Grandmother killed by 2 XL bullies

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Grandmother killed by 2 XL bullies whilst apparently separating fighting bully pups.

Longer jail sentences, minimum of 5 years for owners of dogs that kill people for not controlling them.

Aibu?

I've had dogs all my long life, and have bred three litters of Scottie’s (dogs originally bred to kill vermin). Puppies play, they don't fight each other,so that they have to separated with a broom. If they are so aggressive at less than eight weeks old, that tells you all you need to know .

I agree. I have a dog, I’ve always had dogs, but this is highly reactive breed with a huge amount of strength and power. They shouldn’t exist, they are too dangerous.

Exactly - even if little dogs were as aggressive as these XLs, they can't do the damage.

In a previous thread a poster said (I'm paraphrasing) "If it was a fact that ALL fish were dangerous, and would attack you if they could, which would you rather swim with? A guppy or a great white?"

And this is the canine equivalent.

Not at all unreasonable.

XL bullies not evil. Nor are lions, crocodiles or bears. But nothing that big + powerful with a defensive / prey / attack drive has any place as a household pet...

Sadly I have to agree with your posts @Ravensky I don't like the idea of an eye for an eye (makes the world go blind and all that!) But you're right - this country needs much stiffer sentences for EVERYTHING, including people who breed aggressive dogs (basically train them to be aggressive.)

There is a whole generation of horrible, entitled-to, aggressive 'I will do what the fuck I like' arseholes in the UK now - in fact probably 2 generations and possibly a 3rd - who think they can do what they want and are constantly breaking the law.

TV documentaries feature them, like the police chase programmes, the nightmare tenants ones, and even the hospital/ambulance ones. Littered with ugly abusive, vile articles - many whom have never done a day's paid work in their life, and act like the world owes them a living. Shouting and spitting at the police and attacking paramedics, and causing fights and brawls outside clubs and pubs, and carrying weapons (knives and shivs etc.)

I'm in my mid-late 50s - and I was a child/youth in the 1970s and 1980s, and I NEVER remember behaviour like this, or people like this. I have no idea where it all went wrong, and when this type of person emerged.

This type of person is one of the reasons me and DH moved to a little rural village off the beaten track. 4 miles from a little town, with less than 400 people, no buses, no shops, no nothing, just a Church and a pub, and a village hall where they have social events for people. Oh and a little primary school that has 31 pupils - just 2 classes. And one nursery. So 9 kids in the nursery, 11 in class 1 (that has 5 to 8 year olds,) and 11 in class 2 that has 9 to 11 year olds.

There are another 20 or so 11-18 y.o. kids but they go to the Comprehensive school in town. The bus takes them and brings and back every school day. The kids here are hugely respectful and polite and pleasant. And there are ZERO people like 'that type' in my village.

It's like a breath of fresh air being here compared to the town we lived in before for some years. It was fine 25 years ago and earlier, when we were a lot younger, but since around the late 1990s, it has got quite rough in some parts. Lots of crime and violence in some parts of the town. Where we lived was OK, but was only half a mile from a 'rough area,' and a lot of break-ins and car thefts started to occur near us, and you never felt safe outside your own garden after dark/after 7pm...

You can hear a pin drop at night here, there's nothing but fields and woodlands for 4 miles, (and the canal and the river.) And I can walk for miles - even in the evening/in the dark, and feel perfectly safe!

!

Do you really think that a man like that is fit to raise a child?

He will bring his son iup in his own image - an anti-social thug. And in the meantime that child is likely to be frightened and brutalised every day of his life, even if he isn't physically beaten.

The bans do not work. People just move onto a different breed or type

Exactly, Vegetables, which is why the only realistic option may be seizure - with, as said earlier, measures in place to protect those doing the seizing

Come to think of it (and apologies for tangent) they could seize all the illegally ridden electric scooters while they're at it

Yes of course. Unfortunately where I live the police aren’t great. There was an emergency incident locally and it was 45 minutes until they turned up.
However I think gumtree should take some responsibility too.

According to a news report ive just seen some neighbours did try to enter the property with spades.

No one seems to understand the strength and power these dogs have, that on its own, is what makes them so dangerous. Now that Bullies are banned, people are starting to buy another type of dog that has a bigger psi than a lion bite! It's utterly bonkers to me that people are allowed to have animals like this. I think all dogs should be licenced, they should have to pass a set minimum of training too.

