

How would amendments do it, in practice? Under the Tories, organisations haven't been using the existing act to protect women

That's because Tories don't give a shit about women. Or children. At best they are lazy, negligent and uncaring.

At worst they have pursued a Men's Rights, rapist's charter since coming to power in 2010.

BIossomtoes · 13/02/2024 18:22

On the one hand you appear to be criticising Kemi Badenoch for not being 'quick enough' to make such amendments but now you are saying it's just too complicated !!

It’s got nothing to do with Badenock not being quick enough. The Tories have had 14 years to address your concerns and still haven’t even said they’re going to.

User135644 · 13/02/2024 18:24

ATerrorofLeftovers · 13/02/2024 00:28

Both parties are utterly, absolutely and outrageously SHIT on supporting women. The misogyny is rife in both, for different reasons. I'm an ex-Labour voter and would never vote Tory, but God am I absolutely fucking incandenscent at Starmer's repeated throwing of women under the bus.

How fucking DARE he.

The Tories - well I can believe they'd throw women under the bus, no surprises there. But Labour? What an abject betrayal.

And why are we putting up with it? We're 51% of the voters and no fucker represents us and every major party is blatantly and openly falling over themselves to take away our rights. Why is this still going on? Why have we not mobilised?

Why? Because a lot of the trans ideology comes from women.

Women are a majority of the electorate. If they were united on the issue then that would be the end of it, but they're split.

Kalevala · 13/02/2024 18:29

BIossomtoes · 13/02/2024 18:02

Has he said they’re biological women?

Are there inorganic women?

CrappySack · 13/02/2024 18:30

ATerrorofLeftovers · 13/02/2024 18:12

Absolutely!

Why are so many so utterly craven about this? Labour are letting women down. Badly. Why let them get away with it??

Because realistically for a lot of people it's a choice of the Tories or Labour.

There's no other realistic choice where I live. A vote for anyone other than Labour where I am, is a vote for the Tories.

I don't think Labour are perfect, but I believe women will be better with 7 years of Labour than another 7 of the Tories fucking women and children (and everyone else who isn't super rich) over left, right and centre.

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