To want to catch him in a clever way? Pls help

[badgergirl5]

I think I have just discovered evidence that my husband is having an affair. Please bear with me as I explain the background - I want to be smart about how I confront him and how I make my next move, because I know he will deny it. So I’ve come here to ask for advice and ideas on how to do this. A big part of me just wants to blurt everything out but I know this might be my only chance to know the truth.

This starts all the way back in 2005!! Our kids were babies at the time. I’d had a suspicious feeling that something wasn’t right for a few months so I looked at his phone and found outrageously flirty texts with a woman at work. They were trying to arrange meeting up for a drink and he had actually checked one of the dates with me and told me he’d be going out with a mate. The texts including descriptions of what she was wearing, how she had fancied him and blushed whenever he spoke to her etc etc. I confronted him and he apologised and acted sorry - said he was having a moment of madness, would cancel the evening out with her and break off all contact. But he didn’t let me see the messages he sent to her in order to do this (yes I know this was crazy of me not to insist!!!!).

Three years later I received anonymous text messages telling me he was cheating. I never understood where they came from. He said he had no idea and someone was just trying to cause trouble.

So that brings me to 2024. We have been happily married, at least on the surface, for the last 6 years since those text messages. I have always had an uneasy feeling that he’s a flirt and needs attention from other women but have never known whether he would actually cheat.
Today I was using our shared laptop and he had left his emails open. I don’t even know why given it was YEARS ago, but I searched for that girl’s name. I found 3 separate occasions of him sending presents to her - all the same name and address. Chocolates, clothes and a book (the book actually hurt the most - it was a book about hormones that I have actually read myself. From the date, it looks as though he heard my recommendation and decided to send her one). I find a book about hormones to be a particularly intimate thing to send to someone.

first of all, AIBU to suspect a full blown and potentially long term affair ? If he’s been seeing her, it can’t ever involve overnight stays. He is never away. But I guess he could meet her during the day. Is there any other explanation for still being in contact with her after so many years and sending presents?

I would love advice on how I can play this to be sure before I confront him. How much should I admit I’ve seen?

Well said 👏🏻

Yes. Why still all the focus on the two gifts he's admitted to (of 3 gifts he actually sent).

He's a walking cliche. I'm embarrassed for him.

And I'm so so angry on your behalf op. The manipulative faux lack of appetite and being super dad etc while STILL lying, and denying you the texts he's deleted is just horrid of him.

It's a blessing you have two properties and he can go to the other one.

I can feel your guilt regarding a split. Please know it is always always best for kids to have a mum that's happy and healthy than a mum that's torn in knots of anxiety and upset over a cheating knob head. You will be a lighter, happier, more peaceful person when you aren't living with this constant looming worry all the time. He has caused every bit of this. Not you. You've nothing to feel guilty about.

To add. I was massively worried about my eldest child when I split from their dad. I worried so much for how they'd cope with the split, the changes to their lives etc. and they were fine. Because they still had me and I was lighter and happier, and the atmosphere in the house was too. And this was an autistic child who came home from school to a different house with no furniture in it, no warning. They were fine!

I’m so sorry for my stupidly long winded post - what I basically meant was - his tearful breakdowns and begging is a result of being flipped over by you and dealing with the totally unforeseen and biggest insult he now has to contend with - REJECTION.

Any feelings of worthlessness, regret and uncertainty about the future he now has are fully deserved bc they are exactly what he has inflicted on you.

You are showing him the strongest version of yourself he has probably ever witnessed. He probably finds it attractive as he does intimidating. And he’s noticed it too late. What a fool.

@Sceptical123 I don't think your post was long winded at all. I think it perfectly described everything! As did your update.
OP - I think you've been incredibly strong and I'm wishing you the very best of luck - it sounds like your children have and will remain your top priority, but make sure you take some time for you as well xx

Stay strong OP!!

