AIBU to feel societal pressure re getting a house now we have a DD?

[Wannabemamas]

DH and I have been house hunting for a while but the current market is not great (yes prices are coming down but there aren’t many properties available). We are first time buyers, both almost 40 yo with a DD that is due to start school next year. We live in a lovely suburban London area but have been looking to buy a house elsewhere in the home counties (specifically in Surrey) because our budget won’t allow us to get a house where we are now. Whilst we started off being fully convinced with our decision, we are now having second thoughts having seen that the grass is not necessarily much greener in other areas (either a longer/less straightforward/more expensive commute or generally less nice areas than the one we live in right now).

I have been asking myself whether it would be “weird” to raise DD in an apartment in the London suburbs instead of a house with a garden further out as it’s “expected” once you have a family with DC in this country. I feel I would potentially be content in a nice apartment, provided we have: enough space, lots of natural light, period features like big bay windows would be a big plus, a very long lease, great location. I would definitely miss an outside space as would LOVE to have a garden but I also wonder whether this is a compromise worth making given we love our current area so much and works well for us as a family. There aren’t many garden flats in our area and the few that exist are LG floor with for us is definitely a no go.

For context, we have been renting a small 2 bed flat for almost 10 years so we are used to flat living but current salaries and deposit would allow us to ”upgrade” in terms of space so even if it wasn’t a house, it would definitely be a bigger and nicer flat than the one we have been living in.

I don’t want to let peer and societal pressure push us towards a direction that doesn’t fully work for us but equally, I am scared we’d be regretting not getting a house further down the line.

We also own a cat which is part of our family and I fear this could be an issue with a leasehold (our current landlord is very relaxed about pets so we had no issues but I know this isn’t always the case in leasehold properties?).

I do think there is definitely pressure to raise your kids in a house in the suburbs (opposite to a flat in the city center where you're kinda expected to live when you're young and single).

Most of my friends grew up in flats on the outskirts in the city and now it seems borderline a crime. Almost all.my friend with kids bought a house as soon as they saw two lines on the pregnancy test. Those with still renting flats get the "well, soon you'll find a nice house" or some crap.

I grew up in a terraced house and I don't recall playing in the garden as a kid. We always went to.play at the communal areas. Also my kinda controversial opinion is that I'm not a huge fans of the gardens I've seen in Britain. The fences are too high and restricting to my liking. But that's a cultural difference since my bf can't phantom the ridiculous gardens we have 😅

I absolutely don't think flat life is bad at all for kids, especially in London. We hate gardening, for some reason bought a house with a huge garden, hated every second of maintaining it so sold it and now have a house with a teeny, tiny urban concrete garden! We love it!

What I would say is that covid really taught me that an outside space - even maybe just a balcony - was a real help with children. Loads of my friends have flats with 1/2 kids and they did say that that was challenging. A garden was useful to get some energy out so that would be my only reservation.

Why are you so against LG? I lived in one for two years in Zone 2 and it was awesome.

@StoppitRightNow generally more damp issues, risks of break in, issues when rains, less light etc. Seems a big liability with lots of risks associated

Are you planning more kids though? As I think kids will naturally run about and be noisier when with others. If not, no concerns. But of you are, worth thinking about.
For me, I think living near parks would be more important than a garden. Even with a garden, I still took my kids out to the park every day when they were young.
I wouldn't worry about the 'societal pressure' you are feeling. If you know an apartment would work better for you. I think people naturally justify what they have chosen, but that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with your way.

For me the issue isn't flat v. house...a nice flat with enough bedrooms is perfectly fine. For me the issue is renting v. owning. I'd much rather own

@meganorks we don't really want another DC and given we are both almost 40 I guess it isn't very likely to happen. BUT that said, I don't know if we will change our mind in 1 or 2 years when we'd feel it's either now or never

I live outside the UK (Tokyo) and live centrally in a three-bed apartment with my two kids and husband. I've had some weird reactions from (a few) UK people, but I like the way we live. I like being central and having great public spaces on our doorstep, I like that it's so easy to keep fit and healthy as we can walk and bike places, I like that older children can quickly become so independent and not have to be wheeled around by parents all the time. Flats are also much cheaper to heat and we don't have to run a car. Of course, that last one will depend on your area - the UK is often poor for public transit. You might be able to get away with one car rather than two, for example.

Good soundproofing, an elevator and a balcony are essential IMO. It's also worth looking into childproof ultrastrong netting to make a balcony safer.

A garden would be a nice-to-have if someone turned up and gifted me one. It's not sufficient inducement for me to move to the suburbs, though. We go to my parents' suburb with their wonderful garden each summer, and it's nice, but the window for independent play in the garden was not that long; very little kids need supervision in the garden anyway, older kids grow out of the garden and you end up going to a park in any case. My parents' garden is lovely and huge and the kids actually could play in there, but my younger friends with newbuilds mostly have tiny gardens that are too small for any useful play. Might as well ,have a balcony, maybe....I dunno? Still, everyone has different feelings about this. For some people, just having a garden feels essential and they don't want to compromise on this - it's just the way they feel.

