Neighbours say they can only 'try' to control their child.

[sleeplessnights24]

I live in a new build. Everything has been ok, but the tenants upstairs have a 5 year old boy who doesn't stop stomping.

Running in the afternoon/normal hours is one thing, but this is in the early hours when people are clearly still asleep! It also happens in the middle of the night too...?! Surely a 5 year old can sleep through the night...? Also, why run if you're up that late?!

I noted the hours it happened. 5:30am, 5:40am, 6:30am - and weirdly 12:30am, 1:20am and 4:20am too. That's just in the last 3 weeks. On weekends it started at 6:50am and 5:40am. We are not just talking about brief periods of noise. It is often intermittent. The worst was 3:50am - which was intermittent until about 4:20am. Then again at 5:20am. Then at 7:30am. That night I didn't sleep at all since 3:50am.

Initially, all communications were fine. I only spoke up once I was at my wits end. I was polite - and so were they. No apology from their side though. They said they'd be mindful of the noise. Phew! I was grateful and hopeful to finally be able to sleep. I do not expect to live in silence (obviously), but stomping on your ceiling - when you're trying to sleep and it is still dark outside, is crazy.

A few months goes by... nothing changes. But because I had already complained once, I felt like I couldn't complain again... until I did.

Again, all polite from both sides. Said they'd be mindful. Ok.
Nothing changed again. Rinse & repeat. The noise - if anything - just got louder... so I spoke up again. Both sides nice and polite. They said it was 'confusing' that it was so loud. I asked multiple times if they'd like to come down and hear it for themselves as they didn't understand how it could be so disruptive. They ignored every invite to come listen.

They would say he 'only walks' on days I would be woken up in the morning - by running. They were/are defensive and looking for excuses. I get it. In many ways, I am not surprised. They kept saying they were 'being mindful' - but nothing ever changed. If the noise had reduced by 20% since I complained; at least that would be something. But there was literally no change.

I was transparent about having Bose headphones, white noise machines, etc... so they could see that I was doing things to drown out the noise from my side.

After 18 months of it happening on an almost daily basis, I complained to my building management Co. I had complained to management before - but their response was 'there's nothing we can do'. They didn't even pass on my sentiments to the owners of the flat.

This time I didn't relent - and asked them to pass/forward my email to the actual owners of the apartment upstairs. (Upstairs are renters). They did indeed forward my email to the owners.

I got a response saying the owners had spoken to their tenants - and the tenants have agreed to buy a rug and will 'try to control the movements of their child when possible'.

I took this as somewhat helpful - and was more angry that I was proven right in that what they'd done for the year prior - was nothing at all - certainly in terms of practical measures when they had told me there was nothing more they could do. Over the 18 months; there was one occasion where I (politely) asked what they had done to mitigate the noise... they didn't respond. (They have hardwood floors throughout).

For 8 weeks, they seemed to promptly stop the running in the middle of the night/early hours (which I only wanted stopped at unreasonable hours anyway) - but now we are back to square one it seems. I'm mindful of it being Winter (dark and awful weather outside) and also Christmas season, but I'm not sure why it keeps happening. They say the best they can do is 'try' to control it.

AIBU for not relenting and to keep complaining to management? The tenants have stopped opening my messages now.

Your poor child. You absolute fruit loop.

What disciplinary measures would you use? Out of interest?

And if you did all that and your child didn't stop?

And he isn't stomping all night, op herself cites about 3 episodes fo stamping early morning on 2 different nights that's she's documents so if it's been all night that'd be documented.

And if you disciplined a child, and you sued every parenting technique available and researched more, sought help from a health visitor, a neurologist, a neuropsychologist and a sleep specialist practitioner and still the child stomped 3 separate times in an early morning... What then?

Poor ADHD riddled boy is some severely ableist language by the way.

@beanontoast theres no point. @Cmonluv obviously doesn’t discipline and thinks having sen (or being a child who may or may not have sen?) is an excuse to make other people’s lives hell and there shouldn’t be any repercussions.

I'm so confused, how do you think I do or don't discipline my children?

"Imagine wanting to be able to relax and enjoy your own home!"

You could say the exact same about the upstairs neighbours though.
I Imagine they also very much feel like they cannot relax or enjoy their own home now for fear of causing issues with OP - It's a 5 year old, aside from physically restraining the kid, what are they supposed to do?
I can't imagine asking a 5 year old nicely not to would accomplish much, so then what, a punishment/telling off that'll cause a tantrum probably? Or shouting even? Getting stressed & frustrated worrying about their downstairs neighbour, thereby causing more noise because the child will be able to sense this in the atmosphere?

Look, I get where OP is coming from, I truly do - but at the same time that's part and parcel of living in a block of flats and what else are they supposed to do?
OP also doesn't know for definite that their neighbours had done nothing prior to contacting the landlord/owners, they're assuming they've done nothing because it doesn't feel like they have to OP - We don't know for sure either way, assuming only leads to more resentment.
I'm sorry but in a block of flats, you're not the only one wanting to be able to relax and enjoy their own home.

