Grandmother killed by 2 XL bullies

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Grandmother killed by 2 XL bullies whilst apparently separating fighting bully pups.

Longer jail sentences, minimum of 5 years for owners of dogs that kill people for not controlling them.

Aibu?

Poor things. It's brutal and looks like it has been done blindfolded, with a knife and fork.

However, I don't agree that enforcing ear-cropping legislation should have been focused on INSTEAD of XL specific controls.

How would that have done anything to protect the public from attacks (like the muzzle, lead, insurance registration intends to) and prevented continuation of the 'type' (like the neutering and ban on sales/rehoming)?

I don't think this is an either/or situation.

Yep thats what all owners of these sorts of dog say, until they are not.

What do you think the Staff Bull Terrier was originally breed for?

exactly, it’s the same old story. They always claim their dog has never attacked anyone after it mains or kills someone.

sure, some Staffies might be better natured than some cats but animals are massively unpredictable. And if a staffy snaps and attacks someone and if a cat snaps and does the same the consequences will be much different. Most teens and adults and even some primary school kids could overpower or at least fight off the latter, not so much the staffy.

The potential for danger including death is much greater with a staffy.

Once when I lived in London I saw a staffy in bus with some teens and decided I’d just wait for the next one. My issue is so many people bringing dogs in close proximity to others in crowded places and they’re asking for trouble.

Years later I actually was getting off a bus in and there was a man with a staffy. I didn’t even notice it initially so I didn’t do my usual which is to give them a wide berth. But it must have taken a dislike to me for whatever reason or was maybe just overwhelmed at all the people trooping off the bus but either way it lunged at me. Luckily I noticed just in time and side stepped it, at the same time the owner had saw what was happening and pulled it back so together we kept it away from me.

I wonder if that had been a young teenage girl or a drugged up young man or very frail old man ( all of whom I’ve seen with staffies) trying to hold it back what would the outcome have been?

Staffs are bloody wonderful dogs and generally pose non risk to anyone beyond possibly getting knocked over with exuberance when they’re puppies. They might look similar but they’re very different dogs.

Oh according to the bully sympathisers, it's all her fault for using a broom. Provocation, abuse, any dog could turn!

Bollocks. No normal breed of dog produces puppies that fight so viciously with littermates that they need splitting up. Any creature wants their genes to have the best chance of going forward, fighting your siblings will reduce the likelihood.

No normal breed of dog will kill a human just for holding a broom. If they were really, really traumatised they might snap then stop when you back off. Not keep going back for more, not multiple bites all over the body. Not even when they were feeling their most maternally protective, and if the pups were mobile enough to fight that would likely be over

Which dogs are most likely to do this? Ones selectively bred to fight. The end of the predatory cycle. Bite, shake, kill, dismember. Combined with "gameness" and a high pain threshold. Look all over the world and areas with levels of pitbulls have high levels of maulings. So let's breed them even bigger and stronger to make the perfect family pet. Call them Luna and put a rose crown on them. Become hysterical when society says they aren't happy with your crap choices and wants evidence that you are trying to be responsible. When in doubt blame chihuahuas, despite the painfully obvious fact that one good kick and they go flying, no-one dies.

The lengths some will go to blame victims. And absolutely every selfish decision these people make reduces the freedom and quality of life of all the responsible people.

Have you read the thread?

@ejsmith99 I don't think any poster on this thread has blamed the woman.

It would be victim blaming if I said it was the woman's own fault for listening to the idiot owner and attempting to separate puppies with a broom in front of their parents, but I didn't.

Male dogs might not be protective towards their pups but the female is, and if she goes to attack then it's no big surprise that he might join in, especially if they're bonded together.

It's an absolute tragedy, and the only one to blame is the idiot owner who sounds like he shouldn't own a goldfish never mind big, strong dogs with a predisposition to aggression.

