A question to all those who think school refusal in schools is increasing due to lazy, enabling parents...

[Edsspecialsauce]

The question I always have is why?
Why would we choose this?
I hear all the time that it's all our fault, it's just parents letting them get away with murder. Enabling their behaviour etc
How come you get families where one sibling is fine in school and the other has to be dragged in screaming?
Why would I choose to spend my whole time in the playground begging?
Why would I choose to be on a final warning at work due to absence?
Why would I choose to be on antidepressants due being completely burnt out after five years of struggling?
I'm a single parent and my DC is disabled. I could probably get benefits and home ed, so why if I'm not bothered about her education am I dragging her through the school gates, crying (I'm often crying too)
Every day, five days a week, for years.

God if only I’d shown a bit more grit @Crystallizedring that would’ve cured their autism! Lightbulb!!

no accumulated trauma to see there!

I sort of agree but just wanted to comment as having gone through a long and severe eating disorder with my DD the therapy offered by CAMHS (and we are lucky where we live as there is a specialised eating disorder service (which is overrun)) is called family therapy. It's extremely traumatising and consists of your child being given a set very rigid eating plan, food prepared for them, no choice and being watched and encouraged strongly to eat it. If not eaten they have to have a meal replacement drink (ensure). If they miss a certain amount of meals they are brought into hospital and force-fed. They reckon they have a lot of success with this approach although to be honest it was hell on earth for us.

So whilst I understand eating disorders are about control, the experts don't seem to think taking away control/pressuring people to eat is the wrong approach.

Err they do with some . My dd is autistic and like many with ASC FBT did not only not work but made things worse. She is now being treated for PTSD.The psych and team eventually decided my dd needed to be in control and changed her treatment. She has made far more progress being in control, being given coping strategies and unpicking the ED. We are not alone and differences in approach seem to be coming more common.

I was a school frogmarcher during primary. She fell apart from year 7 onwards and developed anorexia.

Yes mine also has ASC with a PDA profile which is why FBT is not working and we also seem to have PTSD from it (I do even if she doesn't). They suggested she was autistic and said most of their patients were but if you don't do FBT they didn't seem to have any other options. She just decided one day she was going to eat as she didn't want to go anymore (so I guess it worked in that sense). Its not brilliant and its scary being on our own but seems to be less traumatic all round.

Are you getting confused? How is your daughter HE?

I didn't say her autism was cured. You know it can't be cured. I just said you can get them to school but it takes hard work. Why would there be trauma from doing what thousands of other children do daily? All children are different but mine would probably have suffered more trauma if I'd just let her stay home.

🙄

Err because they’re autistic? You may need to do more reading.

but joking aside, glad that worked for you @Crystallizedring and your child is going in.

I don’t agree. The education system works well for the vast majority of children. Many, many children are happy at school and thriving. For many children, school is their safe place and they find the holidays very difficult. I would certainly support reducing the content covered to a more manageable amount so that we can have a bit more fun in learning again (it was much better in the early 2000s when I started), but otherwise, it works well at a just about sustainable cost. We really don’t need to turn everything upside down to create a system that we don’t know will work (is there anywhere where state school systems are significantly different in setup - not curriculum but the actual principle of going in to school and being in a classroom with >25 other kids?) What is desperately needed is options for alternative settings/support to home Ed for the children it doesn’t suit and for these not to be seen as ‘undesirable’ or worse than mainstream. And, of course, better mental health advice and support from early years right through to teens. And definitely more support for parents who are supporting children with additional needs/mental health challenges/trauma/etc.

FWIW, OP, in your situation I would home educate if I could possibly afford it/make it work practically. It must be so hard for you all and you’ve clearly tried everything to make the current arrangement work, but it isn’t working and sometimes being ‘resilient’ or whatever they want to call it, is not pushing through the pain but knowing when to choose a totally different path. It’s not giving up, it’s a conscious choice to go a different route to the same ending. I know not everyone can do this and I would vote for any government that committed to increasing funding for alternative education settings. I’m afraid, as a teacher, I think the idea that we can modify the existing school environment to accommodate everyone (as the inclusion strategy pushed) is wishful thinking. Too many different needs, pulling in too many different directions. We can spend a fortune (not to mention pushing even more teachers away from the profession through increasing demands on time and unrealistic expectations) trying to fit square pegs in round holes, or we can make some square holes.

I got told by my son's high school that if I did drag him there and lay any hands on him would have to report to social. I don't think your comment helps. We did eventually get my son in a smaller supported school after 18 months of no attendance. He goes every day nearly now but does have to go in a taxi. Do worry when he leaves next year as only can stay until end year 13 when he will do as does not really go out of his comfort zone. Thinking of you all going through this.

I'm also a teacher with a child who has EBSA and I strongly disagree that the system works well for most children. The whole system is on its knees and I think most children struggle through without getting the attention they deserve.

@Crystallizedring

My dd managed to grit her teeth until sixth form. Then she burnout from
Masking and left sixth form by xmas

Your comment is ridiculous. Just because your Autistic child Could doesn't mean they all can and as a parent of a ND child I'd think you would
Know better to make such sweeping statements

I temped in a school for kids who had difficulty attending, mostly due to MH. It was the last stop before a CAHMS residential school/hospital.

