My DS is about to be permanently excluded- fairly urgent advice needed

[Bumblebee2324]

My DS (now 14) is about to be permanently excluded. AIBU to think this is a little OTT considering his circumstances? I have my hard hat on so feel free to be honest with me here.

My younger sister (34) took her life in a horrific and traumatic way last January 2023. She lived with us on and off for over 10 years. She was a free spirit who loved my children like her own and they adored her. She meant everything to them. She did school runs for me. Attended all important events. Was such a huge part of their lives.

My DS had a nearly perfect record until this point. Great attendance. He had the odd log for uniform infringements, lates, that sort of thing.

When his auntie died he spiralled into depression. He developed severed insomnia, panic attacks and lost all interest in just about every area of his life. His attendance dropped to just over 50%. He was there almost everyday but was just consistently late all the time because of his insomnia. He no longer cared about school, sports or anything he used to enjoy. He had always had trouble making friends, he was a bit awkward and was a bit overweight. Kids were cruel and he had never brought a friend home in all the time he was at this school. He only had friends online and never left the house, no matter how much we tried to encourage him to engage in a social life.

The school noticed a significant change in him and many meetings were had. Referrals were promised, including to CAMHS. Not only for his depression but also because he suddenly developed tics and other odd behaviours. I told his head of year in strict confidence that he has no friends. He bottles things up and doesn’t like to talk. She told him what I said anyway.

Around summertime he suddenly developed a friendship group. I was so happy! Until I found out they were two years younger than him and were apparently a group known to be trouble. The school’s words, not mine. He got into a fight which resulted in a three day exclusion, he was then excluded again for bunking a lesson and then excluded a third time for puffing on someone else’s vape which was caught on CCTV.

At this point we had been back and forth to the GP who could only prescribe antihistamines. We were told by the school that a referral had been done to CAMHS who would be able to give him melatonin.

After his last exclusion we were told he was no longer welcome at the school. Our options were a managed move or a PRU. Of course we went with the managed move to give him a fresh start at a mainstream school.

He seemed so happy. His attendance shot up to well over 90%. He missed 2 days due to D&V. His insomnia was still a problem. He was so tired all the time. His effort in class was described as ‘lethargic’. He had no interest in his school work. Depression, ADHD and ASD run in our family so his CAMHS referral was vital. I took him to the GP for the 5th time about his insomnia. She checked on the referral for us and told us there was no CAMHS referral. She called CAMHS to make sure. She did an urgent referral there and then and he has an appointment in March.

We had his 6 week managed move review last week and it was terminated. They couldn’t handle his ‘lethargic’ attitude. The other complaint was that he was wearing his coat in between lessons in the hallways. He had a few lates to lessons and the final nail in the coffin was that he was in the vicinity of a fight that he was not involved in. The school is HUGE and he was lost. Wrong place wrong time. I was told they expected 100% attendance and for him to be ‘squeaky clean’. Their words.

He was sent home with me immediately and will now be permanently excluded. Whilst the teachers said his attitude to learning was ‘lethargic’, they described him as a kind, polite and gentle boy. He is just so depressed and lost 😔 When we got home he had a severe panic attack and I had to hold him in my arms while he sobbed feeling unwanted and like a complete failure.

He doesn’t belong in a PRU. He is not that child. It will destroy him. He’s just not strong enough.

What can I do? What would you do? This doesn’t feel right. Our eldest has ADHD and ASD and life has been hell with him but he has an EHCP that protects him. He has been violent, destroyed school property, done awful things. But he is currently sitting with his bum in the butter because the LA is legally bound to do everything they can for him. My other DS does not have an EHCP. His dyslexia was not enough to apply apparently. His symptoms only escalated after the death of his beloved Auntie.

Any advice would be so appreciated. Thank you.

I haven't read everything but this makes my blood boil.