They were originally bred for bull baiting then dog fighting. A couple of centuries of correct breeding has changed the breed. The kennel club recommends them as one of the best dogs for families.

These dogs never have cutie names either do they. Not a single fluffy or snuggle bunny or Daisy 😂

I actually think beauty might have been the softest name I’ve heard any of these called.

Male dogs might not be protective towards their pups but the female is, and if she goes to attack then it's no big surprise that he might join in, especially if they're bonded together.

Actually it is a huge surprise if two domestic dogs kill an adult visiting the home. It's hugely abnormal.

A different dog breed with puppies might growl or snap. Not maul to death.

Absolutely agree!

We've had four and they are the sweetest natured dogs you could imagine.

However after the last we decided not to get another because of the reaction of other people to them. Plus, if you are a staffie owner and there is a fight, it is automatically your dog which is the "aggressor" even if the other dog attacked yours and is larger and stronger. We got pig sick of people saying "Those dogs want putting down!" without any cause or provocation.

There is a massive cropped and docked Dobe I see on walks...he so say is a ''Rescue'' {I asked about his ears and tail..} but I doubt he is a rescue..he looks too young and fit and good conformation..very likely an import because owner wanted that look.

Natural eared, natural tailed Dobes are much better looking.

This government really aren't on the side of animals, otherwise they would ban the import of such mutilated animals..and aggressive types from overseas.

I've experienced SBTs both as an owner, dog trainer and known hundreds of them over the decades through a dog hobby I compete in. There are certainly some lovely ones but they're a very abused breed in that they always have and always will be used in breeding when it's done for all the wrong reasons.

On the whole I don't like them personally, they're a fighting breed and even if they are okay with humans, a lot of them are incredibly dog aggressive and these are the ones used most extensively in the breeding circles of the assholes who continue to breed dogs for fighting and other reasons. Not many animals come off well pitted against any SBT.

If you heard the Nicky Campbell radio show today (can't stand the bloke but that's immaterial), they were discussing the Dangerous dog issue. He had a retired plastic surgeon on the show who specialised in hand surgery. Pretty much all the cases of dog bite injury he dealt with were from SBTs.

Unpopular opinion but I wouldn't miss SBTs if they happened to disappear overnight. All these fighting breeds should be top of the list to go as they all get used to make some new fangled bullshit breed name that some wanker pulled out of a hat.

I cannot believe how many people think XL bullies are a breed. The government bought it hook, line and sinker. They should have been dealt with under the DDA 1991 act as Pitbull type but nope, buy the XL bully tripe, let the problem explode and then do something about it after multitudes of people and animals have already been killed by them.

For all those that spout that they should have a choice about what sort of dog they own, how do you feel about all the Americans who feel a strong right to be able to buy guns over the counter?

Well yes, because different breeds don't have the strength or ability to maul an adult human to death. XL's do.
Therefore when things go wrong, the results are catastrophic.
The poor woman was obviously just doing what the owner said but what they might have tolerated from him, isn't necessarily what they'd tolerate from another person.

"I cannot believe how many people think XL bullies are a breed. The government bought it hook, line and sinker. They should have been dealt with under the DDA 1991 act as Pitbull type but nope, buy the XL bully tripe, let the problem explode and then do something about it after multitudes of people and animals have already been killed by them."

Absolutely right on the nail.
It's bloody obvious that there are loads of illegal Pits about, and /pit crosses, this bumbling, half arsed government just doesn't give a damn.

Yet we cannot even arm ourselves to protect our children and pets against these aggressively bred dogs.

At least in America you can carry a useful weapon, and many are doing just that as the Pitbull problem over there is massive.

All we can legally carry is a can of compressed air that goes ''psssht'' like Caesar Milan on a bad day.

Do they?
The owner of this one imported him.

There aren't very many Dobes around these days, compared to the 1990's - but they are an active breed.

To give up on ones so young speaks volumes about the owners and how they clearly haven't researched the breed before buying one or their suitability to care for such a dog.
They are an athletic dog that need mental and physical 'work'.

