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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Grandad's Pride is being read on milkshake on channel 5 - not acceptable! AIBU

513 replies

grandadspride · 01/12/2023 09:13

Milkshake story den.

Why are we reading books about pride, gender and drag to pre-school children.

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TheKeatingFive · 01/12/2023 13:01

I have never heard of this book and have no intention of looking it up or reading it but on a point of principle I will be damned if I will see it, or anything else, cancelled.

It's showcasing BDSM and not so veiled references to pedophilia - and it's written for toddlers. You don't think, on the grounds of age appropriateness, there's a problem there?

TheKeatingFive · 01/12/2023 13:30

I mean, in theory I'm against censorship too.

I just don't know what the market is supposed to be for picture books about Grandpas that include material unsuitable for under 18s.

slavicflower · 01/12/2023 13:47

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ for breaking our Talk Guidelines.

MaryWhitehouseisCOOL · 01/12/2023 13:54

It's really interesting reading this thread.

If Transwomen want any credibility , they would be as outraged as women as it's an attack on childhood innocence.

As usual it's ALL about them 🙄

MrsOvertonsWindow · 01/12/2023 14:07

IvorTheEngineDriver · 01/12/2023 12:56

I have never heard of this book and have no intention of looking it up or reading it but on a point of principle I will be damned if I will see it, or anything else, cancelled.

I am from a generation that saw legal battles to end censorship. We do not need to see it reinstated by an unthinking younger generation under a new name.

You say "cancelled". I say "censored".

Edited

Have you read the thread Ivor? You do realise that society has always "censored" what children are allowed access to? Exposing children to porn, allowing them to watch sexual acts let alone encouraging them to participate in sexual acts have always been offences under the Sex Offences Act or breached a range of Safeguarding legislation.
Arguing that toddlers must be exposed to portrayals of adults in fetish gear etc because they're in a book is nonsense.

PartOfTheFurniture12 · 01/12/2023 14:28

sollenwir · 01/12/2023 10:49

I don't think anyone is defending any of those images, I do think people are defending the 'right' for LGBTQIA+ people to exist and not be told by others that they believe them not to be real.

I'm bisexual. No-one on this thread has denied my "right to exist". Please do not delude yourself into thinking you are doing any favours for LGBT people with this rhetoric. We will all pay the price with guilt by association when this despicable trans fad blows over and it finally sinks in how many medical atrocities have been committed against vulnerable young people. Meanwhile, the army of virtue signallers such as yourself will get off scot-free and prance off to your next moral crusade, having learnt nothing. You'll probably even pretend you were always against the opinions you currently beat everyone over the head with. Because parroting these short-sighted "progressive" positions has always been about what is good for your own reputation and self-image, not what is actually right and safe for kids, or young people, or gay people, or trans people.

A distressing number of kids going to gender clinics are gay kids who have been convinced that being gender non-conforming or liking people of the same sex somehow makes them not a real man or woman. The definition of trans has been warped and expanded far beyond its original definition to incorporate people for whom it is not remotely suitable, and all the safety stops that would have prevented these individuals from medically transitioning and regretting it have been removed in the name of political correctness. You are so busy spouting slogans, shutting down dissenting opinions as "transphobic" and ignoring the nuances of the trans situation to notice that you are helping to drive the wrong people towards the surgeon's scalpel. As someone who was gender non-conforming, I am relieved to have grown up in an era where transgenderism wasn't being pushed and parents and medical professionals were willing and able to act as the adults in the room to stop me from ruining my life. I am pregnant with my first child. If I had fallen for the gender ideology you seem so keen to push then I could have lost my ability to bear a child or breastfeed, and I would not be thanking you for it. Brainwashing and sterilising young gay people is neither kind nor accepting.

Regarding "educating" people on transgenderism so we aren't "denying the existence of trans people": nope, sorry. Confusing children with contradictory, widely refuted and scientifically unproven concepts is not a step forward for anyone. Gender dysphoria is a poorly understood condition and gender ideology is a regressive and unstable belief system. Its inconsistency means it cannot be taught clearly or responsibly and therefore shouldn't be taught at all, certainly not to impressionable small children with limited reasoning skills. Despite not having had a single class about homosexuality, my generation are very accepting of gay people. There is no need to "get them while they're young" when it comes to complex or age-inappropriate topics like transgenderism.