SCHOOL ARE WRONG.
IF HIS MANAGED MOVE HAD BROKEN DOWN HE IS AUTOMAT8CALLY RETURNED TO HIS PREVIOUS SCHOOL.

He remains on the original schools roll until the managed move is complete. To then seek to permanently exclude him is illegal off rolling.

My source: I'm a school govenor who has had to deal with a student this week who we have to expel and cannot have back (protecting other students and staff from extreme behaviour). We took advice as to whether a managed move - as parents wanted - was feasible and have had to block it as it could result in the kid being returned if (when) the placement breaks down.

I appreciate this is an incredibly rough time for you and your son. But think about what your son wants out of all this. Does he want to go back to the original school or would a different space be better for him now? Tbh neither of those schools sound great - and very stressful in their behaviour policies.

He's 14 so yr9 or yr10? I'd say yr10 is more important / challenging yr9 gives you more time depending on what he wants. I'd maybe step back and give him a break for the rest of this year and concentrate on the health and recovery for now and look for him to start again at the beginning of yr10 in Sept ideally in a new place if you can achieve that. If school genuinely don't want him back they should actually seek to facilitate thi.

Ask your gp for a referral to peadiatrics, ask them both for educational psychologist to do a review. Contact sendias for support. Call social services and ask them to step in, tell them your child is falling through the cracks, he needs an ehcp to get an education but he cannot get one because school are not doing the referral like they said. Contact the local mp if needed. Then when you get a review and it's rejected, you take it to the appeal panel. 90% of appeals are won by the parent. I had to fight like hell for 8 years to get my sons ehcp. Please don't see being expelled as a bad thing, sometimes it can escalape the process and get you the support quicker. My son was on exclusion after exclusion. He was one away from permanent when I managed to get him a one to one place to at a specialist school. Now his doing so much better. He was almost expelled once for threatening the head teacher,had they done so it would have got him the support faster. Don't give up you can do this.

Thanks for explaining @Bumblebee2324 . You had mentioned it, I'd forgotten that part (sorry, ADHD myself!) but a memory there was something, however you've gone in to much more detail here.

No, that reason is absolutely not justified for saying the managed move won't work.

When "she brought him out to the parking lot" was that before the end of school time? I'm presuming so. Did she say then they were terminating the managed move? If so, she absolutely should have put something in writing immediately.

As @WriterOfWrongs has said, you urgently need to request the paperwork.
Schools can (and do) terminate managed moved for extremely insignificant reasons, the young person is already At Risk of Exclusion and they are a school to school agreement, allowing the 'new school' to boot them back if they don't like what they see (sad but the harsh reality)

However... There is a paperwork trail which is held by the schools and the fair access team. Not handing your son goodbye that's it

Re. the suggestions of home ed. Home ed can be a wonderful thing, but in this case you must go into it with your eyes wide open that you are allowing the local authority to discharge any duty they have to provide your son with an education. Meaning that you fund it all yourself. Currently with no EHCP you wouldn't be able to access any funding to assist you as you will have taken on the responsibility for your son's education yourself. Yes, his mental health is vitally important but the local authority still HAVE to fund and provide for him at the current time. Parents often think that home ed keeps their child 'away from the PRU' without realising the full ramifications of their decisions. I deal with many cases where parents then want to place their child back in school a few weeks later and the schools can 'direct' them to have input from alternative provision first.

At this current time you need to know exactly what you're dealing with as should you decide home ed, the local authority won't supply any education at all at a time when you're already struggling with your own mental health and other family members needs.

The wait time for assessment for an EHCP at the moment is 20 weeks, in some local authority that's being breeched and is up to around 56 weeks, so whilst important that the right applications are made, won't resolve the situation you are in currently

The current school HAVE to take him back and they HAVE to make appropriate provision including all the letters you should have had. No letters mean that they are acting illegally and unlawfully.

