To tell my friend her ds is a shit?

[MidnightMidwinter]

I made friends with a very lovely lady 11 years ago through our NCT group. We’re really close - been on holiday together multiple times, always round each other’s houses etc. Our sons were in the same class at primary school and were pretty good friends, mainly because we did stuff all together at weekends though, tbh, as they’re both very different kids.

Both our DSs have started at the same secondary in September. DS and friend’s DS were put in different tutor groups and no longer really hang out at all as friend’s DS is sporty and play football at lunchtimes and my ds doesn’t. We live pretty rurally and it’s a 45 minute journey door to door. They get the bus Mon-Weds but I give them a lift on Thursday and Friday as it’s on my route. Friend’s DS lived about 100m away from us so not going out of my way at all to pick him up and it’s just what you do, isn’t it?

Anyway, in about May I got a converted van that I use as my car. It’s my pride and joy and I try and keep it as clean as possible as never had a nice vehicle before. Every time I’ve given friend’s DS a lift he’s immediately started eating his lunch in the van and I ask him not to. He huffs and rolls his eyes but will eventually put his sandwich away, always after having made an seemingly deliberate amount of mess in doing so. Not just a few crumbs but smears of jam on the seats/ crisps stamped into the floor kind of thing.

On Thursday I dropped them off, said “gooodbye” and friends DS opened his hand, showed me 4 little black plastic things and smirked at me. I was confused and didn’t think much more about it. Then on Friday I noticed he was fiddling with the sliding curtain that goes across the window next to where he sits. I ask him to stop as I need to see out of the window and again he huffs, rolls eyes and says “fine” before carrying on for a few seconds and eventually stopping.

Cleaning out the van this weekend I open the sliding door and the curtains just fall off their runners. Looking at the opposite window I see there are little black plastic bits on the end of each runner to stop this happening. I’m 99% sure this is what friend’s DS showed me on Thursday morning and then he then decided to unthread the curtains on Friday on purpose.

I’m so bloody angry with him. It’s such a nasty thing to do and I almost feel like I’m being bullied by an 11yo! I know if I tell his mum it will be a huge issue - she’s forever going on about people making things up to get him into trouble, convinced that he’s a very sweet boy, just overconfident and that people don’t like that. But he’s not, he’s just a shit. I am absolutely not giving him lifts anymore.

I thought I’d give it a few days to make sure I wasn’t blowing it out of proportion but I’m still furious. AIBU to tell my friend this or am I just being over precious about my van?

Tell her while you're explaining why you won't be giving him any more lifts. And mean it.

Question, and sorry if I missed it.
Do you just give lifts? Why doesn’t she? What’s in it for you?

I had a mother tell me her son had not done something when I had personally seen him do it. He had done something to a boy known to be naughty and blamed the other child. But I was standing behind them, saw it clearly and told their teacher this time it was entirely the fault of butter wouldnt melt in his mouth kid. Mums can be totally blind to their son's faults, doesnt seem to happen as much with daughters.

Keep it calm and factual but if she hasnt accepted before he is less than perfect she is unlikely todo so now.

This was a friend of mine

I had a ds (my no3) and she had her first ds 3 months apart (she went on to have 2 dds)

As they grew up,hers could do no wrong at all-I've seen her see them do something naughty and still she'd still deny it

Other parents/teachers/compete strangers where making up lies about her kids

Shed go out of her way to fill me in on any wrongdoings of my lot (and there where times they had been naughty-i dealt with them) but hers was the perfect angels no matter what happened

He was (and still is) a spoilt,nasty,entitled snobby,smirking little fucker (and his sisters are the same)

She did him no favours-he grew up and has very few friends and struggles to hold down a job while his mummy coos at him about how perfect he is (while throwing money at him)

I'd have a word but be prepared to walk away from the friendship if needed-these parents cannot be reasoned with

You need to broach, just as factually as possible and do it in his presence so you both see his reaction at the same time. Be confident he did it, don't fanny about asking if he did it, or did he see, or does he know or try to sugar coat it. You know he did it so say it.

He was playing with the blind, he was asked stop, he showed you little black things and took them away smiling. You didn't twig what they were at the time but now you have seen the blind is broken and looked you know exactly what they were. It could only have been done deliberately and it is unacceptable.

Ask how they are going to fix it. Offer to, if he returns the plastic bits there and then, apologies that you will try to fix with glue and if it doesn't work he will have to pay to fix it. Then going forward, it is his choice - rules are no food and no fiddling in the car, no more warnings, one more problem and the lifts have to stop.

I would no longer give him a ride...period. I'd call the Mom and let her know you aren't willing to take him so she can make other arrangements.

Asking the questions, or avoiding answering them?

