Wits end with everything

[Isurrender]

I live up North with my two kids aged 18 and 24. Hubby works away and only home every few months. We have no family.

We have just come through the most horrific financial crisis as a family and have pretty much been left with nothing after a two year court battle. I am 54 and my husband is 60.

My son and I both work full time, but my daughter only works 11 hours a week in her own business which she is building up. I pay for her horse, phone and car tax each month. She did have a part time job but gave it up as she fell out with her friend who worked in the same shop and it was awkward, so now does 11 hours work only.

AIBU to expect help in the house? If I specifically ask her to clean a room she will, but if not she does nothing. I spend my weekends shopping, trying to tidy up and walking our dogs. She would never walk them unless asked. If I leave any washing up I mostly come home to it as she will say it wasn’t her mess. She has washed up three times this week and I’m still hearing about it. I’m really struggling with a bad back but she doesn’t notice. The bathroom floor is piled high in her dirty washing but it waits for me. Neither of them would put on a wash unless asked. Last night I was so tired and my back was agony. I left a bowl full of dishes and stuff on the sides, today she had no work and said she’d do them. She sent me a message at work saying she’d wash everyone else’s stuff up later. She had a lie in and went to her horse. I got home to dog poo all over the path and the same mess I’d left last night. She got home after me, telling me she’d wash up later. I said she should have done it earlier and she said her brother doesn’t wash up often. He’d got home and gone to the gym.

My son doesn’t do much but he works 11.5 hour days. If I want a job doing I have to ask over and over. Our garden is completely overgrown as he won’t do it, despite me practically begging him all summer. No one will empty bins unless I ask and if I don’t drag the dustbins out they don’t get emptied. They will see me go outside to fill coal buckets with a bad back and only do it if I ask.

I have nothing for myself, no time, no money, no outings. When the kitchen bin is full the stuff is left on the side for me to take out. My daughter now leaves makeup all over my nice table on the landing and won’t move it unless I ask. Then it’s back the next day. No one will clean the bathroom. The bathroom bin overflows onto the floor until I empty it. If I mention my daughter’s mess she says all I do is moan. I have asked her to get a second job but she doesn’t want to do any job I suggest. She owes her brother £600.

We went through an awful time and she moved out for 5 months to stay with her boyfriend. I admit I was horrible due to all the pressure but now she throws this at me and I feel guilty for asking for her help because I upset her a lot during the court case.

Should they do equal amounts or should she do more as she barely works? I’m at the end of my tether.

He does the washing up, she does the bins (since she doesn't like washing up). They each do their own laundry. She does the bathroom in lieu of not working much. They each tidy their own rooms. You do the general cleaning when you are able, if you are not able due to your bad back then they muck in.

I think it’s family meeting time.

I know you say you’ve tried rotas, charts, etc, but have those been written by you or them?

“Right guys. We need to work out a better system to keep this house under control. We’re meeting at 7pm on Sunday evening.”

Then discuss everything. Like a PP said, accept that it’s been a hard few years - and difficult for all of you, but don’t get into who it’s been worse for. Then list (together) everything that needs doing, and discuss how that could be split.

DO NOT REFER TO IT AS ‘HELPING’ YOU. This is everyone’s responsibility. DH should be on board with this too. He needs to pull his weight in the house. DS needs to be treated the same as DD. Working out of the home is not a reason to not do household tasks (as you well know!) Horse care does not count as house care. That is an extra, which DD is responsible for as well as household tasks.

Ask them what would help (table/mirror in DD’s room so that her make up doesn’t need to be in your hallway? Separate laundry bins and drying racks?)

Ideally, I’d be working towards everyone taking responsibility for one meal a week - including washing up so that if you choose to make a faffy meal, you choose to wash up all those pots/pans. Those that work outside of the home could make use of a slow cooker, or fund a take away.

Good luck.

