To expect my ASD daughter to love me?

[CryingCaroline]

I’ve just had a heartbreaking conversation with my ASD daughter ( 12 years old ) where she said that she doesn’t feel she loves me, or anyone.

I feel terrible because I burst into tears and she just looked at me and said “ This is why I don’t tell you the truth and just say I love you back when you say it “

It feels physically painful for me to think my young daughter doesn’t love me and possibly never did - she certainly acted like she did when she was younger but as puberty hit she has become far colder and less emotional.

Thank you for your explanation.
Logically I can make sense of it all, emotionally I’m struggling to know she does not feel the automatic sense of love that I feel towards her.
After she ate lunch she said to me “ I don’t understand what even upset you as I like you more than anyone else so isn’t that enough? “
So maybe for her, the word “ love “ doesn’t sit correctly as thinking back to times she has replied when I tell her I love her, occasionally she would say “ I love you in a parent and child way “ as if she needed to outline it is not a romantic feeling she has

YANBU

dont take this as she doesn’t love you. She just might not understand what love is.

DH had this issue with DD. He has ASD and came to me when DD was 6 months old and confessed he didn’t love her, and was terrified that she would find out or know. He was devastated.

I asked him

Do you care when she is hurt?
Yes
Do you want her to be happy?
Yes
Do you look forward to seeing her when you come home from work?
Yes
Do you worry about her in the day?
Yes
Do you ever want to live a life without her in it?
No

I just said to me that sounds a lot like love.

She sounds very very much like my 12 year old daughter who also is autistic and has ADHD. She has never said she doesn’t love me but I can definitely imagine her saying it!! She has said word for word about not trusting anyone at school and if anything was wrong she would wait till she comes home if needed (which she did actually do once with quite a serious injury) She also sometimes says she trusts no one, not even me. Although her actions say otherwise.
She does often accuse me of not loving her or not liking her or thinking she’s ugly or fat etc.
The way I deal with it is to be very calm and just tell her that I love her very much and love spending time with her, she is beautiful inside and out etc. it usually turns out that some thing is bothering her when she has an outburst like that and a while later after I’ve reassured her she will offload what has been bothering her. It’s like she needs to test me to check I’m safe to confide in before she does!
I would say she isn’t very emotionally literate and can’t understand what she feels or what ‘love’ means but her actions sound as though she loves and trusts you very much so I’d go by her actions rather than her words. It’s not easy raising almost teen autistic daughters! Sounds like you are doing a great job.

Tell her there are different kinds of love

I have two (possibly three) autistic children. The eldest can express love, but long stopped being very physical with hugs and such. Middle one will only repeat back ‘love you’ at rare times, he doesn’t have the capacity for social communication and I expect he’ll never be able to verbalise caring feelings. I know he does love me though, the fact in any time of worry or pain it’s mum he always calls for (even at school and I’m not there). Just because they can’t work out these feelings and verbalise them, it’s very very unlikely those feelings of love aren’t there. The youngest won’t say ‘love you’ at all, but is very huggy which suits me fine!

I had a traumatic childhood and I did and still do find it difficult to communicate emotions whatever they are. I’m not sure if I’m autistic myself (certainly ADHD) but I can understand that barrier. It’s different as a parent as the love we feel for them is so overwhelming that sometimes it’s difficult to comprehend that they don’t or cant reciprocate that, but it doesn’t mean it’s not there.

My DD has alexithymia - it can be really hard to get your head around, and even harder to not take things personally!

www.autistica.org.uk/what-is-autism/anxiety-and-autism-hub/alexithymia

This is helpful to understand. As a pp said, my DD is very good at explaining her thought process and without very black and white descriptions of words, she cannot label things. There is no "best fit" for her - things either fit exactly or not at all.

If you asked her about being excited, or sad, or any other feeling, you would probably get a similar response! It doesn't mean she doesn't love you, it means that she doesn't understand what you are asking when you ask that. Ask her what she thinks love is - and that may help you to see. We have to ask very specific questions to understand her feelings. If you ask if she is okay -that is not specific enough. But it is very hard.

Damian Milton is good on this. What you're describing sounds like a classic double empathy problem. https://www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/professional-practice/double-empathy

Love is quite an abstract concept. I’m not sure I could fully explain it to anyone.

I’d see it as her not understanding what love is, rather than her not loving yours if that makes sense?

She does love you, she just doesn't perceive the emotion in the standard way that society describes it. So don't worry about that.

I'm a bit more concerned about the dynamic where she expects there to be no practical reciprocation in your relationship. At 12 she should be starting to learn that this is necessary, I don't want to say learn that the world doesn't revolve around her as that sounds a bit rude and harsh, but hopefully you know what I mean.

Bless you OP. It's thankless task parenting at times.

Could she have PMT or be about to start her periods? I only ask as DD was all over the shop when hers started. I think when we are older we forget what an emotional time it can be.

"She said the issue for her is the clear definition of the word love."

