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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Friend asking for loan. Knows I can 'afford it'. Went about it all wrong.

535 replies

edelweissnights · 08/12/2023 23:20

A friend called me up and asked me for a loan... after about an hour of chit-chat (which was largely regarding my grief as I have recently lost someone). It wasn't so much a loan, but a desperate plea to pay his mortgage and kids' school fees. He is starting his own business (after jacking in a £120k + London city job) and basically said he needed the money.... yesterday. Since someone very close to me (family) passed, I've been getting a few of these calls from 'friends', albeit not people who were my friends - but my relative's friend. He knows I'm 'good for it' as it is somewhat obvious/is 'public' (if you search for it). I wish he hadn't spent an hour asking about 'the estate' (which is now the name instead of my relative's actual name) as it seems he was just fishing for intel. Also, to call someone up and put them on the spot is just mad.

I have a long term partner, but no children and he kept saying how 'lucky' I was to not have the life he does as children are expensive etc... but to be honest, I do not feel lucky after the year I've had and the things I have been through. Of course children are expensive. I understand that - and respect that.

I am not even sure I would get the money back but he assured me I would within a few weeks. It's not a number to smirk at either. The way he went about it was so so wrong though. He said: "If only I knew someone who would lend me the money... oh wait..! You're childfree! Lucky you! You must have lots of disposable income!!" (Even inheritance aside, I wouldn't have 'loads' of disposable income and the number still remains slightly eye-watering). It was the fact that he kept repeating: "If only I had a way to get the money...." He sounded desperate, but I hate how horrible he made me feel and how badly he went about everything. AIBU to say no - even without giving a reason?

OP posts:
Fraaahnces · 09/12/2023 02:08

Bloody vultures!!! It’s bad enough that you’re grieving without being allowed the mental and emotional space to heal by these entitled people. “Help with the will….” That’s so cheap and nasty.

Original poster
edelweissnights · 09/12/2023 02:10

Biscofffans · 09/12/2023 01:56

And also I’d advise against suggesting alternative money sources for him, because really that’s for him to think about and decide . He was a high earner and is starting a business. I’m sure he is reasonably financially savvy and knows where to apply for loans etc . Your response to him was good - continue to just stick with a basic and flat NO, irrespective of what he comes back with. Do not get sucked into trying to figure out this problem he created for himself.

If you start suggesting ways for him
to Get the money, it only invites him to tell you all the reasons why getting money from X or Y isn’t possible and basically batting it back to you since he will claim you are the “only option’.

Don’t allow his money issues to be a topic of conversation at all ever again. Steer the conversation away firmly.

Also keep an eye on him, he seems a bit selfish and focused on his own needs to the detriment of your welfare / friendship. It doesn’t reflect well on him that he even asked.

I actually didn't need to suggest other options to him as he obviously came 'prepared'. I just wish he hadn't spent all that time prior asking me about my loss and how I was... only to then ask for a loan.

He launched in himself about how other options weren't available - so I guess he knew how to play it so that I would think there was no wiggle room. I didn't suggest he take out a bank loan for example, he volunteered that up. The whole thing was just gross and I felt horrible all evening.

The school fees for Spring term is £12,180 per child. He has two children. That's not including the mortgage payments he would want covered too. It's not a small sum of money.

OP posts:
assessedorregreased · 09/12/2023 02:15

Do NOT lend him the money.

If he says he can pay you back within a few weeks then tell him he just needs to ask school to wait a few weeks for their fees.

Biscofffans · 09/12/2023 02:20

edelweissnights · 09/12/2023 02:10

I actually didn't need to suggest other options to him as he obviously came 'prepared'. I just wish he hadn't spent all that time prior asking me about my loss and how I was... only to then ask for a loan.

He launched in himself about how other options weren't available - so I guess he knew how to play it so that I would think there was no wiggle room. I didn't suggest he take out a bank loan for example, he volunteered that up. The whole thing was just gross and I felt horrible all evening.

The school fees for Spring term is £12,180 per child. He has two children. That's not including the mortgage payments he would want covered too. It's not a small sum of money.

Show quote history

Yes your replies to him were well worded, to clarify - my comment about not giving advice was more in response to pp saying you should suggest he gets money from X or Y.

That’s awful - it was a very cynical and sly approach from your friend and doesn’t bode well for your friendship.

It’s shocking someone would rather ask their grieving friend for that kind of money, than just keep on working at their well paid job until they can afford to go full time with their business.