He really takes the cake. His manipulative tactics have run the gamut from ignoring, blocking you, deleting messages, feigning cluelessness, elaborate lies, crocodile tears, and downplaying his infidelity as ‘showing off’ … to his current stonewalling and refusing to restore the damning messages.

He is clearly desperate to hide the extent of his cheating, and believes that you are not entitled to know what is happening in your own life and marriage. His priority is protecting his affair/affair partner and their secrets, while you are to be subjugated and kept in the dark. Prioritizing your marriage and your dignity would look entirely different. He would be an open book and totally transparent — and that includes restoring the messages.

I noted that during both episodes of infidelity with this OW, he spewed the same lines at you: she had breakdowns/hospitalizations, he felt bad for her [KISA], he was ‘stupid’ and was ‘so sorry.’ Rinse and repeat, and making an absolute mockery of his NC agreement that he made for your healing.

@badgergirl5, you may discover that OW has indeed had hospitalizations. Even if true, your H has trashed your marriage, pulled her close, and invested in an EA or EA/PA with her. This is not a platonic relationship. His subterfuge speaks volumes and the unrestored messages tell the sordid tale.

He has heretofore arrogantly believed that he had the upper hand, but now his double life is collapsing in a heap around him. Kudos for being so definitive regarding what you expect and what you refuse to tolerate.

Admiring your strength and resolve from afar OP and very sorry you are going through this. I’d hoped the outcome would be different but he sounds like an insecure person who needs extra validation and hasn’t worked out that actually being faithful is what gives you stability and security, not messing around with someone behind your back and two timing.

Why do men do it? What flattery do their egos need?? It’s pathetic!

Thank you everyone for your messages of support and advice, which have helped me so much while I haven’t spoken to anyone in real life.

I have sent a long email to him today and told him to read it tonight after work. I’ve essentially given him three options (which I haven’t numbered by the way! But I’m summarising below):

1. That he agrees to show me everything (if he can indeed prove it wasn’t an affair) AND he agrees to go to counselling to work out why he has repeatedly acted this way over the years. I’ve said there’s no guarantee I can forgive or trust him again, but that he will need to do these two things if he even wants to try.
2. if he refuses to do the things above, we divorce.
3. this one is hard to explain on here. We have a very nice lifestyle at the moment with two very happy, thriving children. I have also suggested - given that we have two properties - that we continue to be married “on paper” for the next 5-8 years while the children are still at home, but that we try to work out how to move forward with our lives at the same time. It would involve a lot of time for him in our other property - I guess we could tell the kids that he is working away a lot. Then, when they are much older and have adjusted to less family time, we tell them a much softer message that we have simply grown apart. Obviously this comes with risks but I can’t even describe to people how scared and sick I am about telling our children we are divorcing. For me, I feel that this might be another way - a totally crazy and admittedly very sad option - but not as bad as throwing our kids into turmoil as they enter their teenage years.

So that’s the position I have got to.

I think having him live there and telling the kids he's working way is the worst option. It's prolonging the inevitable and is treating the children as if they are too stupid to realise. It also doesn't give the children the chance to have a routine of seeing their father and as it will be a sudden big change I think it is unfair to them.

To me, option 3 would need a lot more hammering out. Would you both be free to have relationships with other people? I think it would be prolonging the inevitable.

I think you would be very surprised to find just how well you manage if you have a clean permanent break, with proper measures in place for finances and the children.

I have actually said to him that option 3 needs a lot of consideration/ detailed discussion etc plus a trial period.

And honestly, he could come every single weekend and see the kids. I will never be difficult like that. They do SO much every evening that they’re barely at home on week nights anyway.

sorry you are going through this.
Two thoughts; If he admits to an emotional affair he still may not want to show you the messages as they may be hurtful or possibly sexual. If you decide to try to work through it with him with a therapist it may be in your interests long term not to see the messages that were sent in the heat do the moment.
Option three runs the risk of the second property becoming a shag pad for him and you doing all the child care, cleaning cooking etc and growing more and more resentful and unhappy.