The tenants likely have 0 choice about their hardwood floors, and there's usually rules in the tenancy about not carrying out extensive redecorating.
Changing wood to carpet is pretty extensive.

I used to live in a flat, moved literally a month ago and our downstairs neighbour would bang on our ceiling really aggressively that we were making noise despite us both being sat in chairs, with headphones on, not chatting to friends or anything, I would be drawing (not exactly a noisy activity) and my partner would be doing his own thing, usually playing a card game.
Just one of us getting up to go for a wee was enough to rile him up.
We said we'd get a rug.
Rugs of appropriate sizes are fucking EXPENSIVE. So much that we just flatly couldn't afford one.
We got a rug off my mum that she was going to throw away to appease him.
It did the job for about a week before he started up again banging on our ceiling aggressively.

We ended up so on edge (we both already have anxiety disorders), constantly tip toeing around our home, literally whispering to each other to talk and nothing was ever enough for our neighbour.
So, I'm sorry - But " Wanting to be able to relax and enjoy your own home" 100% goes both ways in this type of thing.
It's not your neighbours fault that the flats have hard floors, or that the building wasn't sufficiently sound proofed/purpose built as flats, and realistically I just don't know what you want them to do.
Imo even asking them to get rugs is kind of a big ask, rugs are bloody expensive and presumably from OP's unhappy response that they got a rug for the bedroom once they were contacted by the owners, one rug will not satisfactory.
How many rugs will it take?
What if the rug does nothing to dampen the volume of the noise?

@SpicyMoth what is with the thankfully few of you who think it’s ok to just say ‘I’ve tried’ and let it carry on. There’s been loads of answers on what the parents could do, starting with communication and ending with staying in the child’s bedroom having milk/iPad/book handy because nighttime is for staying in your bedroom and not stomping around.
when they’re evicted for noise disturbance everyone can relax in their homes can’t they.

I'm baffled as to what you think I do? Keeping drink, toys, screen, audiobooks and headphones, a bed tent so he feels safe all ok hand, you expect what? If that doesn't work? Physically restraining a 5 yr old into submission? Really what? And it's not an I've tried it didn't work fuckit, in my case it's I constantly creatively try new things when needed, I rarely sleep, hence this chat, I have a seizure alarm and video monitor to watch for so can't physically sleep IN his bed as the equipment won't work.

When I say if you think you have advice that would be helpful I'd happily hear it I'm not being sarcastic. But if a neurologist, neuropsychologist, specialist epilepsy team, and the sleep clinic have so far failed in insure what your area of expertise is that would help?

I really want to hear the feedback when op reports to the council and investigation is carried out. I hope we get updates.

@Cmonluv frankly I don’t believe for one second that you A. Have all that. B. Have had 4 professionals fail.

dunno, maybe traumatise him and take him away from everything he knows? Oh wait, that’s only if a neighbour is bothering you isn’t it.

I am in the exact same situation as you with 2 sen children and strangely I don’t think that means they can disturb neighbours at stupid o’clock in the morning. I don’t sit and watch them jump about, bang doors, scream and whatever else thinking ‘they’ve got sen never mind the neighbours’ my son is nearly 14, I sleep in his room, he sleeps on average 5am-7am waking up from night terrors, he slee walks and sleep talks and my daughter is an absolute bloody nightmare. And I’m on my own. You’re not the only person with a sen child who is struggling but that still doesn’t give anyone the right to cause disturbances for neighbours on a regular basis.

Noise disturbances are exactly that. Not sure why you think a sob story about an undiagnosed child with (maybe) adhd is going to change that?

Well this conversation isn’t helping me sleep.

cmonluv if I were you I wouldn’t respond further to chimchimigee or beansontoast.

You have politely asked them to consider the potential other side of the story and to consider the consequences of their recommendations, ie a homeless family in winter. You haven’t said it is that way, only asked them to consider it.

In response they’ve called you mad (but in ruder language) and insulted your parenting (very rudely).

You sound like a lovely person who would be a genuinely interested and caring neighbour.

Nighty night

"starting with communication and ending with staying in the child’s bedroom having milk/iPad/book handy because nighttime is for staying in your bedroom and not stomping around."

Why are you assuming they're not doing this and the child is continuing in spite of their attempts?

"when they’re evicted for noise disturbance everyone can relax in their homes can’t they."

Seriously? The goal is to have them evicted? With a 5 year old?
Wow.

Seizure alarm is for his seizures as they are so severe he has had several that would have killed him if undetected and untreated

Hence he's under neurology
Who referred us to neuropsychology after regressions in sleep and aggression after his most recent prolonged seizure which almost killed him.

He has medication known to effect his sleep and behaviour but better that than the seizures.

So we have a bed alarm and an accompanying monitor.