Original poster
edelweissnights · 09/12/2023 02:22

Biscofffans · 09/12/2023 02:20

Yes your replies to him were well worded, to clarify - my comment about not giving advice was more in response to pp saying you should suggest he gets money from X or Y.

That’s awful - it was a very cynical and sly approach from your friend and doesn’t bode well for your friendship.

It’s shocking someone would rather ask their grieving friend for that kind of money, than just keep on working at their well paid job until they can afford to go full time with their business.

Show quote history

Oh indeed! To be clear, my comment wasn't implying you thought I was offering him too many options or anything. Nor was it a 'clap back'. 😀

I agree it was so sly and underhanded. I think the friendship is over and I hope I don't get any push back. I know he will also try to call and not text if he does indeed want to push back. I suspect I'll get some push back, but ultimately he can't force someone to hand over the money, so I shouldn't be so wound up about it.

OP posts:
Winter2020 · 09/12/2023 02:31

Hi OP,

Sorry for your loss.

I'm reading your posts with horror at the thought that you would give money to this man who has behaved like a predator. As if your position having children or not means you don't deserve to keep money that is rightfully yours - that sentiment alone would make my blood boil.

A mortgage and school fees are a bottomless pit as far as lending money. So if you pay say 24k for 2 kids to stay in school for the spring term and perhaps 6K(?) of mortgage over this time - that's 30K. What would you say then when he comes back and says he needs another 40K for the summer holidays and the following terms fees... and if you don't lend it then it will have been a waste that you paid the first 30K as he will lose it all anyway - so you will end up deeper and deeper into the hole of his financial problems with no relief from your burden of taking on his problems.

If he is going to need to pull his kids out of private school and sell or re-mortgage his house he might as well just get on with it rather than wait until he owes you 30k, 70k or100k.

When his kids are in state school and he has downsized his home but he owes you 100K he won't be thanking you. No good deed goes unpunished. He will tell you that he wishes you hadn't leant him the money and he wishes that you had let him sell up/pull the kids out because now he is in an even worse position.

Don't try to solve his problem for him. He is obviously bright and also ruthless. If there is help to be had from a school hardship fund he will sniff it out. That is between him and the school. If he has no reason to think he will be able to afford the following terms fees either the school might also think that they will be throwing good money after bad and that it is inevitable that the kids will have to leave.

As often repeated on mumsnet: don't set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm.

Take care of yourself.

momonpurpose · 09/12/2023 02:32

Do not give him a penny and never speak to him again. With friends like that who needs enemies. I am very sorry for your loss and so sorry someone wished to take advantage of you at this difficult time of grief. Says alot about them

viques · 09/12/2023 02:32

He is not asking for a loan , because when you get a loan you expect to repay it. And he has no intention of repaying you. He is asking for a gift.

Original poster
edelweissnights · 09/12/2023 02:42

Winter2020 · 09/12/2023 02:31

Hi OP,

Sorry for your loss.

I'm reading your posts with horror at the thought that you would give money to this man who has behaved like a predator. As if your position having children or not means you don't deserve to keep money that is rightfully yours - that sentiment alone would make my blood boil.

A mortgage and school fees are a bottomless pit as far as lending money. So if you pay say 24k for 2 kids to stay in school for the spring term and perhaps 6K(?) of mortgage over this time - that's 30K. What would you say then when he comes back and says he needs another 40K for the summer holidays and the following terms fees... and if you don't lend it then it will have been a waste that you paid the first 30K as he will lose it all anyway - so you will end up deeper and deeper into the hole of his financial problems with no relief from your burden of taking on his problems.

If he is going to need to pull his kids out of private school and sell or re-mortgage his house he might as well just get on with it rather than wait until he owes you 30k, 70k or100k.

When his kids are in state school and he has downsized his home but he owes you 100K he won't be thanking you. No good deed goes unpunished. He will tell you that he wishes you hadn't leant him the money and he wishes that you had let him sell up/pull the kids out because now he is in an even worse position.

Don't try to solve his problem for him. He is obviously bright and also ruthless. If there is help to be had from a school hardship fund he will sniff it out. That is between him and the school. If he has no reason to think he will be able to afford the following terms fees either the school might also think that they will be throwing good money after bad and that it is inevitable that the kids will have to leave.

As often repeated on mumsnet: don't set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm.

Take care of yourself.

"A mortgage and school fees are a bottomless pit as far as lending money."