Yup. And then any new girlfriend he has gets insecure about him spending the weekend at your house so that stops and you have to tell the kids you're divorcing anyway.

With respect, OP, I can see your situation is gut-wrenching, option 3 isn't really standing up for yourself.

Perhaps what I need to explain is that option 3 doesn’t fill me with dread. I have lots of friends and could really find a way to enjoy myself. Putting my kids first will make me happier than seeing them go through pain. Honestly I think it could work. And fine - he could develop a proper relationship with someone else but so could I.

Kindly- fuck option 3. This only benefits him and the kids will be confused because they will know something is wrong but no one will be telling them the truth. All of you need a clean break.

My ex grew up in a household like option 3 and his view of what a healthy relationship is is screwed beyond words.

You've been really great and strong up to this point OP. Good luck and keep going

also, I strongly feel that none of us can say what’s worse for kids. @tralalalalalalalal you say your ex has an unhealthy idea of relationships, but what if divorce had destroyed him? A friend of mine saw his parents divorce when he was 14 and he spent his teenage years depressed.

The sad fact is there are no good options here but option 3 is another possibility and one that needs a lot of thought.

Also - perhaps option 3 doesn’t work out but it lasts for say 6 months. At least we have both had 6 months to adjust and to reach a point where we can tell the children in the best way possible. Option 3 might indeed delay the inevitable, but that process could still be helpful.

Option 3 is only going to be good for him OP. You'll end up doing the lion's share of everything and ultimately resent him (even more) You describe it as though you'll be there Mon-Fri doing all the ferrying around and homework and school morning breakfasts etc etc - all the drudge basically - and that you'll get your weekends free because your H will turn up and do his perfect father routine. I doubt this will happen. He'll make plans and you'll end up being the parent every day of the week.

Also, children aren't stupid they pick up on things and work things out themselves. They'll know something is wrong. You need to put your happiness and peace of mind first now. A clean break, put something formal in place for custody and move forwards. Option 3 is stalemate, or worse.

The reality of Option 3 is that you drift back into a situation where you are vulnerable to him again.

He gets the best of both worlds and you are not giving yourself any distance to get over the romantic side of your relationship.

Rip the plaster off. The kids will be fine. It will be harder initially, but Option 3 is drawn out misery for you.

It sounds like you have almost made your decision OP - option 3., which is essentially a trial separation. A lot of couples do this before committing to a divorce and if it is easier for you to process the situation, even if it only lasts a few weeks/couple of months, you will have known you gave it a last shot at keeping the children as stable as possible before calling it a day and getting the lawyers in.

Some would say it is delaying the inevitable, perhaps it is, but you can’t predict what your husband will be like - it might be the wake up call he has needed. You obviously don’t want to hurt your children and if this in your view is a gentler way of preparing them for permanent separation it is quite understandable why you would want to do this.

Are you thinking that he will spend the weekends at your 2nd property and a couple of days a week at your home, or exclusively at the other place? The difficulty with the former I guess would be sleeping arrangements.

Be prepared for you husband to Opt for any of these options though. He may not want to try 3 and want a clean break to get it over with or even to prove a point.

I hope you are able to discuss this together calmly so you can come up with a solution that is the best outcome for your children, you know them best. Good luck x

Please believe me that it wouldn’t mean drudgery. He works and I have my own part time business (from home) which is very flexible. There is no drudgery in my life and I have lots of help with housework. I’m very happy being the one who does the school runs (I already do all of it because he works long hours and leaves the house at 5am). If anything, he resents me because of the freedom I’ve always had that he doesn’t have. He could stay in the other place 3-4 nights a week and it wouldn’t result in a change in my “jobs” or responsibilities.
At the moment this is a moot point as I don’t know what he will say. But please don’t imagine that option 3 is akin to me saying “you go off and have fun while I do everything at home.”