Neighbours say they can only 'try' to control their child.

[sleeplessnights24]

I live in a new build. Everything has been ok, but the tenants upstairs have a 5 year old boy who doesn't stop stomping.

Running in the afternoon/normal hours is one thing, but this is in the early hours when people are clearly still asleep! It also happens in the middle of the night too...?! Surely a 5 year old can sleep through the night...? Also, why run if you're up that late?!

I noted the hours it happened. 5:30am, 5:40am, 6:30am - and weirdly 12:30am, 1:20am and 4:20am too. That's just in the last 3 weeks. On weekends it started at 6:50am and 5:40am. We are not just talking about brief periods of noise. It is often intermittent. The worst was 3:50am - which was intermittent until about 4:20am. Then again at 5:20am. Then at 7:30am. That night I didn't sleep at all since 3:50am.

Initially, all communications were fine. I only spoke up once I was at my wits end. I was polite - and so were they. No apology from their side though. They said they'd be mindful of the noise. Phew! I was grateful and hopeful to finally be able to sleep. I do not expect to live in silence (obviously), but stomping on your ceiling - when you're trying to sleep and it is still dark outside, is crazy.

A few months goes by... nothing changes. But because I had already complained once, I felt like I couldn't complain again... until I did.

Again, all polite from both sides. Said they'd be mindful. Ok.
Nothing changed again. Rinse & repeat. The noise - if anything - just got louder... so I spoke up again. Both sides nice and polite. They said it was 'confusing' that it was so loud. I asked multiple times if they'd like to come down and hear it for themselves as they didn't understand how it could be so disruptive. They ignored every invite to come listen.

They would say he 'only walks' on days I would be woken up in the morning - by running. They were/are defensive and looking for excuses. I get it. In many ways, I am not surprised. They kept saying they were 'being mindful' - but nothing ever changed. If the noise had reduced by 20% since I complained; at least that would be something. But there was literally no change.

I was transparent about having Bose headphones, white noise machines, etc... so they could see that I was doing things to drown out the noise from my side.

After 18 months of it happening on an almost daily basis, I complained to my building management Co. I had complained to management before - but their response was 'there's nothing we can do'. They didn't even pass on my sentiments to the owners of the flat.

This time I didn't relent - and asked them to pass/forward my email to the actual owners of the apartment upstairs. (Upstairs are renters). They did indeed forward my email to the owners.

I got a response saying the owners had spoken to their tenants - and the tenants have agreed to buy a rug and will 'try to control the movements of their child when possible'.

I took this as somewhat helpful - and was more angry that I was proven right in that what they'd done for the year prior - was nothing at all - certainly in terms of practical measures when they had told me there was nothing more they could do. Over the 18 months; there was one occasion where I (politely) asked what they had done to mitigate the noise... they didn't respond. (They have hardwood floors throughout).

For 8 weeks, they seemed to promptly stop the running in the middle of the night/early hours (which I only wanted stopped at unreasonable hours anyway) - but now we are back to square one it seems. I'm mindful of it being Winter (dark and awful weather outside) and also Christmas season, but I'm not sure why it keeps happening. They say the best they can do is 'try' to control it.

AIBU for not relenting and to keep complaining to management? The tenants have stopped opening my messages now.

Yet again… this is going on 18 months. Landlord gets involved so it stops for 2 months because they are obviously worried, not about the neighbour downstairs not sleeping but of the repercussions of the landlord if they are not seen to be doing something. School holidays are not 18 months long.

I absolutely feel you, OP. I chose to buy a top floor flat thinking that it will provide 'insurance' against these type of situations. Sadly, it doesn't. I now have a young family underneath and still hear babies crying, running, etc.
Have you considered long-term implications on your mental health and whether it may be worth moving out?

OP I think you've been incredibly patient and willing to compromise, but you've got nowhere. It's time to get serious I think - they've shown that they won't listen to anything else.

It's ultimately the landlord's problem and you need to go in hard. In a similar situation (not noise but antisocial behaviour of tenants) I wrote a pre-action letter to the landlord informing them that, unless they stopped their tenants preventing me from the quiet enjoyment of my home, I would sue him. I told them that I had unlimited access to lawyers via family and that would keep on going until it was sorted.

I hate that it's like that but too many people just shrug unless they're going to personally suffer.

@Cmonluv

Unless you're being deliberately obtuse, there's a huge difference between a child 'waking and going for a wonder' than running and stomping and banging relentlessly for hours at a time at 3am.

The latter needs discipline. If you can't work that out or know how to at least try to do that, then you've got a very tolerable approach to your kids, but the rest of the world won't be so tolerant.

