Not letting ex take baby on Xmas Day?

[confusedex2]

I have a DC with my ex who is 10 months old.

Ex has never had DC alone and sees them sporadically (once went almost 2 months without a visit) although has been getting better recently.

Exes parents have also only seen DC a few times. I've offered and invited them to things, offered to meet, but they've not taken me up on offers.

Ex wants to take DC to his parents for half the day on Xmas and thinks it's his and his parents right to have baby there on Xmas Day.

I've offered ex and his parents to come here and visit DC, but he thinks I'm being unreasonable to not let him take baby. His parents live 2 hours away and I'm also still breastfeeding.

Ex isn't on the BC. He does pay maintenance now though (after I went to CMS).

AIBU? Thanks

He has been getting better lately at seeing DC, which is why I feel a bit bad. But like you've all reminded me, I have offered an alternative.

I think they don't want that as they don't want their Xmas day plans interrupted to travel here possibly?

I've already been threatened with court by him over this.

From what I gather the family court usually sides with men these days. Partly why I'm conscious of trying to keep a good relationship and be seen to be doing the right thing/trying to establish the relationship.

Quite probably he would be granted some access. He would need to go to court though. And once that access is given he needs to stick to it, otherwise you can go back to court.

i also don’t believe anyone would drive 4 hours on Xmas day, spend 2 hours at his parents and drive 4 hours back without any issue. On this basis I wouldn’t allow him.

So you have to disrupt your plans and force the baby to endure a 4+ hour journey because they don't want to inconvenience themselves? 🙄🙄🙄

He can threaten you with court all he likes. You aren't withholding access.

My STBXH regularly threatens to take me to court over ‘his access’ to DS. (The use of the phrase access to rather than contact with is telling!)

He does it every time I don’t just give in to his (last minute) demands.

My solicitor wrote to him and asked him to propose a regular contact schedule in DS’s best interests. He refused to. He went on and on about how it must be flexible etc, etc. (flexible around his wants, not anyone else, of course).

My solicitor has advised me that he is very clearly not going to take me to court. A court will make a fixed order that he would be expected to stick to. He doesn’t want that. He just likes to make threats and throw his weight around to try to control me and get his own way.

She also wrote to him explaining that his behaviour constitutes harassment and he should stop or I will contact the police and pursue a court order about this.

The OP’s ex hasn’t even bothered to organise PR. He’s not going to take @confusedex2 to court. He just likes to scare her with threats about it. But he won’t do it because a court order diminishes his power and sets expectations for him to fulfil - in ways that his failure can be documented against.

Stop allowing him to contact you all the time. Make a special contact arrangements email or use a co-parenting app. Only contact him that way. Ignore him otherwise.

You don't want your Christmas Day plans interrupted by having to travel there.

And you are the baby's only caregiver, the only person with parental responsibility, which means they see the baby on your terms or not at all.

Who gives a shit what they want?

I think my ex would take me to court and he has the means to do so.

However I think he'd be surprised to find that he'd need to commit to set days.

He's said in the past he can't do this because of work (works away at certain times and schedule can be all over the place). I've asked him if we can build up to a set contact schedule and he'll say "you know I can't do that because of my job", and makes out like I'm being unfair.

I think he'd expect to walk in and have the court tell me that yes I should accommodate him whenever he wants to see baby and can fit it into his schedule.

I've been really flexible with him so far and most times he's asked to see little one I've accommodated it, there was only one time I had to say no/ask to do an alternative as I had plans.

My ex and his family always think they're right though.

Which is why you offer him to come on Xmas day and then that's that. No court would expect you to drive 2 hrs to facilitate access. The NRP usually has to make the effort

Read what @InefficientProcess says.

Let him take you to court. Don't see it as a threat, rather as a wake up call for him. He'll soon realise he has shot himself in the foot when he loses the flexibility you allow him and some of that power he holds over you.

Let him take you to court, @confusedex2.

You have nothing to fear. He will get a nasty surprise.

But make sure you keep copies of all communications between you so you can show the court that you have been more than willing to facilitate contact but he wants everything on his terms.

Keep everything, op. Texts, emails, letters, social media messages, answerphone messages - everything. Keep a journal of his interactions with you. Who said what and how it made you feel.

I wouldn't interact with his parents (who wanted you to terminate the baby, expect you to apologise for keeping and don't want to be around you). Just with the baby's father.

Offer contact on your terms - scheduled, at a place convenient to you, in a neutral public space etc. Always be seen to be open to sensible arrangements and be able to prove you are.

Don't go alone to meet them all. It's easy for three to bully and undermine one.

Continue to decline all attempts to get you to let them take the baby for Christmas. They're not a toy or a pet. At this age, separation can be distressing especially as your baby doesn't really know the father's side of the family.

You and your child are a unit. They don't get one without the other.

'I'd like to take my ex to court because she refuses to drive my 10 month old baby 4 hours on Christmas Day to my Mummies house where I'll be spending the day' Has she refused access? 'No, she invited us all around but I want to go to my Mummies at Christmas' 'Would you like regular contact?' 'No, I'm too busy to make regular time for my baby' 'Would you like parental responsibility?' 'No, I told her to abort so baby is her responsibility 'OK, Mr Manchild, if you pay me £450 I'll happily explain that court would recommend regular short contact that builds up and that you'd need to go to mediation before you can take her to court'.