And of course I don't watch him do any of those things, I do what I'm sure you've done many time, I pick him up and move him onto soft sensory mats, I softly restrain against meltdowns, I keep all I have to hand and I sleep very little.

Neither of my children are awful though, he's amazing, he tries his absolute best to sleep and we're hoping the medication trial were waiting for will make a difference for him.

He's been through so much and despite it he's clever, sweet, loving, resilient etc etc.

It's fine to sympathise with op, it's fine if you think your kids are awful. I have fought hard for everything my child has to keep him alive and developing and I don't need you to believe it but not believing it is bloody weird

What makes you think they are doing all that? Is it because they told op they’re doing all they can to help? Oh no they didn’t actually communicate at all did they.

you do know being evicted doesn’t mean they’re going to be on the streets cap in hand? Firstly OP said nothing about getting them evicted and secondly if they were they could bid on a property more suitable for a 5 year old.

If your children are doing these things they're probably disturbing your neighbours. Can't youfix those things with some warm milk and an iPad 🤔🙄

Good for you. How does any of that give you such in-depth knowledge of a child with no diagnosis who is running round?

how can you say OP should sympathise with the parents because of how difficult it is and then turn around and say your child is an angel - so actually you don’t have any idea about trying all this things and them not working do you.

The difference is, as I said before, I am open with my neighbour and communicate and these things don’t happen several times a night because I parent my children.

I have all this stuff ready, I’ve tried everything, numerologist neuropsychologist epilepsy team and sleep clinic have all failed, I’m constantly creating new things, nothing works…

he tries his absolute best to sleep, he’s amazing.

yeah of course. I have to say though I did enjoy your story of the wee little sen boy tiptoeing around for a glass of milk while the mean nasty neighbour tries to get him and his lovely, tired parents on the streets, just after Christmas so he can freeze those poor non stomping feet off.

If someone wanted to complain they could say he thunders down the stairs before I can catch him st5am or at midnight when refusing to sleep.

His night terrors where he s teams like a banshee and fights imaginary monsters that randomly crop up for weeks at 2am would annoy some people, we have techniques but it doesn't stop them

He sleeps on average 6 hours a night just now.

When he had his aggression issues in the summer he'd tackle me to the ground and punch me in the head but turns out these were post absence seizure episodes.

I've listed all we've done to get him to sleep.

Yet the same child snuggle up to me at 2am and tells me he loves me.the whole world and I'm the bestum in the world, tells me I'm so cosy and make him feel safe. He knows everything about every Pokémon and will tell em about it the entire time he's awake he's not awful, he's got challenges and it's my job as his parent to navigate them. And I do. However tonight he had a sensory meltdown while I rinsed his hair and screamed he wanted me to die as I was trying to kil him. I dealt with it but it could very well annoy a neighbour.

We're all just doing the best we can and it sounds like op would find your children and mine a challenge to live near

If you re-read my first post here, I'm not, I'm simply not automatically assuming that they are doing nothing.

"OP also doesn't know for definite that their neighbours had done nothing prior to contacting the landlord/owners, they're assuming they've done nothing because it doesn't feel like they have to OP - We don't know for sure either way, assuming only leads to more resentment."

It's not wise imo to automatically assume the worst of someone, especially when it's a neighbour and you have to live next to them.

There's no need to be so hostile? Everyone is allowed to offer different perspectives on a thread, that's the whole point of AIBU is it not?

"Firstly OP said nothing about getting them evicted"
No, but you did - and I was responding to you in that moment.
I could've assumed that of OP but chose not to as is evident in my original post because it's unhelpful to assume the worst of someone - You brought it up, so I responded to that. I think is fair to do to be honest?

He does try, the 2 aren't mutually exclusive, he lies down and closes his eyes and then cries and screams because he feels like he's falling and he's scared he won't wake up and he can't keep his body still as his legs jerk as he's trying to falls sleep.

He is genuinely wonderful, a child can have SEN challenges, can sap every ounce of energy from you and you can still have compassion for them and love them with everything you have and think they are wonderful.

He sounds very, very similar to my son. Post absence seizures is brutal in my experience. My kids are wonderful, they can be awful at times as can every child.

I’m lucky that my house is semi detached and my neighbour is lovely. She knows about their needs, she knows I’m not murdering my child and just washing his hair and when I know that I’d be upset if I was her I get her some flowers or chocolates and apologise for the noise and thank her for being understanding etc

scared he won’t wake up my son is the exact same, it’s so heartbreaking because he needs to sleep, I can’t say oh don’t worry you can sleep next week. I’ve tried everything and at times I genuinely feel like I’m losing the plot.

Same, she's 97 and raised 7 kids, 1 with a genetic disability.

No parent wants their kid up running round at night. My kid isn't a bear, neither is yours and neither is the one op is complaining about. He's a kid likely doing his best.

I'm not saying my version of what's happening is Def correct but it's as likely as the idea these parents watch their kid rampage and do nothing as op suggests.