Good advice from @Lightuptheroom

I’ve just re-read your first post @Bumblebee2324 and I have a Qs, which hopefully may help you realise how it should have worked, if it didn’t:

1.You said you were told the decision at the review meeting - was the LA and someone from the original school at the review meeting? They should have been.

2.Were you specifically told at the review meeting that your son was being sent to a PRU, or are you assuming that because the original choice given was a managed move or PRU?

3.Did anyone actually say he was being PEx’d, or that he couldn’t go back to the original school?

Also wanted to add that some schools try to quietly off-roll pupils (move them off their school roll to improve gcse results or improve attendance figures or move on children who are not coping in one way or another). Pressurising parents to deregister children is considered off-rolling and is unacceptable practice. Schools cannot simply off-roll pupils, they have a responsibility to meet pupils needs. Please be mindful that Ofsted and the LA disapprove of off-rolling and would want to know if schools were playing the system. LA’s often have inclusion staff who can support schools to meet their educational obligations, while ofsted would consider off-rolling failed leadership.

@WriterOfWrongs

1. I was told the decision at the meeting but they were going to let him finish until half term. They also toyed with us a bit because she said to me (not in front of him) that if he is absolutely perfect in the next two weeks they might let him stay for another 6 weeks and re-review. The deputy head from the other school was there but not the LA. The very next day the fight happened and she brought him out to me. No paperwork. Nothing. Sorry if this is drip feeding a little bit! If I gave the exact details he might be recognised on here. I don’t really care anymore now though given how much support I’ve received. I hope someone sees this.
2. We were specifically told at the meeting that my son would never step foot back into his old school. He will be going straight to the specifically named PRU. They told him he has no hope in hell of ever going back so he must get it out of his head. My son even said a few friends had told him he’d just go back to his old school and he was laughed at by the two teachers present.
3. Both deputy heads expressly said to both of us that a failed managed move automatically means a permanent exclusion.

@Lightuptheroom thank you for that fantastic advice 🙏 you are so right.

@WriterOfWrongs sorry, no, it wasn’t at the end of the school day. It was at around 1pm. He was told to get his things immediately and I received a phone call to collect him straight away.

First of all, I'm so sorry for your loss and that you are all now coping with tremendous grief.
Now to the plan- ring calms, he has an appointment, but say you will bring him even if someone cancels on the day . Shout from the rooftops about school not doing the promised referrals. Ring the Ed psych yourself- again there will be cancellations.
School- I would escalate this, stress that without support, the managed move was difficult. They have sabotaged his chances. Negotiate- in light of the above, what is their plan? Stress that you don't want thr pru. I would spell out what ypu want to happen. You may end up going to thr pru with a 6 week programme to go back to mainstream, but at least have this in writing.
At home, even whilst not at school, routine is key, up at the same time, eating properly. If you can build in a daily walk, this may help.
Look around for any support groups for him. It won't provide the counselling, but there is something really powerful in being with others who are also coping with loss.
I am furious for you that the system has let you down so badly and hope you get the help you all need.

Have you got all of the above in writing?

If so I'd appeal the PEX.

Just be factual.

X happened and you told Y would be out in place.

All these Ys have not been put in place and therefore DS didn't have a chance to succeed.

The MM school simply said he's lethargic and there was no reports of behaviour. In fact things improved.

Therefore you are appealing the PEX but will agree to a PT timetable (or something) until he has had the professionals involved.

Fwiw my ds did a managed move due to anxiety after a knife attack in his original school and although problematic (they refused him after 6 weeks but extended for another 6 weeks) I was able to say that he was struggling sue to anxiety and fear after severe bullying rather than not engaging because he didn't want to be there. Only difference is my ds wasn't at risk of PEX - I used the special circumstances rule to get him moved.

On your answers

1. unfortunately the LA don't have to be at managed move reviews. As I've said, they are school to school agreements to be managed by the school. However IF it was arranged as an alternative to PEX there would have been heavy monitoring. That's terrible management by both schools. The aim is for your son to be successful, not have carrots dangled in front of him! They are presumably using the 'by association' rule regarding the fight.