I was only there for a few months but the distress it caused children and their parents was awful. Some would get as far as the car park then sit in the car for an hour before going home. Kid crying. Mum crying. Favourite teacher begging.

People who downplay school refusal haven’t seen it first hand.

@StormingNorman completely agree. I never thought my kids school receptionist would see me bawl, see me at absolute breaking point, see me calling work in tears again. We don't go through this out of laziness.

I think it's because 'school refusal' has become an official-sounding catch all term that's now so overused people roll their eyes at it.

I see people referring to school refusal in dc with SEN or significant, diagnosed MH conditions. The 'genuine' cases.

I also hear it from parents of teenagers with no diagnosed or suspected SEN/MH issues, where the 14 year old has decided school is not for them and refuses to go. The parent throws their arms in the air and says 'but he's taller than me, how can I MAKE him do ANYTHING he doesn't want to?'. So they don't try and the child doesn't go to school for much of the time. There are examples of this on this very thread.

Also heard of 'school refusal' from parents of 3 and 4 year olds not wanting to leave mummy at the classroom door. No, it's not the normal process many parents go through, it's (drumroll) SCHOOL REFUSAL so the child of course doesn't go every day.

The diluting and overuse of the term leads to the serious and genuine cases being overlooked and eye-rolled at imo. Much the same way as anxiety is nowadays...a serious condition but now you're just one of thousands who have 'anxiety'. Not normal nerves at the thought of a big presentation or uncomfortable conversation. No, 'anxiety'.

Apparently we shouldn’t use the term school refusal as it implies negative behaviour for the child struggling.

it now called EBSA. (Emotionally based school avoidance)

it is so much more than a child having a little wobble at the door and going in.

my 9 year olds fight or flight response kicks in, she runs away from any of the teachers because she thinks they’ll drag her in, which they have done albeit in a gentle way. (Bit contradictory but I just mean like they weren’t dragging her by her arm or anything, more holding her tightly so she couldn’t run off) Now I can barely get her near the door.

School phobia is real condition and it’s not taken into much consideration. It’s just black and white to the Education system. If an adult is struggling with their mental health they can get signed off but yet kids are expected to just get on with it.
However yes there are some kids who just don’t want to go for no particular reason. There is only so much a parent can do. If a bearly 6ft 15 year old refusing to go to school after his parents pleading reasoning ect ect giving them consequences what can they do put them in a pram and push them to school.

But how do I get a teenager, who is 8 inches taller than me, and sleeps in a high sleeper, out of bed without causing an injury?

Mind you, his is definitely EBSA not a behaviour issue.

But the thing is a huge proportion of school ‘refusers’ do have additional needs - even if they haven’t been diagnosed yet. Some estimate that over 90% are neurodivergent.

https://x.com/itsemilykaty/status/1744766063194112278?s=46&t=KGf2bR6ZQ1NW4-rZ_F3Isg

It doesn't make sense, does it? I'm sure there are some "lazy parents" but surely there always have been. The idea that the "lazy parents" have suddenly exploded in number out of nowhere doesn't make sense when there are a load of very clear things in schools which we know have declined slowly over decades and are all at a massively impairing point by now.

Lack of special school places/extremely poor handling of inclusion in mainstream

Teacher retention, teacher stress levels, teacher numbers, classes taught by supply teachers

Teenage mental health, smart phones, social media, post-pandemic effect.

Condition of school buildings, school funding and resources, class sizes etc.

Disruptive behaviour in the classroom

Move away from coursework/projects to more exam-focused teaching. More emphasis on academics for longer, fewer vocational study options

Lack of adequate provision for teen mental health/waiting lists for diagnosis and support through the roof (I've had people argue that this didn't exist in previous decades so the lack of it now shouldn't matter )

And lastly I think a shift from blaming the child - there was a time that truanting was largely ignored, and nobody would chase children who didn't bother to go to school or get exam certificates. It was just seen as well, they won't get a good job then. I don't think this was right BTW, but shifting from that to blaming the parents, or forcing the kids into school but not actually bothering to support them to do the things they would have opted out of in previous decades - how is that better? Of course it's not. I think at least some percentage of these children would have always existed but they are more visible now.

I'm a single parent and my DC is disabled. I could probably get benefits and home ed, so why if I'm not bothered about her education am I dragging her through the school gates, crying (I'm often crying too)

Not loving the implication that home ed is the choice of parents who are not bothered about their children's education.

But I do feel for you OP and no, I don't think that's why it's increasing. I think the system was always shafting quite a lot of kids and families and covid made them see their suffering as more optional. I also think a lot of supposedly "lazy" parents are adults suffering severe difficulties themselves. It's easy to say "it's not that hard to get your kids to school" but when you are really mentally ill everything is hard. (Not talking about OP here.)

Agree @BertieBotts moving in from blaming the kids to blaming the parents isn’t a vast change, it is in itself a lazy and inadequate policy ‘response’.

the standard of journalism on EBSA has been dire too - we need to get beyond stupid newspaper articles typically written by journalists with no experience of the situation talking to people with no first hand experience of the situation. I can’t count how many thoughtless articles the times has run on absenteeism, adhd, young people on disability benefits etc of late.