Grandmother killed by 2 XL bullies

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Grandmother killed by 2 XL bullies whilst apparently separating fighting bully pups.

Longer jail sentences, minimum of 5 years for owners of dogs that kill people for not controlling them.

Aibu?

For someone to be willing to enter a home with not one, but multiple XL bullies? Already shows a certain level (or lack) of education sadly. All we can do is stay as far away as possible. The second we see a pitbull out and about my child goes on my husband's shoulders and we leave the area. Parents who willingly bring them into their home with children present need investigating frankly.

Yes I'm sure they have all sorts of reasons for keeping these specific dogs - from feeling a superior dog owner ('See! MY dog hasn't killed anyone I am clearly a dog whisperer and not just another vanilla, middle-class labradoodle owner!') to other complex psychological reasons ('I got bullied at school and I may be a middle aged accountant called Eric - but I'm still a tiger at heart! I have subdued the savage beast! Hear me roarrrr!').

I'm being facetious but the fact remains: their passions and inadequacies shouldn't be allowed to put others at risk. These dogs need to quietly disappear from the world.

I was going to say something similar.

This poor boy, his mum and now maternal grandmother is dead. He probably lives with his Dad, he will need to find a new home soon. His Dad seems highly irresponsible though so perhaps it’s for the best.

For someone to be willing to enter a home with not one, but multiple XL bullies? Already shows a certain level (or lack) of education sadly

It's a fair point, OpieMo
Nobody would blame poor grandma for wanting to see the grandkids, or for the fact she was attacked, but surely she could have seen them somewhere else?

And as you rightly said, that's apart from what they were doing in a house with children in the first place

Maybe they knew the dog and the family. Those "types" are often well known in the area. People wouldn't want to get involved.

I'd phone the police or something though, I wouldn't just go back inside and pretend it wasn't happening.

Whilst I behave much like you do if I see an unmuzzled XL in public, I'm not sure it's right to cast aspersions on the lady who died. She was there to see her grandson, who had a father who owned and bred XL. It's him I don't peg as very educated, and if I'm casting aspersions on anybody it's the many who breeds XL bullies and keeps them int he same home as his son - I could well believe that he said to the kid's grandmother - a woman who has no legal rights to access the grandson - that she can see her grandson at his home or not at all.

WWYD in those circumstances? I'm not sure I'd make the same choice if there was my grandson involved or not.

On the subject of not assuming things, how much says that dad will avoid a custodial sentence because "he has to be there to raise the poor lad" - especially considering that care places are severely stretched?

With the order to neuter them all or face having them seized and destroyed then technically the breed will die out over the next decade in the UK?

Not everyone who owns these dogs fits the stereotype being pedalled here. Plenty of people are happily complying with the laws.

Highly doubtful though I still see a good few red nose pitbulls about and they where meant to be banned in 1991! It’s shocking they will find a way around it! Bring back the dog license I say!

Personally, there is quite literally nothing that would entice me to enter into a home with an XL Bully present. Even if it meant being told I couldn't see my relative anywhere else. The risk is too great. Look at this tragic situation, she might have gone to see her grandson but he has ended up experiencing horrific trauma witnessing what happened. Now he doesn't even have his grandmother.

The pro-pitbull faction have a LOT to answer for, you just have to look and you see endless 'they're soft as anything, daft as a brush, more likely to lick you to death haha' nonsense. People who are less educated or less willing to do their own research can easily fall for it. Which is wild considering we have a survival instinct that should naturally recoil in the presence of these animals. I don't mean to sound like I'm blaming the dead, just saying, nobody should be complacent. Don't let family or friends gaslight you into agreeing to go and be in the same room as these animals. It's not worth losing your limbs, or your life.

It's a pity they didn't report these illegal puppies before someone was killed. Had the pups been taken away and euthanised (or at least confiscated so that he couldn't sell or otherwise dispose of them), and the owner prosecuted, this poor woman may still be alive, and that poor little boy wouldn't have had to witness his grandmother being slaughtered.

Exactly, it says something that they all went along with this . I’d be making a stand and refusing to engage with the dogs and asking for them to be locked away or meeting my relative outside away from the dog.

When a close friend got a pitbull type dog - I stopped visiting for several years which meant I couldn’t babysit anymore, but would still take her kids out on day trips. About 7 years the dog sadly attacked her middle child and she got rid of it anyway.

The fact they all continued to visit the house and interact with the dogs without reporting anything speaks volumes. I really hope there’s at least one sensible person in the family who can look after the boy.

Not to mention, people shouldn't have their lives dependent on whether a random stranger is a 'good owner' or not. There is no place in our society for that level of risk, for whether someone lives or dies while popping to the shops is reliant on how good the owner of that dog is. You will never eradicate bad owners, it isn't possible. I'd still like to survive, thanks.