Your replies imply discipline to be some kind of abuse or beating.
No.. it's consistency and having boundaries.

There is absolutely zero need for a child to be going back and forth on a scooter, bouncing balls, stomping, jumping of beds and sofas at 3am.

The world doesn't revolve around feral kids.

As the noise is happening in short 20-30 min bursts, only once or twice a night I would highly predict the child is up for reasonable reasons rather than being left to run wild unsupervised.
I have known a lot of poorly sleeping children and never have they woken up just to start running around for fun. They wake for a reason and then it takes a bit of toing and froing to get them to settle.

Regardless of the reason, you are still being woken once or twice in the night. I don’t think this is as terrible as what has been made out in this thread where people seem to assume you are being kept up for hours on end all night.

However being woken is difficult and the severity can be greatly impacted by your reaction. If you spend those 20-30mins frustrated and imagining the parents wilfully ignoring it you will set off your adrenaline and end up being awake for much longer periods. If you can keep calm and tell yourself it is only a relatively short time period you may be able to relax through it and sleep well during the remaining 7h+ where there are no disturbances. Easier said than done, but I hope for your own sanity you can be less impacted by it.

I would love to sleep all night un disrupted but unfortunately that’s just not possible when children are involved it’s not just the the person below suffering it’s also the parents in my case anyway! Children need to LIVE!!!! bugger of to the ones that have any thing to say kids will also be kids it’s also winter and. Cost of living some people can’t get out to take there kids places so some people have no choice 😐

The parents may or may not be sleeping either but their child is their choice and responsibility. Unlike them, OP has zero control over his movements and behaviours. And in this case, the parents are seemingly being dishonest and even denying it’s happening, but if we take them at their word their sleep isn’t being disrupted.

A 5 year old can’t live if he’s not stomping about at midnight or 4am??it’s a bit different with babies but Most 5 year olds I’ve lived with do sleep through from bedtime (8pm-ish) until the morning although they do sometimes get up early. But if they do get up at 5am they can certainly be told not to do things such as running up and down the hall if it disturbs others within or outside their household. And a 5 year old getting up to crawl into their parents bed at 2am or whatever is not what we are talking about here. That one minute walk would not be waking up OP.

It’s important to stress OP isn’t complaining about children playing or walking around in the daytime or early evening. She’s talking about midnight /middle of the night /very early morning disturbances. Cost of living is irrelevant as no one is expecting them to take their child out on trips at those times.

I agree with the post by @WinterDeWinter it’s time to get serious!

I sympathise, but they are probably having a rough time with a hyperactive child who doesn't sleep much. Short of tying him up, what can they actually do? I would look at soundproofing your own home as much as possible and try earplugs

This. He doesn't sound dissimilar to my child (who has just been diagnosed with ADHD). Thank goodness we live in a detached house.

That said, if I were you I'd be really annoyed. You have the right to quiet enjoy ment of your living space. I'd be mortified if I was the parents. But also, from my own experience, it is so hard to keep some children quiet. My you fest is soooo quiet but my 5 year old is the loudest child in the world. I sympathise with you both, but I'm also aware that this is probably 1 of 100s of complaints that this family will get about their son (I spend my life apologising for mine, and it is really crushing).

This child isn't reported to be doing any of the things you describe. It's footfall the op is complaining about.

The child is only awake and making noise for 20-30 mins at a time. Highly unlikely they wake up to do a short burst of a high energy games and much more likely they are up for a reasonable reason (toilet, dream, drink), albeit noisily.

The flats should comply with Part E of the building regulations and sound testing should have been carried out before they were signed off. Impact noise is the hardest to eradicate and hard floors are a major problem in flats. Sound proofing board should have been installed under the floors.
OP should go back to the management company and request a copy of the original sound test.
Part E specifies what the limits are so you could get a sound meter and measure it yourself when the child is running or ask the management company to get a specialist in.

I wonder if it would help if the landlord put stone tiles down instead of wood

It’s awful living below people (I had this with adults above me). Solution - don’t live below people.

It’s awful having a kid getting up through the night and at 5am for the day. Would love a solution to that!! (Looking at my 8 year old! 6 and 1 year old are fine).

I appreciate sleep deprivation is awful so I can see why you are offering to go to these measures but I don’t think rugs will necessarily solve the problem and if it does you shouldn’t be paying for it either. I think this sets a bad precedent about what others should do to address a noisy neighbour -the neighbours should be dealing with it whether through managing their child’s behaviour or asking their landlord to install rugs etc.

