To think Labour should add ‘getting us back in the EU’ to their election manifesto

[bluewanda]

We had the referendum, we gave Brexit a go, and nearly 9 years on, I think it’s plain for most people to see that leaving the EU was a massive mistake. Even people I know who voted for Brexit admit that now they wished they hadn’t, given the shitshow that has unfolded since. So, why not nip it in the bud and get back in the EU ASAP? If Labour would add it to their election manifesto that would speed up the process, as we’d have a mandate by the end of this year. So why don’t they?

Its not Sunak per se, its the Tories, the Tories have had a few PMs and no polling shows a change of leader would boost their chances next GE, unless its a mythical one (Times polling)

The Labour charge of "Nothing has improved since 2010" hits home.

I ve asked it on here, no Tory supporter can point to anything that has improved.

Tories taunt Labour over SM/CU etc, as they'd love the next GE to be a re run of the 2019 "Get Brexit Done" election.

Its a trap Labour must avoid.

Plus Labour could still lose the next GE, its not over until its over, your premise OP is ill thought out.

It's been 4 years

The referendum result came in when my child was a baby and he’s now nearly eight.

Thats true, so plenty of time to start seeing the benefits? 4 years is almost a parliamentary term.

When we had the Ref Labour, as a party, did not campaign against it.

What makes you think they will do it now?

As per my OP really - the fact we’ve given Brexit a go and it hasn’t worked out. We can now categorically say that, whereas we couldn’t obviously back in 2016. Leavers have had a crack at the whip, it’s been a disaster, so now it’s time to cut our losses and get back in!

If Labour want to get extra funding then yes you’re right they’ll need something like SM not gimmick policies

But they lack the oomph

Although you’ll get loads of posters repeatedly linking to how much people regret Brexit apparently that all dissolves when it comes to votes. Why is that though?

I’m guessing OP meant since the Referendum but that was only 7.5 years ago so not sure what the 9 years refers to

What is to be gained from going back to the EU and what is lost for leaving? Genuinely interested as I don't know.

Sorry yes, my dodgy maths! But my point still stands, as 7.5 years is still a good chunk of time.

I think op the answer lies in a party who has been out of power for a long time and wants to play it safe as possible

It does mean we miss out on the chance of extra funding for another five or so years, if ever, but politicians will be more invested in getting in than changing it in any way, especially Starmer

This is sort of the problem though, isn't it? Why would they do anything radical if people are going to vote for them anyway? They could probably literally publish a blank a4 page as their manifesto and get away with it at this point.

I'm NOT going to vote for them partly because of this. Overall they're not saying anything positive to me so why should I vote for them? I'm not going to vote Conservative either but "all the same policies with different faces talking on the news" is grabbing me.

I get that, and I will obviously be voting Labour because the Tories are bloody awful. But I wish they’d be more radical and give me more to vote for, apart from being the least worst option.

Ruling out raising income tax on higher earners is another area where I’ve been disappointed by their stance. They sound more Tory than Labour on that front!

I feel the same, but I also recognise that the votes that they need to win are the votes of those who previously voted Tory or UKIP. Starmer et al know that too, and realise that a public commitment to rejoin and to tax the rich to the hilt won't win them those votes.

I hope that they're keeping their powder dry and that as a government they will be more radical, even if they have to do it by stealth. But then I hope that about every Labour government, and I'm generally disappointed. (For the sake of transparency, I'm a lifelong Labour voter and have been a member since 1971, apart from a few years sulk leave due to Blair's illegal war.)

Rejoining will take years, and we'd never get a deal as good as we got in 1972, so it would be very controversial. Closer alignment and decent trade agreements would be a good start, SM/CU would be even better, but it will need delicate handling.

Labour's traditionally safe seats are also many of the seats who voted to leave the EU.

They need to win back all of the voters they lost to "Get Brexit Done" and win over other traditional Tory/Lib Dem voters.

So they can't put returning to the EU in the manifesto, or higher tax for the wealthy as it alienates those at either end of your traditional political scale.

The Lib Dem's tried this, and it did not lead to more votes.

Rejoining the EU, and its associated costs won't solve the problems most people are worried about.

We're all stuffed anyway because there are hard decisions to be made in terms of the NHS and care homes that will require cross party support, and no one is willing to stick their necks out as it will be an election losing policy. See Theresa May's manifesto pledge on care homes.

@Whatisaflatwhite , so are you suggesting that when the people are allowed a say in decisions via a referendum, it should only be valid if , for arguments sake, 75% agree, that’s not how it works, the margin is irrelevant, it was a yes/ no question and like it or not the majority said yes, regardless of how close

@LakieLady whilst I am with you on hopes for something more radical, I don't think it will happen. It might have with Corbyn, but the way that all went down shows the general public don't trust 'radical'. We want change, we know it's needed, but when it comes to it, we are a bunch of frightened rabbits with a 'devil you know' attitude.

Blair got in because his Labour was Tory Lite. Starmer will do the same without the slick charisma. Too many people are frightened of 'going back to the 70s' whilst ignoring the fact that, what with strikes, etc, we already have in some ways.
As a nation, we are naturally conservative, not in the political sense, but in the sense that we don't welcome radical change, even if it's for the better. What we really want is for today to be the same as yesterday, but a bit less crap. Sad, but true.

They wouldn’t win an election on that. Lots of people don’t want to be in the EU. Lots of people don’t care either way or only have very mild feelings about it and lots of remainers wouldn’t want to rejoin now. If it was a vote winner both parties would be going for it.

It depends whether they think their target voters want back in - they won't gamble an election without some evidence of that.

I think we should rejoin and we will rejoin eventually, but not any time soon - it needs a new generation of people who were too young to be part of the referendum to be old enough to vote for it, so it can be adopted as a party strategy without anyone losing face.

Because we don't have proportional representation.

Any party has to look at where votes would go in every constituency. Labour have no doubt looked at the figures and found that even advocating joining the Single Market / a customs union would lose them voted in some / many constituencies where they have a chance of winning.

UK is doing fine outside the EU. There's no compelling reason to rejoin. Any problems can be fixed at the stroke of a bureaucrat's pen. So the real problem is political intransigence, not EU membership.

The political landscape in Europe is set to change dramatically this year. Wait a year or two and see if people really want to be a part of what Europe is about to become.

Most of the people who want to rejoin the EU are likely planning to vote Labour at the next election anyway, so there are probably aren't that many extra votes to be won by taking a strong stand on the issue.

And there is a risk that making Brexit a big issue again will give the Conservatives something to unite around.

Whilst it is the great mistake and those who misled should face legal consequences, I don't think it should be advocated yet. The 2030s will be a generation on, and therefore valid to ask then (also the same with a Scottish independence referendum).

And as others have said, don't want anything for the Tories to argue about that could gain them votes.

Would you vote Labour if they put in their manifesto "We commit to begin negotiations to re join the EU and as a first step will join the SM and CU asap"

What do you think the Tories and supporting media would do with this promise?

I was firmly remain. But hell no. What’s done is done. If we want to rejoin we will be screwed over.

They didn’t have the guts to provide an opposition during the original vote, there’s no way they’d do it now. There are enough idiots in the country that still agree with brexit despite the shot show that it obviously is, and Labour wants their votes.

I’m not sure if they’ve done the work but you may be right. If 70% or whatever regret it it may be the wrong voters no matter that it’s high in polling

My preference wouldn’t be rejoin atm but SM / CU as it is pretty much the only thing that will bump funding, all other policies suggested will do little