The owners or the dogs? (I'm fine with either/both)

Yep this. ^

Definitely both.

I too was oblivious to this until I had a run in with an XL Bully this summer and saw the aggression in it.
Dog warden {a very experienced person who loves dogs} was very anti the XL type..Warden said he doubted the govt would ban them
, But this was before the mauling to death by the poor man in Staffordshire.

Dog wardens are generally pretty dog savvy people...seeing the Warden be doubtful about this type made me look further into them.

Googling the 'Type' shows them to be completely different temperamentally to other types of dog.

English Staffies are generally ok

Do other breeds cannibalise each other?

The Pits that do the cannibalising aren't ''hungry'' there is ample dog food visible in the entire image.

Which I would be all for, but it absolutely won't stop backyard breeders any more than the current ban will.

I don't know the answer. I'd be up for a law being passed that meant all dogs needed to wear a muzzle in public tbh (and I'm a dog owner who has never felt the need to muzzle any of mine)

Locally to me yesterday, in the middle of a housing estate, 2 suspected XLs broke through a garden fence and attacked a woman and her dog. The dog was killed. The XL owners have had numerous complaints made about them, the police have done nothing and the owners yesterday fled with the 2 dogs after the attack. There's a litter of puppies in the mix also. This is very close to a school, it doesn't bear thinking about what would've happened had a child been attacked

Two spades are visible outside the house where the fatal mauling took place.

Living where I do, I have to agree unfortunately.

An increasing number of people who terrorise the society that they demand supports them.

But, we see it in all walks of life too, people demanding their rights and ignorance of their responsibility, some to a lesser extent some to a much greater one.

The middle class and well dressed spaniel owner who refuses to put it on a lead or have any control over it in public because it's 'friendly' and needs to run and explore is showing the same type of disregard for everyone else as the XL bully owner that refuses to muzzle or lead their dog in public. The potential concequences are of course different, but the mindset is very similar, only the well dressed and middle class spaniel owner can probably articulate themselves better in their justification of their still self absorbed behaviour.

That's horrific.
People in UK can't even arm themselves with firearms.

These XL's are a blight on society.

Which is why we need to go from a Banned list to an Allow list.

If we don't breeders will just create a new, even more dangerous and very large dog type.

@WorriedMumofTeen16 many schools do practice lockdown drills and one scenario they use is if a dog gets in the playground (as they don't want to frighten the children/parents with the idea of an armed person getting into the school). I always had visions of a slobbery lab ambling round the playground, but one of these XLs would be as dangerous as a stranger coming into the ground with a knife.

Where the hell have these XL Bully fuckers even come from anyway?! When I was a kid, (1970s/1980s) the scariest dogs were Alsatians! Yep Alsatians! And to a lesser extent Jack Russells who would snap at you and nip your ankles. Not all of them, but a few!

Then in the 1990s it was Rottweilers. A number of people were attacked by them and they got a bit of a bad name. Then it was Pitbulls in the noughties. Aggressive and snappy and dangerous and used by a certain type of person who would train them to FIGHT and be aggressive.

And it seems to have escalated in the 2010s and 2020s, to these dogs - as big as, and as fierce as a LION, that can kill GROWN MEN. (And women.) In my entire life I have never known anything like it. As I say, this never happened up to this century.

i just always wonder why certain dogs are even here tbh.

I got intrigued earlier and googled British dog breeds and most are terrier types with some exceptions obviously but I could see that at one time or another most would have actually served a purpose here. Ratting, sheep herding, sniffing, bringing back the birds from a hunt or even hunting the foxes or rabbits etc

but what purpose does say a husky have here in the U.K.? Or a malamute or a Akita or even a chihuahua (nippy n little assholes 😂) as to not discriminate on size. They all had jobs or purposes in their home countries surely but not really any use other than pure pet here.

People think that good owners and proper training can negate an animals instinct. It really can not, especially when it has its babies around. It's actually really conceited to think we can alter instincts of animals by how we own them. These have had instinct to fight bred into them. You don't change that by how you own them.

Which is why we need to go from a Banned list to an Allow list

That sounds a pretty good idea, jasflowers, but it's still not going to stop knuckledraggers acquiring the banned version; in fact to this kind of mindset it could make them even more desirable

Like so many I agree about what these blasted owners should/shouldn't be doing, but the issue seems to be what happens when (inevitably) they don't