To not understand this trend of men waiting until middle age to commit

[Ageingisaprivilegedeniedtomany]

I've seen on here a few times and irl that early 30s is apparently too young for men to settle down these days and most don't contemplate it until nearer 40?
I just don't understand tbh, 30 is relatively young but they're not 21 year olds.
I'm 32 and recently left a 29 year old who wouldn't commit. My Mum keeps telling me I need someone a lot older, but tbh I don't want anyone significantly older.
Also hearing that most men are ambivalent about having children and do it to keep their partners happy.
Just feel a bit fed up tbh. Obviously it's a massive generalisation but I just don't get it and hope it isn't entirely true

I agree. I love the choice to be childfree, career-oriented and to spend my life energy/earnings/resources seeing the world and working on causes that are important to me, rather than being saddled with children and domesticity. Or, as you say, having to put up with shit partners because of financial or offspring ties. Ugh.

There's no way I'd want to go back to the past as a woman either.

Some people romanticise it and often forget just how difficult it was for so many women.

So true, particularly the second paragraph

It is not the sex part that is the issue. Unless you are religious or from a culture that favours arranged marriage (each to their own). It is that women living with men before understanding what the commitment is. If you prefer marriage, an engagement and getting married within the year is perfectly flexible. Stay independent until then. Marriage and dc are a serious business, have respect for yourself and your future do not play a wife role. If he is worth it then so are you.

We bought a home and got married within the space of 2 months but we had the wedding booked and were engaged.
If my dh had wanted to live with me indefinitely, my parents would have thought he had no respect for their daughter or family…

Dh did not have to be told though, he came from a solid family where that was the norm, and we both had our flings when younger but
they were not living and future situations.

Marriage and dc are a serious business, have respect for yourself and your future do not play a wife role. If he is worth it then so are you.

Agree with this. Have some expectations; don't hand the man everything on a silver platter and then expect him to step up. This site is absolutely rife with tales of woe from women who thought they were being cool and flexible and end up getting stuck an impoverished single parent whose children are damaged by a shit and indifferent father.

Yet there's also just as many posts about women in awful marriages who feel stuck/trapped and are struggling to get out. Said man is also usually a shit father.

Arseholes are arseholes. Marriage doesn't give you a personality transplant.

No, but it does provide legal protection. And insisting on marriage before cohabitation, children and mingling finances is one way to winnow out at least some of the assholes.

Yet there's also just as many posts about women in awful marriages who feel stuck/trapped and are struggling to get out. Said man is also usually a shit father.

But at least these women have some legal/financial come-back, due to being married

There's no way in hell I'd marry someone before experiencing living with them.

There's no way in hell I'd marry someone before experiencing living with them.

Me neither. But there’s no way I would have a baby with a man who wasn’t prepared to marry me first

We did get married before having a baby but it wasn't a must for me. Then again, a baby wasn't either.

Yes. Even if the relationship doesn't work out there is more financial security

@Justfinking Yes, I hope things are changing, because if some men only agree to have children because they love the people they’re with and then they're usually crap fathers and husbands and everyone is miserable it doesn’t sound much like love to me!
It sounds like making a complete mess of your own and other people’s lives. ☹️

I think society has already changed, tbh. My DH’s siblings range from late 40’s to late 50’s and they didn’t feel pressured to have children in the way that adults in the 1960’s/70’s/80’s might have.

Exactly, @LaurieStrode , it’s having the choice that's important and we’re so lucky to live in an era where women can enjoy sex without constant fear of pregnancy. The Pill wasn’t even available on the NHS to unmarried women until 1967-it’s hardly surprisingly that many women ended up in domestic situations that they didn’t want.

I have two sons, one is 34 and no relationship that we know of. DS2 is 32 and married with 3 children the eldest of whom is heading for 7 . He's an excellent dad, really hands on and he's adored by his children.

My husband was 33 when we married. Most of my school friends seemed to have married young to men and women roughly the same age. Only a couple of us married older men.

I’ve experienced the opposite - that men always want to commit far more than I do.

How peculiar. My two adult sons are very keen to be fathers. So was my dh. In fact I can think of more young men who openly look forward to parenthood than young woman

Thought that was common knowledge 🙄

Yes, seen this a number of times.
All financial security built up gone through expensive fertility treatments,
Career carefully planned and advanced put on hold caring for additional needs children,
Significant illness of one parent diagnosed before child starts secondary school,
One or both parents struggling to adapt to family life because they have such established routines,
Not being able to reduce the work ethic established to become successful to balance family needs,
All can happen at any stage of course when you have a family, but much more likely if you start family later in life.
I will say most of us will see it if we look around.
Balanced of course against you are more likely to be able to house your family and not be constantly on a tight budget, which is more common if you start early.
But later starting of your family has some very specific challenges and possible issues.

Why? What's so awful about doing things they way your friends did. They may well be looking at you thinking 'Christ I'm so glad I didn't settle down so early like Humbugg did. Lost all their youth....'

Not if you're a man. Frankly it's not their problem if we run out of fertile years when they can be with women who still are fertile. People should settle down when they are ready. Not when their partner is

Don’t know what you’re eye rolling at. Given the amount of thanks my post has and the amount of people who’ve agreed with me & said similar throughout the thread I think it’s a very common opinion.

Im 29 and can count on one hand the amount of guys I’ve known who want kids. Perhaps it’s your age darling.

It really isn’t irrelevant to this discussion, as what you’re saying is that women should withhold sex so men want to ‘commit’, or marry.

a man that will only marry you if you’re not too ‘easy’, or if you’re ‘not running after him’/playing games, is a lot more likely to behave in a dire manner once they have ‘payed the price’ for the privilege of your open legs, and expect you to behave, and accept behaviour from him, in a gendered way (ie those babies you did get because you played the game? Yours to take care of, he’s going off to the golf) than a man who likes you as a person, loves you as a woman and also enjoys sex with you. Ie, doesn’t see you is some sort of other with genitals to consume and ring finger to placate, but a person, with wishes, desires, brain and genitals.

@kaboomy I agree that it’s an odd assumption that most men are ambivalent to children. My teenagers seem to already have a sense of what they might want. DD (18) is ambivalent about having children and I wouldn’t be surprised if she chooses to be childfree. DS (15), otoh, thinks that he definitely does want children.

Of course their ideas could drastically change later but I’m not sure that we can make sweeping assumptions based on gender nowadays, as women finally have reproductive choices.

@Keilagh Could it be partly because you’ve also decided to be childfree so you tend to mix with other childfree people?

Most ppl wait until their 30’s to have children nowadays so you might see a difference in the next decade. I’m 49 and none of my male friends became fathers before their early 30’s, most were mid to late 30’s when their first child was born.

My DS (15) may have said that he’s like to have children, but I can’t see it actually happening before his 30’s at the earliest.

Do the ones who committed everything for 15 years to get the right house and career and financial security manage to suddenly put all that ambition, routine and validity on the back burner to participate in chaotic, exepensive, disruptive family obligations and become involved and present in child rearing. In my experience this is as common as those that have children early but manage to progress their career whilst be involved parents. Some can in both situations, but most don't in both situations.