To have told my late teens that I won't be contributing

[itspurplestripes]

.. to their childcare arrangements , if and when they have kids. They were really surprised!
Lone parent here, working full time and intend to retire in about ten years. Ie I'll be relatively young.
It was a light conversation but they fully thought that I would be a part of their childcare set up in time.
I will f course be supportive and help
Out when needed and look forward to

Spending time with my grandkids but travel and renewing relationships and rest are certainly at the top of my list !
AIBU. Or is this the norm/ expectation now?

I think GP should be there for back up, emergency picks ups and sick days. I think pushing them into regular days isn’t really on.

I know someone who complained for years how awful her PIL were as parents and how badly they raised her DH but then uses them as free full time childcare as she didn’t want to pay.

I have a neighbour who is about to turn 80. For the last 15 years she has driven 90 minutes each way to care for her 4 GC. Not full time but multiple days a week. She did want to do it, however as far as her son was concerned she didn’t have a choice, she ‘owes him’. There was a massive row when she had an operation and she needed time off, he basically wouldn’t accept it. The thing is when she has been down she looks totally fucked, she will often spend the whole of the next day in bed to recover. She makes no plans in case she is needed in an emergency, he’s called her in the middle of the night to take over a sick child before. She’s basically unpaid staff.

Good for you, you've done your child raising!

So many grandparents end up being childcare and NOT grandparents.

If you can't afford childcare then don't have children 🤷‍♀️

I didn't 'expect' my mum to do it, but she wanted to. I'm really lucky and grateful that my Mum wanted to help look after her grandkids. I hope I get to help with mine (if I have them) in the future. My mum has my kids twice a week and the other 5 she enjoys her retirement. She still goes on holiday for two weeks at a time and I support that and find alternative childcare. She's worked hard to not do whatever she likes with retirement, but I'm so grateful and lucky that she wants to help me with my children.

If I’m able to and lucky enough to have grandchildren then of course I will help my children with childcare, the same way my mum did with mine and my nan did with us. The same way as my 72yo mum cares and looks after my 92yo nan and I care and help my mum (& nan) and hope my children will care and help me when I’m older x

Yes this is true. It overlaps with the thread the other day about women being involuntarily childless

maybe more of them would have given it a go earlier in a variety of circumstances if they knew they would have the support of their parents.

and support doesn’t have to mean doing ALL the childcare.

ive thought about this a lot and I plan to make it clear to my daughter that I will help her however I can.

i want her to feel empowered and supported to have children if she wants them, how and when she wants them.

its not my only goal in life and I look forward to having periods in between the hands on mothering my own children to fulfill other dreams before helping out with my grandchildren.

hut I can honestly think of nothing better than spending time with them in my later years.

It's always the grandmother who is expected to suck it up and do the childcare, isn't it?

I know that some posters have skirted around this by saying that it's maybe one-day-a week and that would make such a difference in costs to the parents but it really isn't. That one day a week, to a financially struggling mother (another woman, notice the trend) is going to be a drop in the ocean.

What is meant and understood is that grandmothers need to be available to take on the care of their grandchildren full stop. That covers emergencies and any other occasion that childcare is needed. Because a financially struggling mother has no other options.

Yes, there are grandparents who manage just fine but many are still working and many are ill - if not now then at any point in the future - and a parent struggling for money will apply pressure due to circumstances, whether they mean to or not. Their own situation is untenable without grandparent (grandmother) childcare, so what to do? Women are being pressurised from all sides and it's just wrong.

The government is concerned that fewer babies are being born? Good. They can do something about it. They have the budget and the mandate. If grandmothers weren't always 'first port of call' and somehow made available, government would be forced to address this.

Impact is always on women. Always.

I understand why they’d assume that you’d be up for this kind of arrangement if that’s what “everyone” around them seems to be doing.

and it is great that you were honest and told them that you wouldn’t be up for it!
I do think it’s important to phrase it in a way that doesn’t sound harsh and or uncaring and it sounds as if you managed to pull that off.

@LyingWitchInTheWardrobe one day of pre-school care could save a couple £400 per month

Your fortunate if you can call £400 a month a drop in the ocean. That's the family food bill.

And it is great that you feel that way. I hope you’ll have grandchildren and the chance to have a wonderful relationship with them.

but not everyone wants the same things you do. Many people may want to have a good grandparent-grandchild relationship and still don’t want to have a major caring responsibility. And that is great as well.

what isn’t great is people expecting this - unpaid labour - of grandmothers. And penalising them for not being enthusiastic or willing to perform this unpaid care work.

Especially because men aren’t burdened with these expectations and therefore aren’t penalised for not meeting them!

and I can’t help but notice that you’re not mentioning fathers, grandfathers or any other men.

You have really misunderstood what I said. I'm saying that - to a financially struggling mother - one day a week is a drop in the ocean because they are most likely having to work. Work is 5+ days per week. A grandmother only able to offer 1 day per week is still leaving a gap of 4+ days per week of childcare necessity.