Strike strike strike strike strike. Tell everyone in the house you’ve asked for a small amount of help multiple times and been ignored and now they lose all help. Don’t do their washing up, put it in a bowl in their room, don’t cook them dinner, don’t do their washing (a pile in their room) and stop cleaning completely. It’ll be tough but they need to physically deal with the consequences of their actions and not have you swooping in to sort things so there’s no real consequences accept having to be challenged by you. Ideally you should also contact a friend and see if you can go and stay with them for a few days so they’ve got more time to reflect on how they’ve been treating you. Let them know what day you’re coming back with advance notice and hopefully they prepare the house accordingly. If they do you can sit down and negotiate what support you’re willing to provide after your return and what they need to do. If them stepping up stops you go straight back to a strike. If they still don’t help you tell them they’ll lose any privileges (your daughter’s horse for one) or will have to find alternative accommodation. They need boundaries and consequences they believe will happen to motivate them to change.

Go in hard. Do not do their laundry. Do not cook for them or wash up/clean after them. The make up on your nice table? Sweep it up into a carrier bag and throw it into the bin. Rinse and repeat.

Tell them it will be that way until X date by when they will have to move out or start contributing. On X date, if they've not changed, take them and their stuff to the Housing Officer at the Council and say they're homeless and walk away.

Stop paying for their bills like the phone. I get what you're saying about the horse, but stop everything else.

If you don't toughen up and be firm, they will carry on walking all over you.

Maybe I haven’t made it clear. I’m honestly so fed up, exhausted and stressed I cannot think. There are so many rows about housework and jobs it just plays round and round in my head. I feel like running away tbh but my back is agony so I can’t even bend properly atm.

Daughter isn’t expected to clear everyone’s mess up nightly. I do it myself! I’m talking about the rare occasions she is asked to do it. My son works 57.5 hours a week. I work 45 but also do some weekend work. Daughter works 11. My thinking is it won’t hurt her to do housework if she is home a lot more, particularly as I pay for horse, phone, car tax. If I ask her to do something she will do it but will leave it all day and I come home to it. Her dirty washing is piled high in the bathroom on the floor. It’s getting bigger and bigger but she won’t wash it. I have to bend over pick it all up and wash it. I asked her why she didn’t do it and she says she’s not in when wash finishes to take it out. She has an excuse for everything

My son doesn’t pay rent. He never has because I felt guilty about my daughter’s horse and her being given more.

I can’t expect him to pay now because he has taken out a loan to help us with the court case.

Both your children should be helping out at home. If nothing else they should clear up their own mess.

You don’t mention if either of them pay rent? If not, then the son working longer hours doesn’t get a free pass to not do anything.

Your Dd should want to help you out because you are helping her out financially. If she is only working a few hours, then presumably she can’t afford to live anywhere else.

Sibling rivalry can be intense and her point about her brother doing nothing (and presumably keeping all his wages) is valid.

You could start asking for rent and use that to pay a cleaner.

Or your son has money but ‘no time’, your Dd has time but no money. Get him to pay her to clean up after him.

I don’t pay for her gym membership. I love my home. We have dogs and there’s no way I’d live in a flat with dogs. I just want some respect and for them both to help.

last summer I practically begged my son to help with the garden but he refused. It’s now an overgrown jungle of embarrassment and we can’t even sit in it.

"Horrific financial crisis", but "pays for her horse."

Clearly not THAT bad, is it?

There's a whole host of things you can do in terms of dealing with your useless young adults. But setting some ground rules and following through would help.

Neither pay rent! Daughter obviously doesn’t earn enough. Son is on 10K more than me and has never paid rent. That’s because he was at uni until he was 21 and has been working the past three years but living rent free. I told him I wouldn’t expect rent because daughter has the horse and it seemed unfair. He does often buy shopping and doesn’t ask for the money.

He has taken out a 20K loan to help us through the court issues so I cannot expect rent. He also lent me 2K for a car so he does help.

If your son lived independently he would have to clean his own house/flat after work so his job is not a reason for skipping the chores.

washing up; put most of the cutlery and plates/dishes somewhere else and just leave 3 or 4 of each in the kitchen. This actually does work I've tried it!