''Ooh...he's getting strong and destructive and challenging!'' {Surprised Picachu face} let's take him to the Dog's Home..

Too many people get dogs that aren't capable of caring for properly in terms of exercise and training.

The Doberman who won Best Working Dog (and I wanted him to win Crufts!) is called Archie and I saw him being interviewed with his owner and “talking” to her and looking as the dog should look with uncropped ears and non docked tail. I saw a local man with the exact same dog just after Archie won his prize and complimented him on his dog (not Archie of course but a lookalike!). Stunning animal and lovely nature.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/tv/21648813/crufts-schedule-winners-list/amp/]

If are there are faults with breeds it’s because we’ve bred and interbred them to death. We didn’t breed our good pedigree Labrador bitch when I was a child as she had borderline hip dysplasia and we didn’t find a good enough stud dog to mate her with, but she did have 2 potentials. Also with my DB being chronically sick on and off as a child dealing with a pregnant bitch and then a nursing dam with puppies would’ve been a lot for my parents!

I think the big message here which comes across as it should be harder not only in this country but worldwide for dogs to own, breed, import and export, perform nasty operations on its ears/tails etc. It is too easy for anyone to do the latter currently. More regulation needed.

Someone sent me this photo earlier! I didn't realise XL Bullies were so BIG. They weigh up 11 stone too. Heavier than some grown adults!

Fucking hell.

Why would anyone have something like this in their house? May as well have a lion or a hippo.

They're absolutely huge. Four times the weight of my neighbour's fully grown male staffie.

Honestly before the ban, those dogs were worth nearly as much as some houses. It's a place we like to believe doesn't really exist in the uk. It isn't civilisation.

Yup.
One of these galumphed away from it's owner towards me and my dog and another I was walking for a friend {for free}.
I got my two on leads and got behind a gate, the XL's owner was screaming at it.

It crashed through the side of the gate and didn't know which of my two dogs to go for first {Probably this saved them}
They were terrified, pulling back hard on their leads to get away...so I released them.

My dog stayed close, the XL owner was worse than useless.

It had mine cornered in an angle of the field..

I grabbed at it's collar and it dragged me onto my coccyx immediately.. I got up and it was still trying to get my dog who was mercifully more agile, then the mutt lunged.. it's head was massive, as wide as my dog was long.

I grabbed the brute's collar with both hands and did not let go.

It dragged me down a flight of steps cut into the hillside, and I was bumping around on it's back, nose inches from it's murky body.

Then it stopped running...I think my weight {9.5 stones} cut it's airway a little dragging on the collar.

The owner appeared afraid of the dog.

I would not let go til owner had it on a lead.

This was before the lethal attacks on humans..

However, my little dog was unharmed.

The damage to my tendons and back I'm still dealing with. {Hospital treatment}

I was lucky it was ''Just'' dog aggressive, not {at that time} human aggressive.

The Dog warden collected my friend's dog who had bolted in terror.

A kindly street sweeper had caught the dog {I'd reported her missing at once}

My body was bruised all over.

Dog warden said had I not released the dogs, they'd have been likely not here now.

I'm used to horses...and I assure you, a Shire is easier to handle, as is a TB colt.

The low centre of gravity and sheer muscle mass of these XL's makes them ''Unstoppable''

The nightmares and fear I have had since {fear of my little dog being hurt} have really been bad.

Goodness knows the terror those attacked must have felt.

They are NOT pets.

Dog warden didn't charge me for return of friend's dog.. he was very understanding and kind.
He dropped her off at our house, which spared the kennelling fee.

Friend had years ago her children attacked by an *** Bull Terrier {redacted for confidentiality} that overturned the baby buggy, so she was very traumatised all over again.

{That dog was owned by a previously ''banned'' person {dog fighting}}

@oakleaffy, that is horrific