2. The managed move review meeting? Or a different meeting? Sorry, trying to have it clear in my mind what's gone on. There's no such thing as 'never' unless they have had the Governors Disciplinary Committee, given you the right of appeal to an Independent Review Panel, had the Pex upheld at the GDC in the first place, the list goes on. Have you had a GDC (it's a very formal meeting, not just something you're asked to pop and see the head about) Even after the school has done all of that and IF the decision is upheld, you have the right to apply for another school or even a few different schools. That is your right

3. The deputy heads are on very dangerous grounds if they have done everything I've said in 2. They have to produce a pack of evidence for a GDC which you have to be sent. You would be invited to make a representation on your son's behalf (by letter or email if you can't cope with in person) you are entitled to have another person with you. There has to be a representative from the local authority there. I'm absolutely fuming for you. Have they followed the process I've set out above or not?

Ring the LA today. Give your son's name, date of birth, old school etc to the Fair Access team. Ask to speak to the Fair Access manager. Highlight (if I'm right) that there has been no GDC and the school have not followed statutory process. Without this process the PRU can't accept him anyway so they are talking nonsense.

They are trying to illegally off roll him. It's not allowed. It's illegal. Start shouting if you have to. The Local Authority are your allies, get them involved immediately.. the only time my advice would change is if you've actually had a GDC and they have upheld the exclusion, but as you don't seem to be saying this. The Fair Access team are the team you need. Follow up all phone conversations with emails.. 'thank you for talking to me on X date. We discussed xyz' that sort of format.

Please don't worry about being recognised .. literally hundreds of young people are PEX every day. Hence why there's such a strict process around it! Unlike managed moves etc where each school can almost make it up as they go along , PEX are govenernance.

If anything I've said doesn't make sense, please ask.

Thanks for answering OP. Sounds rough for you and your son and v bad (unlawful) practice.

Sorry I didn’t make it clear @Bumblebee2324 @Lightuptheroom , I meant the original school should have been at the review meeting, not the LA too. I was just asking if the LA were there. They should have been informed of the managed move at the very least, and if they were at the original managed move meeting then they should (ideally) be invited to the review meeting.

The managed move should not have taken place if the original school were always going to refuse to have him back if necessary.

@WriterOfWrongs there should be a whole load of paperwork filed with the LA for a managed move...
Unfortunately some schools don't make it clear about the aspects of a managed move should they fail, then make a lot of unnecessary noise when the young person heads back in their direction!
I've often been amazed how many senior leadership team don't know the process and then make wild claims to parents. Then add to that many parents have never heard of local authority inclusion teams or fair access and it all descends into a complete mess.

I work with a few PRUs, don’t dismiss it out of hand. They aren’t what they used to be, and many will have weekly CAMHS on site. They will have post 16 links that are known to work for their pupils.
I honestly think our local one is fab. During the average first 20 weeks pupils see their reading age rise 3.2 years. 100% last year got a qualification (there’s no entry level or functional skills available elsewhere), 100% moved on to college or work. The head and staff are amazing. Attendance nearly matches mainstream, which considering barriers is amazing. Go look

The being near a fight stuff is the kind of thing that happened to DS. It made school even more stressful for him - and earlier than Y11 and we'd have struggled to keep him in.

There are downside PP have mentioned about HE - but there is a whole board here that is full of information https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/home_ed and there are paid for on-line schools like https://kingsinterhigh.co.uk/ now - it might be worth researching so you have another back up plan. PP mentioned some local colleges may take 14 + kid so worth looking at that as well.

It does sound like they are trying to illegally off roll him and that you have a case to fight back - but my DS had good mental health,good support with family and peers and was popular with his teachers - but that environment of accusations and looking to find fault left him very stressed on edge and upset.

Hi everyone!