Laundry; put daughter's clothes from the bathroom in a plastic bag and plonk them back in her room. Do the same for anyone else who leaves their items slovenly strewn across the house. This works too.

Bins; put the things on the side in a plastic bag and only take those things out. Don't carry heavy bags of rubbish when you have a bad back. They will soon get bored of not having a bin! Or even better put the bag in their cars/bedrooms.

Money/work; don't ask your daughter to get more work but stop paying for anything expensive. Her phone should be something she's bought outright so she can have a £10 SIM only contract. You shouldn't be paying for a £30+ ee contract or anything silly like that every month.

Rudeness/laziness; change the password to netflix etc. Don't buy any luxury food just get the basics. If they don't help you do the weekly shop then don't take suggestions etc. Do not cook them dinner!! Don't make their lives easier because they have no compassion for you.

Sadly my sister (21) who still lives with my mum tries to get away with similar behaviour.

Yes it is THAT bad! We have had to give away every penny we had in the world and were almost homeless. We have lost our life savings, cashed in every policy. So yes, bad!! I know most people don’t understand but our animals are our world and part of our family always. They are not pieces of furniture to pass on. I realise that’s hard to understand though.

we are on no benefits may I add so the horse is not coming off the state. It’s a really hard situation.

He has taken out a 20K loan to help us through the court issues so I cannot expect rent. He also lent me 2K for a car so he does help.

Is he making the repayments on the loan? If so I’d consider that his rent but if he took out the loan and you’re repaying it he needs to pay rent.

Can I firstly recommend you get a sturdy grab stick. Not a cheapy thing, buy from a mobility place or get from Council stores of you have one.
Stop bending when you don't have to.
There really is no reason for you to be picking up your daughters dirty laundry from the bathroom floor. I would be tempted to dump it on her bed, but only if I had a grab stick!
You are going to run out of steam soon, your body is already telling you this.
What happens when mum is actually broken?
Please consider your health, physical and mental, before you crash and burn 🌺

Is your son paying the loan in exchange for rent? If not, he should still be paying rent.

What a mess. So you owe your son £20k? You definitely can’t ask him for rent then, no. But that has created a very unhealthy dynamic. Honestly I can’t really believe you let him get into debt for you, but I guess it’s done now. Anyway, he may work long hours but that doesn’t mean he doesn’t have to contribute to the house at all.

As for your daughter, stop paying for things until she starts contributing to the household.

Give them both something to be responsible for. Your son can do the bins, your daughter the laundry, and they can split the washing up. Don’t do any of it yourself. Make it clear that’s what you’re asking them to do in lieu of rent. If they won’t or don’t do it, they can find their own places to live, end of story.

He makes the repayments which I feel terrible about but it was the only way.

Who was at fault in the court case? Feels like a fairly vital piece of information.

The alternative was my son contributing towards rental at £600 plus each month. The loan was the cheaper option. It’s a bad situation and difficult.

So she has a gym membership too?

And a horse?

Bloody hell.

I cannot go into the court case. Not really relevant to chores. Already feel as though I could be outed and it’s a period we are all trying to recover from.

vital info about chores already included and it is this that will give me a breakdown as I can no longer live in a slum.

Oh OP, I wrote a huge post describing my situation which is similar to yours.
I ranted and ranted and ranted. It felt so good to get it all out but I deleted it because I knew I would be called a martyr and made to feel even worse than I already do.. which is very very low and at the end of my tether.

I, like you feel like a skivvy and that no one gives a shit Or even notices that they are living in the middle of their own piles of shit. I do not like living like this. They have not grown up in a dirty, messy house. They have been taught from being little to clean and tidy after themselves. Now older, they just don’t do it.

Please rant away, I’m listening and I get your frustration.

Well, it is relevant because if it was something that was, for example, your husband’s fault and your children are now suffering because of it while their dad still doesn’t do any housework, then their attitude is a lot more understandable etc etc.

You don't need to go into the court case in much detail but I feel it's relevant to how you approach the situation as a whole - was it caused by negligence / wrongdoing on the part of you and / or your DH?

He is paying loan off himself.