I think whether courts appear to be very bad is in the case of abusive, useless men who have existing relationships with their dc. They seem to think these should be continued even when the men are, at best, unreliable and flakey and, at worst, genuinely abusive.

Situations like this are different and in both real life and on MN I have seen many similar cases where the man threatens court but does nothing or, if he does actually take it to court, he gets laughed out the room.

He does not have parental responsibility.
He has limited contact with baby
He refuses any kind of set schedule to see baby
He has zero experience of being with baby without your presence

Basically, a court would absolutely tell him he can and should have contact. But no court is going to insist he takes the baby away for an entire day by himself at this point.

Encourage court. He would be told he has to stick to a contact schedule. He won't.

Honestly see a solicitor. It will reassure you.

my STBXH has the means to take me to court. But he won’t. Because the court will insist on a set schedule in the child’s best interests.

The court isn’t going to say that he gets to decide on a daily or weekly basis whether he feels like seeing the child and tell me to make DS available. That’s what my ex wants.

A CAO would also strip him of any power to influence and control my life. He’d have set contact times and he couldn’t prevent me from doing anything during my time. What he wants is to be able to demand to see DS in 2 hours time and then throw a tantrum about me ‘denying him access’ if I say no.

Solicitors have seen men like this so many times. They shout about their rights and make demands. They threaten to go to court. But the reality of the view the court will take and the loss of control it will bring means they don’t do it.

STBXH sometimes shouts about 50-50. Except he tried to do 50-50 with his older kids. It fell apart in less than 3 months. And that was with me picking up the slack/helping with school runs etc. He has gradually dropped contact to one midweek and EOW with Friday night for himself. Hes often away on the midweek so that doesn’t always happen.

There is absolutely no way he can manage 50-50 with our DS, especially not alongside that contact arrangement. His other children live an attend school 15 miles away from where I live (and DS goes to nursery/will go to school). He can’t do the school runs required for all three children. He knows a court will recognise this. He doesn’t actually want 50-50 because he’d have to do things.

It’s all just empty threats! And he self-identifies as a martyr. He wants to create a fictional narrative of how his nasty ex denies him access.

See a solicitor. Get some advice.

I believed my STBXH about his threats to take me to court.

I sobbed in my solicitor’s office as I explained the problem. She was brilliant. Totally reassuring.

She very clearly explained that men like him rarely follow through with their threats of court. And even if he did, I have nothing to fear from a court order.

His response to her emails very clearly showed that she was right. It is all bluster and he just wants to control me.

The best thing you can do for yourself is to make an appointment with a solicitor. The initial assessment appointment may even be free and will give you the reassurance you need.

You need to ensure you have the correct information so that he can’t scare you and use that to control you.

I would wonder whether or not part of him/them knows its not possible and is saying he/his mum can do the old "we tried so hard 😪 I told you she was impossible and kept the baby from us!" to the family/friends when anyone with braincells knows its an impossible ask of an ineffective and absent father.

Say no. You know the baby they don't.

Tough luck they don't like being around you. You're the mum and the baby is too young to be with them. They don't sound kind or responsible.

I'd consider it when the baby is older but not now. They just want a certain family Xmas. Tough.

Also they sound so manipulative. Why don't they say to you, please could we arrange something at a time that suits you? The baby doesn't know Xmas presents are given on Xmas day. They can just give them another day.

Don’t worry about court you have all the messages about you offering and refsuimg.
You also have the proof he choose just recently to move away from his new child

Also that’s you aren’t refusing access just that he what’s you abs a baby to work around him ( who moved away ) and his parents . Also the fact he didn’t bother at the start and he is not stable because he didn’t what the bay is hos words .
keep it all for court of need be .
Im the mean time get ok with your life and enjoy your baby. 😊

Mr Manchild hahaahahah funny as

I just feel sick about the whole thing tbh.

I know no matter what I do I'll be the bad person, and I feel like I'm struggling to enjoy Christmas now.

Thank you all for the really good advice.

To reiterate my advice earlier on in the thread, I really would recommend changing your phone number and then getting a separate, basic PAYG phone which you can use to communicate with him.

That way he won't be able to contact you on your main phone number and you can just use the other phone when you actually need to communicate with him and switch it off for a bit if he starts to harass you or get abusive and you need to put him in time out.

I am really sorry about how this is impacting on you OP. You are not the bad person here so please try not to let these people make you feel that you are. You deserve your first Christmas with your baby to be a happy one & I wish you all the best.

You won’t be a bad person.

He’ll try to manipulate you into thinking you are. But that’s not the same thing.

Set boundaries. Limit his routes to you (so he can’t get inside your head). And get some legal advice so you know he’s talking shite.

He says I am denying my baby their family.

This part makes me chuckle. Yes, you're doing precisely that, because it's a crap family!

It's not your job to be objective, that's for a judge. It's your job to be brutally subjective in the name of protecting your baby. And you're doing that brilliantly.

Guilt-trippers are so pathetic and transparent it becomes comedic watching them get more and more frothy while doing exactly fuck all to be an actual parent.

It's OK to be the bad guy sometimes as a parent. Your job is to protect your child from things that will harm them.