Retired parents UPSIZING house

[toastlover100]

I’m pretty sure IABU.

My parter and I are late 20s, renting, good careers but still waiting for salaries to increase much.

We are engaged and trying to save for a very small wedding, we know we could just go the registry office but that’s not what we want.

We are also trying to save a house deposit, but it’ll take a long time on current earnings. Hoping to maybe get there by mid thirties.

We would love to have children in the next couple of years but the likelihood is we will still be in our rented flat.

My parents are retired from reasonable jobs but never high earning at all. Through some luck, paying off their mortgage, house price rises, they are about to buy a house worth around a million. This is a huge upsizing.

AIBU to begrudge them this?
We are struggling to make any headway financially, spending thousands a year on rent, wanting a family but not being in the right position etc, whilst my parents are about to spend a huge amount of savings I didn’t know they had to upsize to a large family home they really don’t need.

@rainingsnoring You can get married for less than £500.

She should spend whatever she can realistically afford.

We were at university and had a cheap church wedding, that we funded ourselves, with finger food in the church hall afterwards. We were at university, which we paid for ourselves. We then went back to our terrible rental accommodation and went on honeymoon in a forest an hour away for a few days.

*When do parents ever get to put their own interests first then?

I'm just not that much of a martyr. And I will not be providing regular childcare either.

Thankfully my kids know the sacrifices we've made to bring them up already and would never expect it.*

And the same people who expect parents to martyr themselves from the day the kids are born to the day the parents die, wonder why more adults are choosing to remain child free

There is even an expectation that it carries on after the parents death in the form of an inheritance

Surely at some point the adult offspring should expect to sort their own lives out without relying on mummy and daddy

So, this is the thing. If I were in your parents' position and my children were in yours I would help them without question. There is absolutely nothing in this world that's more important to me than them. My parents and in-laws are exactly the same, so they've helped us in the past too.

I honestly don't understand all of the nastiness on this post. Absolutely, it's up to your parents what they do with their money, but you are also not being unreasonable in being disappointed that your parents aren't the type that love their children so much that they would want to help them when they easily could. That's quite a realisation to come to terms with and you have every right to be sad.

People in their 60s generally already have a comfortable, secure home.
I'm not suggesting that everyone over 60 is extremely well off, obviously not, but they are certainly the wealthiest group in society nowadays (not previously the case). Most have paid off or nearly paid off their mortgages.
We are talking about a situation where a couple of around 60, who are well off, with no mortgage, are planning to upsize but have no plans to help their daughter who cannot currently afford any house at all.

@rainingsnoring I have no problem with people spending millions on their weddings, but I don’t think it’s worth borrowing money for, or prioritising over a house or flat deposit.

I had a (lovely) registry office wedding so I could afford the deposit for our first home, so I do practice what I preach.

I guess it’s about priorities really. I know quite a few people who bitterly regret spending so much on a “party”

Fair point. The OP could certainly consider that, although £4500 doesn't go as far as it should towards buying a house now as it should, with the average price being around £250,000.

In all honesty, if my child's relationship was as unstable as it sounds like the OP's is (there's a bit of background it seems), I would be holding off helping the couple into property too. It seems like a risky investment that the fiancee could take half of if it goes the wrong way.

I can totally understand what you are saying. The stamp duty alone on a million pound house would be over £41k and that would probably set you up for life.

I am old enough to have benefited from a big rise in property values but have worked incredibly hard throughout my life and struggled at times financially paying a 13% mortgage and losing money and jobs in the 2008 crash. I have a lot of money invested in property now and live in a 5 bed detached in London but do feel like I wasted my 20s and 30s just working all the hours, and left it later than I wanted to have kids as I wanted to be financially stable. My parents are dead and didn't meet their grandchildren. In-laws all dead also.

There is no way on earth I will let my kids spend their 20s and 30s living in rented accommodation, putting off having kids and struggling financially if I have the means to help them. At the moment they are all teens so I am trying to pay for opportunities to enable them to push for higher paying careers, and teaching them how to make the most of money. I do want them to have a good work ethic and start good careers and make an effort to save deposits before I start handing out large sums of money.

I think I lot of parents have the mentality of "well we struggled and had to work for our money so you should too" whereas I don't want my kids to struggle, I want them to enjoy their lives.

Of gosh, I totally agree that many people spend a ridiculous amount on their weddings and I would also prioritise a house deposit (we had a small wedding and prioritised saving). I was just making the point that £5000 is a much below average amount to spend on a wedding nowadays.

Really? I hadn't read that. Yes, it would change my view if that were the case.
In general though, my points remain.

I think you will be surprised and maybe see things a little differently when you are 60 and facing years of old age ahead where your care needs may be high. Life would be so much easier if we could just see what our future needs would be.

I haven't personally checked out the background but the last few pages suggest OP's relationship might not be so stable. One of my children is married and I'd be comfortable helping them if I was able, but not if the relationship was unstable. If I could, I might help them but in such a way that I keep the house in my name to protect it.

"In all honesty, if my child's relationship was as unstable as it sounds like the OP's is (there's a bit of background it seems), I would be holding off helping the couple into property too. It seems like a risky investment that the fiancee could take half of if it goes the wrong way."

Actually OP I have to agree here, are you sure you haven't outgrown your relationship. You're so young and it all sounds joyless. Maybe they don't have faith in your relationship so aren't handing over any money.

Are you sure they aren't buying a bigger house so you can possibly move back in with them?

That's one stupid decision in the retirement. That's what I think.

Soon enough OP, you'll be pulling along your elderly parents and (much worse so) their decrepit, ill-maintained, big house. Whatever is left in the savings will be pillaged by unscrupulous cowboy builders.
I see this happen to friends, relatives - everyone - and it brings so much additional stress to be sorting additional household out.

