To think it's tragic if Michael Jackson was indeed innocent

[pregahes]

It's a real shame for someone who created incredible music to have their legacy at risk. It’s just tragic, considering the impact his music had on so many. It's tragic either way, if he's guilty for the victims and if he's innocent for himself.

I'm a huge fan and at one point t thought he was guilty but kore recently change of heart. I think there would be more victims if he weee in fact guilty. Somethings doesnt add up.

It's tragic

Absolutely! I did not understand why the mothers let them go away with MJ for a couple of months without them at age 8 or whatever it was. That was ridiculous.

Or he paid them off because if he didn’t he knows he’d end up in prison

Sadly, I believe the victims. Why would a grown man have young boys in his bed? Seriously.

I was a huge fan too, but now just like R Kelly's music I can't listen without feeling sickened....

The only crude people on here are those calling child sex abuse survivors cunts because they dare to expose their creepy little hero

Why not?

@KarenNotAKaren It's inappropriate because it opens the adult up to allegations and puts the child in an unsafe situation not knowing the intentions of the adult, My kids would never have got in that situation to start with. The parents did not do their job.

It’s so blatantly obvious he was a paedophile. He is the Jimmy Saville of pop, still so many in denial.

The parents being insane doesn’t mean MJ was innocent.

Ive watched the documentary many times. It’s very carthatic for survivors to hear stories from others. But anyway - Safechuck’s mum came across as remorseful and at least admitted she got carried away with the lavish lifestyle.

Whereas Robson’s mum still spoke with so much affection about Jackson. She said as positively obsessed and bewitched by him even at the point of the interview. I think she believes her son but I think if we slipped her a bit of truth serum she’d tell us that whilst she believes him she thinks it was all worth it for the houses, private jets and celebrity introduction. I strongly suspect she doesn’t mind that much about what happened to her son when she got to live a celebrity lifestyle for so long

Because he does. And there are still people on this thread and at large, who read headlines only and make the assumption that a child has lied.

If my crudeness makes you google that child’s story then all the better for the knowledge you’ve gained. Crudeness has clearly worked for the tabloids as that’s the story people seem to believe over testimony of abused children.

We'll never know for certain. Only Jackson and the boys who made the allegations know.

What we do know is;
He had no interest in women.
He surrounded himself with boys of a certain age. It was always boys. If you love being around kids, why was it only ever boys in his room?

First record I ever bought was the single Smooth Criminal. He was an extraordinary performer, probably the greatest ever in terms of singer/dancer combination. What is also true is there will always be a question mark hanging over him in regards to his relations.

See why would your first response not be “I wouldn’t let my child sleep in a random man’s bed because the man requesting that would deeply worry me” not “My child might falsely accuse him”.

Yea the parents were deeply terrible at parenting - but that doesn’t mean MJ was innocent.

But if you do think he WAS innocent - why would it be bad parenting to let the kids share a bed? After all he wasn’t a pedophile?

If you read Jordan Chandler’s mum testimony in the 2005 trial, she describes how Jackson begged her to let Jordan sleep with him and would cry until she relented. But sure - he was innocent.

Also can no one see the correlation between “insane” parents (more rightly GROOMED parents) and a later accusation of abuse. That is (third time I’ve said it) because abusers chose those who will seem insane.

It validates their lies.

Why would he do that if he was innocent?

Prince Andrew paid millions to a woman he'd never even met. I queued for ages as I've never met him either, but he didn't pay me squat. 😜

Also “why on Earth did they let it happen”, when what we should be asking is why did the world let it happen.

It’s still happening, 2/3 the comments on here suggest he acted totally normally and they believe he’s just a lost soul who had a terrible time. Even if he was innocent (he wasn’t) his fate was entirely self inflicted. He could have just stopped sleeping with underage children.

@KarenNotAKaren I didn't write them in any particular order, was just thinking of my reasons and then typed them out.

I agree it doesn't mean he was innocent, it also doesn't mean he was guilty of sexual assault and rape. I'm a very evidence based person, as in physical evidence that can link a person to a particular act without any shadow of a doubt.

I believe it would be bad parenting because no one can truly know someone's intentions and it shouldn't be a risk parents should take.

His behaviour is certainly odd but can we really go as far as saying he had sex with these boys based on what information is available?

And had a theme park in his garden!

This. All day long.

You might be a very evidence-based person but sex crimes often don't produce evidence.

It's rape, not 'sex with' when it comes to children.

I believe he was guilty. His choice and grooming of victims shows him to be persistent, cunning and manipulative. His behaviour was considered odd at the time, but like Savile, he was able to continue in plain sight due to money, position and power.

@dessyh Yes it is rape, which I also said in my post.

I understand there is not always any evidence but you can't convict someone with no evidence. It's terrible for victims of SA and rape but it has to be beyond a reasonable doubt.

If you’re an evidenced based person you’ll know that forensic evidence is basically non/existent in historic sex abuse cases. So what sort of evidence beyond witness testimony do you expect to believe MJ was a pedophile? Bearing in mind out his own mouth he admitted some very predatory behaviour

I assume you don’t believe Jimmy Saville’s victims either then?

OK so why would it be bad parenting to let your child sleep on the same bed as a random man?

His behaviour is certainly odd but can we really go as far as saying he had sex with these boys based on what information is available

Yes. There’s been 8 accusers. How many more would you need before you believed it?

Testimonies ARE evidence. HTH

@KarenNotAKaren Yes they are evidence, which is tested upon cross examination and can be discredited. One of the accusers testified saying nothing happened to him. Do we dismiss that evidence now?

Yes - because if you understand how grooming works it’s totally understandable that a child would be in denial about their abuse.

If MJ was alive today and the justice system was about justice not theatrics, there’s no way he wouldn’t be in prison. His victim’s stories absolutely stand up to scrutiny, and the fact he displayed such obvious noncey behaviour would also be taken into consideration

I'm getting the word NONCE