This is so true. I don’t even engage in the bad owner vs bad breed debate because it’s pointless. If someone is attacked, it will be of no comfort to them that it’s the “owners fault”

I agree with the poster who said the government need to stand up to the dog lobby. So do businesses etc. i was in a brunch place and this dog couldn’t leave me alone. I couldn’t see the owner, think they must’ve been round the corner on a table out of my line of vision. So I had to ask the staff to get it away from me, but why all cafes & restaurants don’t insist dogs are kept on leashes is beyond me? Why is it ever acceptable to have a customers dog wandering around? I just left the cafe as I didn’t feel comfortable and left a review describing what’s happened. More businesses need to know not everyone - including dog owners - see dog friendly venues as a positive.

I think the ban on XL bullies will just lead to people getting a different potential savage beast that’s still legal. How about an Akita?

It should also be against the law to have one of these dogs if you have children or children visiting the house. If the owner had told the poor grandma to take a broom to the puppies if they started fighting, then he'd probably told his young son to do exactly the same thing. This whole set up was a ticking time bomb.

Golden retrievers (and golden cockers) at one time had a strain which tended to "rage syndrome" - the dogs would attack anything and anyone, out of the blue with no warning. (I don't know the cause - possibly a form of epilepsy?). However through careful breeding by responsible breeders this has been eliminated as a breed trait, though it can occasionally turn up in any badly-bred/ inbred animal. The border collie I mentioned in a previous post exhibited this, and was totally unaware of his surroundings during the episode, and often seemed confused and very meek when the (thankfully short - usually less than a minute) episode had passed. He was euthanised.

However I can't imagine that even the worst of them presents a tenth of the threat of the average XL bully.

Akitas are beautiful but unpredictable dogs - and very strong.

It would be nice if the man who killed someone when doing twice the speed limit got as much as five years - he got four and will probably be out in two. The widow and children have effectively got a life sentence. Sentences are pathetic all round.

The owner of this dog has one brain cell although he thinks he is is the dogs bollocks. Hard man that he is. How did I know he looked like that, already had a child, lived in a tiny house and then his tiny brain decided he would breed XL bullies and sell on.

BECAUSE HE IS ALLOWED TO!!! THE NEIGHBOURS MUST BE SICK OF HIM THROWING HIS WEIGHT AROUND THE NEIGHBOURHOOD.

Must judge at all though....

The ban guidelines are bullshit, the ban is ill thought out and rushed through.
ive lived through it being Rottweilers being the problem, then staffs, then pit bulls and now xl bullies.
the bans do not work. People just move onto a different breed or type.

the xl bully breed doesn’t exist, so you’ve loads of Heinz dogs caught up in it who happen to meet it. It’s always the same owners finding ways round it. They’ll find a way round this. We need decent breeding and owning regulation it would also stop things like the obscene frog / toad craze being common place.
that all said we can’t even stop people cropping ears in this country and that’s been banned for decades.

Owning any dog (or other dangerous animal) should be licensed.
By license I don't mean fill a form, pay some money and job done
I mean visits and assessments by animal experts to assess the environment and the fitness and mental health of the prospective owner.
Dog types (if any) should be given permission based on these assessments.

The license should also be removable with change in circumstances or complaints

Yeah my auntie worked as a vet many years ago and said red cockers where extremely susceptible to it suffered terribly with rage syndrome it was like a pandemic terrible! Exactly these dog bites are capable of deaf! I have a cocker and she’s a lovely beautiful dog who I can physically manage and handle! Why people even entertain getting ANY breed of dog the cannot over power themselves is beyond me!

Which side of the debate do you stand on, sususudio?

It was me that mentioned collies, I did so because they are a good example of innate breed characteristics/behaviours being expressed in pet line dogs. There are others (Jack Russell's digging, retrievers carrying things in their mouths, beagles and their difficulties with recall...). Why people can accept breed characteristics in some breeds but absolutely deny them in others baffles me.

In an ideal world, yes, but that would be so expensive and difficult to administer in the real world that it would pretty much be impossible.

Are "redness pitbulls" particularly aggressive? This is interesting. I've never heard about this, but I do know that aggressive traits in many breeds are often associated with particular colours.(eg golden cockers are more likely to be snappy than black, apricot poodles than other colours) etc, and there are also some colours which are more associated with trainability eg solid coloured cockers are reputedly easier to train and more biddable than the broken colours ones. (I say reputedly because I don't know if this is merely apocryphal, but I do know that most people I personally know who have working dogs prefer the solid colours.)

I don't think Akitas, much like Belgian malinois & Caucasian shepherds, will ever attain the same level of popularity, as if they are kept/managed inadequately they have no problem letting their handlers bloody well know about it.

They're a lot more niche & difficult to live with on a day to day basis, if they're bored they will destroy the house or bark incessantly, if they are handled poorly they will retaliate.

The reason bull breeds are popular is because they are comparatively easy dogs to live with & will put up with all manner of mismanagement by their owners.

I think it will be one of the other sizes od American bully (there are several), corsi or another bull breed or bull breed mix, like bull herders, that are the next 'thing'.

Sorry to ask but I've read artivle twice and still not sure.... the lady who died the dogs were her family members as her grandson was at house so sons daughters house?