Both houses I've bought, have been from old dears. The first one, the occupiers were happily downsizing and just in the nick of time. The second - the elderly owner gave up way, way too late. The dry rot is not even the worst thing here. What's foolish at 60, is sad at 70....

*If my parents had been fucking loaded and had done this to me, I would have gone very low contact with them, and when they got elderly and infirm, they could use their massive nest egg for their care. Because like fuck would I be looking after them. I wouldn't make them a cup of tea. In fact, I probably wouldn't visit. They would have made their bed! They could lie in it!

KARMA. IS. A. BITCH!*

And I would hope that if you acted like a petulant teenager they would have made sure you didn't inherit anything when they died. It goes both ways

Tbh, we are looking for a house this year, which we will be upsizing to (with help from an inheritance) we ve always had houses which have been within our limited budget, and never ones I’ve fallen in love with. I’m late 50’s. I want to now buy my dream house , as it’s our last chance to do so before retirement. I have adult dcs who are doing ok but would probably benefit from an injection of cash, but on this I’m determined to fulfil something I’ve always wanted.

Have a wander over to the elderly parents threads. There are a lot of older people who now seem to expect their adult children (daughters) to drop everything and become unpaid carers at the expense of their own children, partners, work, social lives and even health.

At some point the disparity between generations is going to be so stark that this will not be in any way possible. Add to that delays in young people having children or having them at all, there will simply not be enough younger people to care or work to pay for the pensions and care of older people.

I would personally say the OP should prioritise having children and a small wedding over buying a house because there’s a time limit on how long you stay fertile and marriage would give her and her children security. However I shouldn’t have to writing any of this. A wedding, affordable accommodation and children shouldn’t be impossible in your twenties, or thirties. It should be entirely feasible for everyone in a healthy society. It’s worrying that people aren’t thinking a few generations ahead and wondering exactly what effect this is going to have on the lives of their own children and grandchildren, let alone begrudging leaving them any inheritance.

There's a massive assumption that the previous couple of generations all had it easier and that's just not true. My parents grew up in council houses and did working class jobs (dad worked on the railways and for the council, mum was a nurse). There were no inheritances for them or benefit from property value increases. They bought a house but lost it when the interest rates skyrocketed in the late 80s/early 90s. They are okay now but certainly not sitting on expensive assets.
Dh and I have a modest house that we are on the tail end of paying for. We haven't been living it up with spendy holidays or massive house improvements - our money went on paying the bills and giving our children nice lives. We prioritised their schooling and bringing them up in a nice safe place, funding activities and hobbies and ensuring they had financial support through uni and a home with us when they were starting out and needed a base and to save money. But that doesn't mean we are swimming in money and doing those things came with personal sacrifices for dh and I. We are happy to do it, obviously, because they are our kids. But this idea that we (as a generation) owe them big weddings and childcare and house deposits and basically everything they want and have nothing for ourselves ever, is totally unreasonable.

Have a wander over to the elderly parents threads. There are a lot of older people who now seem to expect their adult children (daughters) to drop everything and become unpaid carers at the expense of their own children, partners, work, social lives and even health.

Did this too. Still didn't get, or expect, cash towards my mortgage.

Fair point. The OP could certainly consider that, although £4500 doesn't go as far as it should towards buying a house now as it should, with the average price being around £250,000.

Well it contributes almost 2% of the average price in deposit

I completely understand your resentment honestly. Perhaps because I feel similarly! I'm lucky in that I've been able to buy a place myself, but I have a huge mortgage while my parents have moved mortgage free between various £1m-ish houses, and I've never got any money towards my own house from them. I have never said anything, but I have friends whose parents have made strategic choices with the explicit aim of being able to help their children out with property, and I can't help but feel jealous honestly, looking at people who earn much less than me but who have much higher quality of life because of the difference that £50k or whatever made at that critical moment.

The deciding factor in whether you can buy a house is now not income (which puts paid to the whole "work hard and it'll pay off" argument), but family wealth. That is true on a societal level and I'm sure there are people here who will have anecdotes to the contrary but on the whole, that is a fact. Various factors over the last decade have created a huge transfer of wealth from younger to older generations.

You're absolutely not entitled by right to any money from your parents, but I can completely understand feeling miffed that they haven't thought about doing more to help - not because you're entitled to it, but because they wanted to. It is the fact they don't want to that must sting, I think, and I understand that, I really do.

There is a huge generational divide and some parents are leaning into that and doing at least what they can to help bridge it within their own families, and others aren't. It's especially hard when you see friends moving ahead because their parents fall into the former camp while yours are in the latter.

@SinisterBumFacedCat but it's far fewer than in generations past when it was actually much more common for elderly relatives to live with younger ones. Homes for the elderly are a relatively recent creation. Pre-1980s there weren't convenient places to put your elderly parents in. You either cared for them or they struggled on their own. Having someone else paid to do it was something only the wealthiest had access to. It was expected you looked after your own because there wasn't anyone else to do it.
These days, outsourcing has become the norm. It's becoming something we expect to be able to do and feel hard done by if it costs too much or isn't there at all. For my grandparents generation it wasn't an option. The youngest female in a family was expected to look after the parents when they aged. There may well have been more community support, but given that half of MN seems to not want to have anything to do with other people unless it has any benefit to themselves, those days won't be coming back.

I’m with you op. You don’t resent your parents money as such, just that they’ve had the opportunities and breaks that your generation haven’t.

I hope to help my kids out. It’s grim for young people now.

The OP supposedly got married in 2022 and was then debating about honeymooning in Sardinia or Amalfi.

So I guess they can crack on with the DC without the registry office dilemma.

Like you, I'm bemused at the "need" to buy a house - I don't recall my fertility being affected by renting or living in a flat.

This. ^