It's likely it really is that simple. I'm autistic, and I always struggled with the definition of "love", particularly since it obviously means different things in different contexts, and there's basically no reference material to work from.

This is something that's phenomenally easy for NTs, but not for someone autistic for whom details matter, and who can't just say things they don't know enough about to be able to categorically stand behind it.

Also worth bearing in mind that displays of love are very, very different with autistic people. We tend not to do the big, traditional demonstrations - buying flowers, giving cards on every occasion, constant physical contact etc. It's shown in very different ways; inviting you into our special interests, sharing our silence with you, fixing things that are broken for you, stopping what we're doing to talk to you even though it's painful to pull away from a special interest, even coming to you for company when we've had too much social activity because you're an intrinsic and necessary part of our safe environment...

Give it time

My ASD DD (17), never told me she loved me … though I told her every day. She has started to say it in the last few weeks, which has been lovely

I'd burst into tears too. It's natural, we aren't robots. It's a good lesson in how words have an impact and when you say them, you have to accept the consequences.
She does love you. She just doesn't really understand her feelings.
Teens see lots of examples of romantic love in their shows/movies/books/media. But parental love is usually shown as lacking or over bearing. Rarely is it healthy or do the parents in any situation believe their child or understand them.
She'll come out the other side of it.

Not everyone feels ‘love’ very much. It doesn’t mean that they dislike or hate, just that they don’t feel much for other people.

And even more people don’t identify their feelings as love, because it’s an airy concept without a clear single definition.

She might feel exactly as you do about her about you, but not identify that as love.

This has been an interesting thread. DH is almost certainly undiagnosed with ASD along with his family.

He is struggling with how he feels about his elderly parents. The rationality gets in the way of emotion I think. They sound miserable, are no fun to be with and constantly do things that aren’t necessarily the rational thing to do. Think refusing to change utility supplier while being overcharged, or continuing to buy more shopping than they use so the garage is overflowing and things are going out of date.

They don’t want to visit us, and don’t want to move anything to make space on chairs when we visit them.

He feels a really strong sense of loyalty towards them, but would struggle to say he loves them, at the moment!

My 12 year old DD is autistic. I tell her I love her every day. She asks me why I say it, she knows how I feel. I explain to her that it's my love language and it's important to me to say it.

We've had some really interesting conversations about different types of lpve. This thread has been really informative too.

She's able to freely express her love for our pets, when it comes to her family, it's more complicated I think. I know she feels it though. We're her safe place.

We’ve just had another conversation as she came and asked if I wanted to go bowling with her this evening.
She did this knowing full well I had arranged to see a friend for drinks this evening - it’s almost like she’s always testing to see what I will do for her so perhaps this lack of understanding what “ love “ means and looks like also explains that.
I’ve moved friends drinks to the weekend as I think it’s important she doesn’t feel she’s disappointed me in any way by being honest about her feelings and me crying like a baby!
She always asks if I want to do something rather than saying she wants to spend time with me and I’ve never understood why but perhaps it’s all confusing for her.
How she navigates at secondary school I don’t know - it must be so draining for her 😢

I have no advice op but I am finding this really thought provoking.

I also just want to say that you sound like a wonderful mum and she sounds like a fantastic daughter.

OP she loves you. She's just struggling with the abstract concept of what love is, probably giving it far more consideration than an NT child who would unthinkingly say I love you. And is honest to boot (something I recognise from my own 12yo ASD DD!) She loves you.

Did you say she has adhd as well as autism? The ‘testing’ your love, what you will and won’t do, sounds like it could be part of Rejection Sensitivity Dysphoria.

This sounds unbelievably painful OP. Trust me, one day she will come crawling back. Something will happen and she will realise that nobody can love her and sort it out quite like her mum can. And you can be ready then. But don’t let her hurt you. Take the bowling thing with a pinch of salt.

My adult child has ASD and will hug me when we meet and reply love you too if I say love you first.
However I do think it’s learnt behaviour; she has seen that’s what other people do and copies them.
Yes it does make me sad but I console myself with the fact that she does need me in some way.

Come crawling back?! She is a disabled child whose disability directly impacts how she understands her own and other people’s emotions, who had an honest conversation with her mother. She doesn’t have anything to come crawling back from!

This is quite common - as is looking at it through the NT lens and thinking she's testing.

Now, I'm only saying this because I've done the same thing in the past and I know a lot of other autistic folk with the same story. Her showing love is doing things rather than saying things - so her wanting to do something you'll enjoy with you immediately after seeing that she's upset you is exactly that, it's her saying "I love you - look! I want to spend time with you!". Also not understanding the consequences (you needing to change your plans)...very autism.

Asking if you want to do something rather than saying "I want to do <x> with you" is a bit of masking born out of not quite understanding NT communication - often NT folk will hint at things, so she's picked up that "Do you fancy doing <x>?" is equivalent, and therefore uses that all the time because she thinks it's what she's supposed to do, and it's become a habit because that's a problem that's been solved in her mind.

The above may not be exactly right - of course not all autistic people are alike - but it is a very common thing.