To be annoyed by SIL making these comments towards my DD

[nhd]

SIL is very much a feminist, very woke etc but to the extreme. My DD is 3.

DD is the first grandchild to ILs and first niece / nephew to my SIL. (I think) she wants to remain child free at least for now, so she sees DD as her closest small person. SIL and PIL want to take an active part in the upbringing of my DD which I'm not necessarily against - the more loving people a child is surrounded by the better in my view. SIL and I aren't very close but we have a good relationship in that we get on when we are together but wouldn't choose to hang out as a 2 without my DH or wouldn't share deep personal secrets. All this is to say that SIL is a nice person, loves DD and doesn't make these comments maliciously I think, but they still really really irritate me and I think they're harmful.

Comments that she will make:
Eg1. We are discussing schools and I mentioned in passing mixed / single sex secondary school and dating boys. SIL instantly comments "or girls if she chooses to date them!"
Eg2. SIL comes over and DD shows her some biscuits that we made that afternoon whilst DH was at football. SIL "you know, just because you're a girl doesn't mean you need to stay home and bake. You could have gone to football with Daddy if you wanted" (DD was excited to bake, she has never expressed any interest in football).
Eg3. I am helping my daughter to put on a dress (gave her a choice of 2, she picked this one) before we go to a family function. SIL comes in (we don't live together but we were driving her there so she came to our house first) and DD runs to hug her but as we've got to leave, after a few mins, I say "come on, let's finish getting dressed, you'll look so pretty". At this point DD is wearing a stained vest, PJ bottoms and one sock. SIL "that's okay, you don't have to look pretty for anyone. You look how you like! Would you like to go like this?" I'm all for giving kids choices but surely I can at least encourage my daughter to wear clean clothes and dress up for occasions? Of course I'd let her wear something else if she didn't like a dress but why put ideas in her head?
Eg4. And the "you don't have to look pretty for anyone" is an ongoing thing. I was once putting on make up before heading out for date night, SIL came over to babysit. DD started copying me, pretending to put on make up, then came up to the mirror and said "wow so pretty, like mummy!" SIL once again said to her "but remember, you don't have to ever try to put on make up or change yourself to impress a man"

I have a friend who was never told she was pretty as a girl. It’s really affected her.

Well, maybe she wasn’t pretty? Lots of people aren’t.

Would you not tell your daughter she’s pretty, if you didn’t think so?

No.

But I am with the OP’s SIL.

I bet their parents roll their eyes at you and laugh at you behind your back. I would.

It is, actually. Especially the make up they do for fashion shows (or Goths when they go out to Goth clubs, you try drawing a spider web with eyeliner, and try and make it look good.)

I thought we'd got past denigrating things that are traditionally 'feminine'. Would the SIL be so upset if OP had a boy who wanted to wear make up and dresses? I doubt it.

My mum never wore skirts or dresses when I was growing up, and rarely wore makeup, I grew up to be the complete opposite! I blame my love of female fronted metal bands and Goth fashion. I've also grown up to be a radical feminist.

SIL is massively overstepping and needs to rein it in. I'd find that irritating. I'm fine with breaking down sex stereotypes, while recognising that people are going to fit into those stereotypes.

I’m with her sister too but not the way shes gone about it. I don’t think it has to be one or the other.

I find it dismaying: the thought that a mother would never tell their daughter she’s pretty, especially if she didn’t think so. In fact, I think if society doesn’t think it say so, it’d be me who does as their mother. But each to their own.

I would be rather irritated by her comments too. I think she is making assumptions that you are forcing gender stereotypes onto her when it sounds like she enjoys doing stereotypically girly things. There's nothing wrong with being "girly". Also the make up thing, it's like face painting it's fun. I spent hours doing it as a child and it wasn't to attract boys. Make up isn't always about attracting men I think half the time they don't even notice what is on our faces! Maybe she needs a different perspective on that too.

Perish the thought that a child be exposed to feminist concepts!

Indeed. It might warp her permanently.

I agree with you @CurlewKate but I'm not sure it's great delivery from SIL. There are better ways i think 🤔

She can be introduced to them without her mother being undermined. And even more importantly, without her own small achievements, that she's so proud of, being undermined.

Again, who responds to a 3 year old rushing to show them something that she's made and is proud of, with a 'yes, but...'?

@Tandora right... so, because she's three, I should continue taking her to football just because she can go to football, even if she asks instead to bake at home?
No, thanks. She'll be doing whatever she enjoys and asks for. Whether that's football or baking

I think it’s cute (and delusional) that people think we can (and even should) raise kids in a total neutral and free environment so that they can grow up 100% not influenced by absolutely anything. As if that is even possible and desirable! Fuck that, my kids, my rules, I will and I should influence with whatever I think it’s best for them, not force them to be something they don’t want to, obviously, but no, I won’t “expose” them to a variety of opinions and points of view and activities and toys and white neutral clothing shit just to see if they could be remotely interested in something different. I will expose them to my values, and my culture, my religion, my morals. I won’t purposely hide from things, we live in society so if different things naturally come up I’ll explain in an age appropriate way that I deem correct an they are gonna be taught to respect and value other opinions and culture and that’s it. I raise my daughter to be feminine and proud of being a girl, yes she can also be funny, smart, brave, etc, but she is a female before all that. Other people are free to have kids and raise them as they like, even if I don’t agree I’d never meddle like this SIL, I wonder if people that are clapping this woman for “showing DD different points of view” would be clapping if she was talking about wearing burkas of marrying as a virgin, or saying they should pro-life and against abortion. I find amazing the hipocrisy of the woke people, they want freedom and equality but if and only if you follow their agenda.

Yawn. Haven’t you figured out the difference between ‘female’ and ‘feminine’ yet? Suppose your daughter isn’t interested in the latter?

What is 'feminist' about 'baking is lame and for girls, so girls should play football whether they like it or not'?

Although I don't completely agree with everything you say, I do completely agree with your wider point that the SIL is trying to impose her worldview on her niece. I also agree that the responses on here would be different if the niece were a tomboy and the SIL were a 'girly' girl who told her niece that she should wear a pretty dress and bake instead of going to football.

Your SIL sounds great. I personally don't think she sounds too extreme, but as she isn't a primary caregiver any messaging from her will be slightly diluted anyway. If you can grin and bear it, she sounds like a positive and loving influence on your daughter.

Except it is a form of art....... Are you this dismissive of all hobbies?

@VanityDiesHard

What is 'feminist' about 'baking is lame and for girls, so girls should play football whether they like it or not

Except that is not what SIL said.

Maybe not in so many words, but it was strongly implied.

@VanityDiesHard

I think that's just your interpretation / spin on it but it's certainly not reflected in the wording shared by the OP.

'Just because you're a girl doesn't mean you have to stay home and bake. You could have gone to football with Daddy'.
I'm sorry, but in what way does that NOT imply that baking is the inferior option, that girls get as a consolation prize, instead of getting to enjoy the almighty football?! There is something so dismissive about the wording 'stay home and bake' as if baking is a silly little hobby instead of an art form. And what is worse is that the little girl was proudly showing off her creation to her aunt, only to have it waved and away and dismissed because watching people running around after a ball is so much better. It makes me laugh how regressive some 'feminist' points of view really are.

Hold up, if there is no such thing as 'man's work' and 'women's work' then why is it unfeminist to be a SAHM? It is just work? I don't think your points add up at all.

SIL would be getting on my nerves with the constant you don't have to do.....
You cross each bridge as you some to it.
If she expresses a feeling you got with that, but to constantly bombard the child would get very overbearing.