If you do decide to go this route, be prepared for lots of "So, when are you to going to move further out and get a house with a garden?" questions. For a few years. Eventually people do give up and stop asking, though.

Ultimately, we all like different things and I've personally seen happy parents successfully raise kids in all sorts of environments - urban apartments, terraces with tiny gardens, suburbs, edge of town, and out in the countryside - even a remote farm hundreds of miles from anywhere in the middle of Australia!

I don’t want to let peer and societal pressure push us towards a direction that doesn’t fully work for us but equally, I am scared we’d be regretting not getting a house further down the line.

Will you feel bad if the friends you talk about move out all have houses/more space etc?

I think flats are fantastic with young dc but houses are easier when you have older dc who have friends around/want time alone etc.

I also think culturally we are quite different to other countries where flat living is normal having said that I would live in a flat in z1 because it’s z1. I wouldn’t chose a flat in z3 over a house in a cheaper part of London.

See, I find this so interesting because my experience has been literally the opposite. Turning my kids out into the big garden at my parents' suburban villa to play by themselves has been nice, and I can certainly see the attraction for the 4-10yo age group. But my older girl has grown out of this kind of stuff now, and I really struggle to keep her active when we go to stay at the grandparents' place. In our central location, she can go to friends' houses by herself or they meet up on the main street to get bubble tea and look round the shops. I don't have to be involved or cart her round anywhere. Of course, this can be true for kids in suburban houses too, if they live on a decent bus/train/tram route or have a nice local high street, so I also don't want to generalize.

YABU. If you have the choice you are doing your child a disservice by keeping them cooped up in a flat.

Children need outdoor space, even if she’s “not a particularly outdoorsy kid”. Of course she isn’t - she’s cooped up in a flat

If you are thinking of buying, I would say a house is a better investment than a flat. With a house you own the land and that can appreciate over time, there are also lots of people with similar concerns about leasehold so you might struggle to find a buyer if/when you want to sell it.

I personally wouldn’t want to raise my children in a flat, but that’s personal preference and you may feel totally differently. I think kids do benefit from having some outside space though

@user1477391263 we have a large home office in the garden that doubles as a "den". The dc often disappear into there with friends, they aren't old enough to meet with friends alone but we have a decent high street nearby anyway (I'm in London). I also grew up in London & whilst my friends & I did go out in the local area a lot we spent a lot of time at each others houses. Before this we had a good sized flat with a garden but I'm happy in the house. Number of dc probably makes a difference. I wouldn't move further out for a massive house as I like amenities on my doorstep

Re investment London flats haven't performed that well in the last few yrs.

@TheJanuaryPinks do you realise that million of DC in the world are raised in flats and this is the notmality in the majority of well developed EU countries, including very wealthy families? We haven’t all had deprived lives because we didn’t live in a 3 bed semi with a garden.

@TheJanuaryPinks also she gets outdoor space in the many parks and playgrounds we have nearby, she isn’t confined home all the time

With our warmer summers I think having your own private outdoor space is a godsend tbh

@decisionssmecisions but that would depend on the layout. If the number of rooms is the same I don’t see a big difference. We wouldn’t be able to get a house with a garden big enough to add a massive shed for them to hang in, not in the areas we’d consider at least

Two things would put me off a flat - noise and lack of control over service charges.

If you buy a purpose built flat with good sound proofing the first problem is dealt with.

The service charge issue is more problematic.

I am not a gardener so would not care about the lack of a garden. However, ds did like to play football in our garden and we are not really close to parks (10 mins walk or so). Also a child can play unattended in a secure garden while you have to go with them to a park (until they get older).

But millions of people live very happily in flats and it works for them. Do what's right for you, not what the Jones's think. It's your life, not theirs.

Of course lay out makes a difference, but as I said we had a good sized first floor maisonette with 3 bedrooms & I would have probably stayed there without dc but I'm happier in the house, it just feels more separate.

What I realise is that if you have the choice to live in a house with a garden or a flat then yes, you are being selfish.

Going to the park is not the same as having your own garden.

People really need to think about their situation before they bring a kid into it. There’s a very good reason people used to marry, buy a house and THEN have kids.

But millions of people live very happily in flats and it works for them. Do what's right for you, not what the Jones's think. It's your life, not theirs.

I agree but I'm not sure the OP knows what she wants. I could move to z5 or out of London and have a much bigger house & garden, even in my area a bit further away I would get more for my money but I want the station & the high street under 10 mins walk. We all have to compromise!

Societal pressure? Trust your oen decision actually make a decision, and stop looking for issues that aren't there would seem best way forward

@TheJanuaryPinks omg - how old are you? I hope you are well in your 60s or 70s to write such bull..it and believe in it!
People have different lives, needs, jobs and experiences and you cannot possibly believe we should all follow the exact same path and that there is only one right way of doing things in this world.
What an incredibly narrow minded way of looking at life you have, I am sorry for you.

People really need to think about their situation before they bring a kid into it. There’s a very good reason people used to marry, buy a house and THEN have kids.

Well obviously its because house prices vs wages were much cheaper. My in laws 2nd house which they moved to from another house in their early 30s was about 50k in the 80s and now they are 1.5m, my parents house is even more expensive.