Spot on. This is also why once you start 'lending' you keep 'lending' - and it becomes never-ending.

I suspect you're 100% right about all that's to come. I also think anger/resentment sets in both for the lender and the person asking for money.

If the receiver ends up in more financial trouble, the lender is expected to bail them out again - as they did it once before. Also, the lender has no hope of getting the original sum back if they don't help out the receiver again... it is just a vicious cycle. Also, all too often the lender goes to the bottom of the priority lists in terms of paying back what's owed - as mortgages are obviously priority bills.

OP posts:
Coyoacan · 09/12/2023 02:45

I prefer to lend to women as, in general, they are better at paying back. But it is also better to lend someone a small amount of money you can afford to lose and see if they pay it back

SequentialAnalyst · 09/12/2023 02:46

I have just had to write off a fairly small sum of money, and discovered that someone I thought of as a friend really seemed to think he was entitled to borrow money off me as if I was a bank. Quite glad in a way, as in our discussions he stonewalled,, lied, and twisted things, with an added dose of misogyny - so I need waste no more of my life on him. So well done, OPSmile

Original poster
edelweissnights · 09/12/2023 02:48

SequentialAnalyst · 09/12/2023 02:46

I have just had to write off a fairly small sum of money, and discovered that someone I thought of as a friend really seemed to think he was entitled to borrow money off me as if I was a bank. Quite glad in a way, as in our discussions he stonewalled,, lied, and twisted things, with an added dose of misogyny - so I need waste no more of my life on him. So well done, OPSmile

Edited

@SequentialAnalyst This is awful. How did it end up? Did you just cut him off? Did he try to push back when asking for repayment?

OP posts:
WiddlinDiddlin · 09/12/2023 02:55

Ugh, glad you've seen sense here - he will owe money to everyone, and the last person to lend him any will be the last person to get anything back!

Hopefully he doesn't try to push you again for it!

Fraaahnces · 09/12/2023 03:03

The fact that he already knows that no other financial options are open to him is very, very telling. There is undoubtedly a reason. Am wondering if he really did quit his job or was forced to.

Elderflower14 · 09/12/2023 03:21

He is NOT your friend..
Say no!!!

FictionalCharacter · 09/12/2023 03:29

Neitheronethingnortheother · 08/12/2023 23:25

He's not a friend. Friends don't prey on grieving people to try to get money out of them to cover for their poor life choices.

100% this. How dare he try to manipulate you like this when you’re grieving and how dare he call you lucky.
You might need to grow a thick skin. Don’t feel sorry for him or anyone else who tries to get money out of you because they think you have “loads”.

Andthereyougo · 09/12/2023 03:45

That is horrible. But typical, I had similar.
DON’T lend him the money. I doubt very much you’d see it again.

cerisepanther73 · 09/12/2023 03:57

I am sorry 😞 for your loss

Rember you don't owe this fake not genuine no good so called friend of yours relative anything whatsoever.!

It's a choice to have children too, this sob gaslightening manipulative story of gold digger is nonsense.

A genuine friend would especially never prey like a vulture, seeking to exploit you and your inheritance money or any money you have created at such a vunerable time in your life too.

This CF User , Chancer can fuck off elsewhere 😤 you are not walking talking breathing ATM cash in the wall machine or Royal Bank of England...

cerisepanther73 · 09/12/2023 04:01

I guarantee allmost 100 per cent that you would never see that money again or you would have to go to court to claw back the money that would be envitable be owed to you.

daisychain01 · 09/12/2023 04:08

What are you even friends with this toe-rag? Just cut him off, he sounds utterly despicable. You can't be that desperate for friends.

Roselilly36 · 09/12/2023 04:08

A friend would not put you in such an uncomfortable position, especially whilst coping with a bereavement. Just no is enough, you don’t need to explain.

BelindaOkra · 09/12/2023 04:11

Never mind the cheek. You won’t be seeing that money again. So no.

DeeCeeCherry · 09/12/2023 04:17

I think your 'Friend' radar is off-centre. Why didnt you just say No? There's no need to dither. To even wonder about or consider this is madness.

JanicewasHere · 09/12/2023 04:54

He’s not your friend. That’s what it boils down to. A friend would never put you in such a position and particularly with complete disregard for your bereavement. Ditch him and focus on the people
who lift you up in your life instead.
And whatever you do, do NOT lend him any money.

Mumtobabyhavoc · 09/12/2023 05:23

Hard, No. And don't give an explanation.