To solve this:
Grandmother, if physically able and not working herself must do more than 1 day per week, ideally must cover whatever time her daughter/daughter in law is not available to look after her child(ren). Knowing that if she does not, daughter/daughter in law will not be able to work. That is no choice..

Financially struggling mother required to work... has no option but to call on grandmother to cover the WHOLE period.

Pressure point is single financially struggling mother coupled with only ONE grandmother 'available', as in no longer in employment but struggling herself due to illness or incapacity.

That is what is happening in reality. I'm not talking of the parents who could afford childcare but either grandparent or both wants to look after the child(ren).

There is why there is intolerable pressure on women - and only on women - and the government, not grandmothers, needs to fix this.

unfortunately 2/4 parents died before we had kids but we would have never asked or relied on them. We have 1 left and she is happy to help in school holidays etc but we would never assume a permanent arrangement . When you decide to have kids you need to accept and be prepared for the cost of childcare, if you choose to be working parents. It's a bit like people that have kids then take them out of school for cheaper holidays . Don't start me on that one!!

One difference from years ago is that people are becoming grandparents at later ages. Once upon a time it was not unusual for a woman to become a grandmother in her 40s; now women are having babies in their 40s. Becoming a grandmother in your late 60s-70s is quite different from becoming one in your 40s and 50s. People do slow down and develop health problems as they age, so comparing today to times past is misleading.

OK but one or two days is still a massive help.

Parents might also do their sums and realise that the way tax works they might be better off being part-time for a bit. And getting state top-ups.

All helps appreciated. I think that's what pissed me off when I was told they wouldn't be doing childcare - I was never going to ask them to to more than a day.

there’s also a big difference regarding the participation of women in the work force.

a “younger” grandmother may very well want (or need) to prioritise her own career and earning potential.
that hasn’t always been the case either…

I don’t think you’re unreasonable at all.

Ive got 2 children 1 & 6 years. Both sets of grandparents live locally. I see my children as my responsibility and arranged my childcare to fit my work pattern. I need reliability and if I want to see my mum at the weekend I want her to think “oh great” not “oh no I am exhausted by these grandchildren all week and now I’m not getting a break at the weekend”.

In-laws will do emergencies only and my mum likes to do a a few days in school hols, which is appreciated but not expected as there is playscheme the rest of the time.

Your children know where they stand and you are all happy. I don’t know why they are surprised. I’m 42 and I know I went to childminders and nursery whilst my mum worked so surely yours remember!

Makes sense to me, though I hope you’ll also vote for governments which promise to invest in free childcare.

I told DD too

But if the grandmother is 'forced' into it because 'it's still a massive help' that is exactly the point. They are coerced through love and that's not fair either. Not for the grandmother nor for the daughter/daughter in law under pressure and applying that pressure to the grandmother.

Your circumstances, Outthedoor24 might be different. You may not be a single mother and you might have other options available to you. I'm really not talking of your situation if that is the case.

The reason why grandmothers are saying that they won't be providing childcare (not the same as occasional babysitting and emergencies) is because they can see the writing on the wall, that families are struggling and they know that they will be called upon to do childcare. That is not fair. Grandmother is a special relationship, it's not an opportunity for loco in parentis and nor should it be.

Telling your children - in advance - that childcare is not an option for you/them but that you'll be delighted to help with babysitting/emergencies (which is massive in itself, just ask the mothers who don't have this facility), is enough reassurance and far better before daughter/daughter in law becomes pregnant and realises the stress of the need for childcare because she has to work.

This is something that the government should be sorting out - more childcare vouchers, much more tax relief, free childcare places for x amount of years.... any number of remedies are available to the government thickwits. They just don't want to. They expect grandmothers to pick up the mantel and do it.

My parents always said no childcare too. Fine, I thought. Perfectly reasonable to not want to do routine childcare, it's a big commitment. I didn't take them literally enough. They meant none at all. Ever.
I do hope you will be available on occasion OP. Not only as a help for your kids, but it's a really valuable experience for the grandkids too.

Also, look at the 'bossy MIL' threads here, many of these centre on the fact that MIL or Mum has stepped in to do childcare and as such, parents the child(ren) whilst their parent is not available.

When people say, 'it takes a village', they mean for childcare, not the actual meaning of it which is to guide/chide children into behaviour fitting them for society.

The origin of that saying actually refers to both guidance and childcare. Though of course there is a limit to the amount a guidance "the village" can provide through the medium of birthday cards, so the care part is fairly important.

Wow @firethene ! they can only afford to have a child if another family member (not the parents, of course) agrees to look after their kid FOR FREE 2-3 days per week!! Then they either should a) retrain so they can both get better paid jobs and can then afford paid childcare or b) don't bother having kids!