Additionally, I worry the child may find another part of the floor to walk on or kick/move the rugs aside if he’s so hyperactive overnight, and the parents clearly have a very laissez-faire attitude to it all, so you will have spent money that the landlord /tenants should have spent…AND not solved the issue. What will happen next?

As I said previously, they see you as a soft touch so are not taking this seriously . It’s time to go in hard. They stopped the noise before and they can stop it again.

I'm on the top floor. My bedroom is a fridge in the winter and an oven in the summer. There are problems with every position.

You poor soul, I have dogs next door to me who bark relentlessly when their owners are out. I am up at 5 in morning for work and sometimes they dont come home till nearly midnight.
Don't know what advice to offer you, other than recording this noise and letting landlord and tenant hear it.
Why tf, should YOU have to mitigate this unsocial behaviour, child or not
Good luck. Be relentless in your quest for a silent night!!!

@fitzwilliamdarcy I was giving my personal circumstances my we boys got a disability with his head got his full head reshaped I can only get to the park if someone comes with me I can only go out if someone comes with me he wears head shields the lot so not everyone’s circumstances is the same! How does nobody know that the children she’s talking about could have any disability autism? adhd? JUST BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE DONT LOOK DISABLED DOESNT MEAN THERE NOT! What about my self? I have severe Endometriosis can barely walk myself with a large 30cm cyst plus dealing with my children 2 under 6? My neighbour moans non stop contacted my landlord a number of times because my bedroom is above hers she’s lived in a front and back door and lived in a farm all her days and decided to move to a side door like myself and because she’s not used to someone above her she doesn’t like it? She actually says to my children when she sees them youse need to stop running in to your mums room at night time I can here your feet running? You’re a big boy you need to learn to sleep in your own bed? If you sleep
in your on bed I will buy u something special l? This old women also tried to attack me with a washing pole she’s 78! Also she bangs up with brushes after 9 at night if I’m watching tv in my room! Or if the children are playing she’s very unreasonable and no wonder the landlord doesn’t even get back to her anymore as the landlord said it’s ‘ Hear see’ if any problems she can contact the police family’s need to live and all family’s have different circumstances I’m going through the exact same thing and have been for the last 3 years only the last year I have stood up to her and let my kids be kids the 2 years previously I done everything she said just to be civil unfortunately not anymore my kids are not being controlled over an old women who spits the dummy when it doesn’t go her way!

apart from that I totally understand it but what can u do in this day and age? There’s no houses from the council they’ve housed them all to over seas people coming over and so on I could go on and on and on! I’m currently on the homeless list to get out of here because the women down the stairs she’s a nightmare and unreasonable she actually works with children at a play group and still doesn’t take it in to consideration

@Lovelyjubbbly OK, so when you said it’s winter and cost of living so parents can’t take their kids out, you were talking about your very specific circumstances. Two pretty different things.

I don’t know why you’re shouting at me about invisible disabilities either.

And FGS, the UK hasn’t run out of council houses because they’ve given them all to asylum seekers. They’ve been selling them off to the tenants and not building new ones for decades.

Yet again I will repeat that it is school holidays and winter, illness, less outdoor time and loss of school routine could be to blame for things gettingw order the past few weeks and they may well settle again. The op speaks fo worsening again the past 3 weeks.

Also as previously often something will help then stop helping.

What is your advice what would you do? If it wouldn't be your child because you'd parent it out fo them, how?

@fitzwilliamdarcy i can assure right now where I live it’s all you see here 😂!

and yes absolutely is my own personal circumstances you asked and said your opinion I also said mine Hunny 😊

This is a silly argument. I personally don't care if the parents are affected. They chose to have a child. They can and should deal with it.

Your child's noise should not be my problem.

it’s not just the the person below suffering it’s also the parents in my case anyway

They're your children that you chose to have. The person below gets no such choice.

What happened for the other 14 months?? Weather? School holidays? Winter? Darkness? Summer? Brightness? Bullshit.

Like I said, they found a solution for 8 weeks. 8 whole weeks. All because the landlord got in touch. How utterly convenient. If there was nothing they could do they could not have done it for 8 weeks.

@Scalottia Take it you don’t have children then? Deal with them you say that’s not always possible your been totally unreasonable aswell. I’m guessing your old age aswell

Yes and people- including 5 year olds- need to be able to move around their house! Which is why it’s considered living noise and OP is being unreasonable. The problem is clearly the building structure and OP is able to get her ceilings insulated or decide this kind of flat living is not for her.

They may still be doing what they've done for the last 8 weeksjt may not be working due to change in routine.