Yanbu at all

what does your ds think of him?

I would also stop the lifts but it’s going to be very tricky to approach this with his mother without damaging your friendship sadly, unless she totally understands what he’s like and it sounds like she doesn’t

I’m usually one for being direct and quite confrontational, BUT, I think in this scenario I would just tell friend a white lie and say I can’t do lifts anymore for Damien xyz reason.

She doesn’t around receptive at all and I wouldn’t want my own son to be bullied by Damien at school once his Mother tells him I’m no longer giving lifts because of the damage etc. He won’t be told he’s in the wrong anyway and children like that can lash out and get spiteful.

Tell your son you’re fed up of Damien and would rather just drive him and will be telling a white lie like ‘sorry we have to be really tight on timings now and will be shopping and visiting family after and so can’t commit to taking him anymore sorry.’
Then I’d focus on my own child and not worry about taking this little shit anymore. No it’s not just the done thing to ferry someone’s child around 4 times a week (with each journey there and back). Do they even offer you petrol money? I bet your child would be happier having alone time in the car too!!

This with bells on!! I bet your DS doesn’t love sitting in the car with this shit either.

I'd go round and tell her exactly what you have said here. That her dc showed you pastic bit in his hands, smirked at you and pocketed them wihtout saying anything and now you discovered he must have peeled them off curtain rails as they have fell off, please could you have them back.

Can't you approach it like this: Hi friend can you ask Damien to give back the little plastic hooks he took out my car. I didn't realise why he was holding them up to me. But now realised they're my curtain hooks.
See how she reacts.
Then decide how to proceed

DS is fed up with him. When I told him he just rolled his eyes and said “that sounds about right”. They aren’t enemies or anything but they steer clear of each other. DS walks past our house on the way to and from school and doesn’t knock for ds, despite them getting the same bus. Luckily, DS has made some really good friends who also get the bus and he sticks with them.

[Edited by MNHQ to remove name]

I think you’ll probably still give him a lift. As soon as the sandwiches come out open the door & tell him to get out. The mother will never believe you, so you have nothing to lose.

I give lifts because I pretty much drive past their house and drive right by the school on Thursdays and Fridays. It’s only on the way in, they still bus home. Friend doesn’t do fits simply because her work isn’t in that direction.

Don't be ridiculous.

I think you tackle this face to face. Tell her that you are considering stopping the lift giving arrangement. Tell her it's because her little angel not only repeatedly gets food out when you've asked him not to, he also deliberately smears it around your car. The final straw was when he did... etc etc. You'd like the curtain rail fittings returned or replaced before he gets in your car again. This is his final warning, any more messing about and he won't be in your car again.
In other words - get assertive and sort it.

How about as soon as the sarnies come out you stop, grab them and throw them in the nearest hedge? Telling him if he doesn't behave he'll be joining them. 😂

Well, stop the lifts. If she asks why, tell her he's damaging your vehicle and won't abide by your rules.

Why put yourself through this stress? It's not your responsibility to get him to school. He sounds like a right little bastard.

Is his name actually Damien? Cause that's just too perfect. I would be fuming and would immediately call her to have her ask him about the pieces.

I wouldn’t tell her I would talk to him directly because you know him well enough. I would start by asking where the black bits are and what happened that they came off.

The knots people tie themselves into on here to come up with more and more outlandish explanations for shit behaviour is hilarious isn't it?

Simplest explanation is usually the right one.

If you can manage it, do give the mother the reasons why you no longer can take him. It sounds like he’s on track to develop some real behavioural issues. She might protest at the time but she needs an opportunity to confront the problem and take action. If she doesn’t then at least you’ve tried. But now you are fully entitled to protect yourself from further unpleasantness from Damien and stop the lifts.

"Hi Jane, just a heads up that I won't be giving Thomas a lift home on Thursdays and Fridays going forward. I didn't mention it earlier, as I didn't want to cause an issue between us two, but he's been very rude in the car. I've repeatedly asked him not to eat in the car, yet have repeatedly found jam wiped on the seats and crisps crunched into the floor. And on Friday he took the runners off the blinds and left with them. I only know because he showed me them in his hand as he got out, but I have only just made the connection as to what they were when I saw the damage to the blinds over the weekend.
Frankly, I've got no interest in having a kid around who deliberately vandalises my vehicle."

Don't offer "if he apologises etc I might re-consider" etc. The arrangement is OFF. You aren't bargaining with his mum. You are simply reporting a fact to her. The fact being that he isn't welcome in your car from this day onwards.

She doesn't sound like someone I'd want to be friends with.

Be honest and direct with her and very matter of fact and if she tries to help cause Damien's behaviour then let them both go.