Just an update on what’s happening. Thanks to all of your excellent advice and all the links you gave me to educate myself, I have got my son back into his first school. When I emailed them I explained why I believed what they were doing was unlawful. I also copied the chair of governors into the email. We had a meeting and the had all the paperwork I asked for. Apologised profusely for ignoring my SAR. They also admitted that his EP referral and his CAMHS referral was ready and signed off on 13/11/23 but never sent. The person responsible was supposedly sick that day and wasn’t at the meeting. Also, DS was meant to be sent to his managed move with a lot of support in place to help him make it successful (a mentor, access to the progress centre, a place to go when he was feeling overwhelmed) none of these things were put in place.

I was given the documents for his 3 exclusions which led to his managed move which were absolutely infuriating! I couldn’t believe what I was reading.

1. Assault on another pupil- 5 days (fair enough, I knew about this one)
2. The use of drugs or alcohol on site- 3 days (He puffed on a friend’s vape)
3. Carrying a dangerous or deadly weapon!!! 5 days external and 10 days internal exclusion (He picked up a stick and was banging it on the fence)

They just listed the offences without an actual explanation so any other school looking at those things would have no idea if my DS was drinking, using class A drugs and carrying a bloody knife or something. They don’t elaborate, they just write it down in those categories. As I said before, everything else was just small things like uniform infringements, lates, that sort of thing.

Their attitude was astonishing, I was treated so well and my DS has been promised the world in terms of support going forward. It was so different to previous meetings where they were fairly abrasive and made my DS out to be an out of control child.

He is not being permanently excluded. They’ve given him a reduced timetable to ease him back into school for now. I can’t tell you how relieved I am! Thank you so so much for all of your invaluable advice. I am so very grateful. Obviously I am still upset about all the stress that they’ve put us through but I have to give credit where credit is due, they are trying. Fingers crossed it all goes well.

Excellent news.
Keep a very close eye on the reduced timetable because it's supposed to be VERY temporary with a clear pathway so you need to know exactly what they intend to happen when , no wishy washy as reduced timetables are also illegal if used incorrectly. He should have a clearly written plan and you don't have to agree to the reduced timetable if you ever think that they are using it to keep him out of school rather than in his best interests

All suspensions have a code attached to them, believe me when I say the managed move school would have had all far more detailed information., even if it was given in verbal form.

They will treat you well as they were breaking the law.

Keep a very close eye on what they are doing and request everything be minuted and put in writing .

Great update OP

Great news! Echo what poster above says, reduced timetables should be reviewed every timetable cycle (so weekly or fortnightly depending on the school's style of timetable) and ultimately it should be being increased at every review point (in agreement with you and your son) to ensure it doesn't become exclusion or partial exclusion by back door. Best of luck to your son with his reintegration.

Isn't it funny how they back track once they realise you know the law and will stick up for your child.

Well done you! Hope your son is able to finish his education successfully x

I’ve just read through the thread - well done @Bumblebee2324. Even through your own pain and turmoil you’ve supported your son wholeheartedly. You really should be proud of yourself and believe with absolute certainty this is evidence of your own strength.

Your son’s situation resonates deeply with me. I experienced the deep grief of the loss of a very close family member at the same age. I truly believe that early teens is the worst time to have that experience (although there’s no ‘good age’) think of what 14 yr olds are like with their first loves, music obsessions etc. it’s a bumpy time in the best of circumstances. I’m sad to read that haven’t changed much in the years between us and angry on his behalf that he’s been held to a higher standard than his peers at a time that has made his world a more difficult place than most of his peers are experiencing.

I’m impressed and really happy that you have received so much excellent support on this thread. It was a rollercoaster to read through but it’s left me with a sense of tentative relief that those around your son and his education might finally be stepping up.

Well done, this is good to read.

Great news OP, well done!

Remember this is a battle but not the war. Get everything in writing.

Amazing! Well done you! I just goes to show really how little some school staff understand the law ( or hope that parents don't understand their legal rights.