If you gave me the choice, I would rather my kids had the exact sex education I did - which included absolutely zero discussion of homosexuality - than have them learn about transgenderism and gender identity. Hell, I'd rather they learnt that being same sex attracted was morally wrong or that the earth was flat than learn about gender identity, because at least they'd be at less risk of having their bodies needlessly carved up.

Moreover, trans people constitute 0.1% of the population (at least, they did before the trans wave). If we are to dedicate lessons to transgenderism, it stands to reason that we should also teach children about literally every other demographic that constitutes 0.1% of the population or more, to ensure we aren't "denying the existence" of anyone. Schizophrenics, for instance, make up 1% of the population and suffer terrible public misconceptions about their condition. That's just one of thousands of mental, cultural and physical differences. How can we in good conscience have our children learn reading, writing and arithmetic when they haven't been educated about every single human difference on the planet?

Kath85 · 01/12/2023 14:29

So are the pics you have posted from the same story read on milkshake?!

Munchyseeds2 · 01/12/2023 14:33

When my kids watched milkshake many moons ago it was Brain Cant and Dappledown Farm
I am so glad they are grown!!

No toddler needs to see a book like that ever

Bobsboob · 01/12/2023 15:02

sollenwir · 01/12/2023 11:03

I don't think anyone said it's transphobic not to find male sexual organs attractive.

Possibly not on this thread- I haven’t read every post. But in the media in general it’s said. Owen Jones in the pink news springs to mind, but there’s plenty if you google.

Bobsboob · 01/12/2023 15:06

Soubriquet · 01/12/2023 11:19

So the defence friends have given are

A) celebrities wear less on tv Hmm
B) go to any pride parade and you will find lots of leather bound people. This book is a fantastic way of introducing it to children so they aren’t afraid.

WTF?! No.

No- the book is a fantastic way of breaking down children’s boundaries about bodies, and when, where and with whom it is appropriate for them to be sexualised- which when it concerns children should be never.

You will see all that at pride- which is why I never take my children.

Bobsboob · 01/12/2023 15:17

Caerulea · 01/12/2023 12:19

Isn't it always the argument from bigots that homosexuality in men is just a perversion? Something the gay community had to fight hard against to show they are actually just normal ppl doing normal shit who happen to be same sex attracted. Normal jobs, normal families, normal pets. Just really ordinary normal people, not degenerate fetishists.

I get increasingly annoyed at seeing gay men (especially) be stereotyped BACKWARDS in media & this movement of absolute acceptance without question. It's so regressive & this book plays into that with its artwork.

Yep that was my point. Gay men are no more likely to be fetishists of any type than any other man. Yes, clearly being gay is partly ‘about sex’ because it’s about who you find arousing and attractive, but that’s the same as being straight. No more sex and no less either.

Helleofabore · 01/12/2023 15:33

ArthurbellaScott · 01/12/2023 12:59

Quite right! Get that bondage and BDSM content in front of the toddlers for the sake of free speech!

Yes. Toddlers need to understand that what BDSM gear is all about and what each hidden message about paedophilia (MAP) is too.

I guess some people really don’t like safeguarding at all.

StarlightLime · 01/12/2023 15:35

TheKeatingFive · 01/12/2023 09:29

No, it just needs to not be shown during a children's show, not everything needs to be cancelled.

The book is written for preschoolers

Is it really?? What sort of a fucking world we we living in? 😡

grandadspride · 01/12/2023 15:56

Kath85 · 01/12/2023 14:29

So are the pics you have posted from the same story read on milkshake?!

Yes

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Ofcourseshecan · 01/12/2023 16:04

CountryStore · 01/12/2023 09:39

I don't really know how anyone could look at th illustrations of the man in bdsm leather gear and think it was OK for children??
We (society) used to know this didn't we? What has changed and why?
There is no reason that would benefit any child.
The only possible people who will benefit from the breaking down of such boundaries are people with sexual interest in children. This is very worrying indeed. And it's being normalised on channel 5's preschool programming!
WTAF?!

This. We all know a lot of men want sexual contact with children. Anyone who cares about children opposes this. Trying to get preschoolers used to images of men in fetish gear is grooming.

grandadspride · 01/12/2023 17:09

Response to my email.

They haven't commented on the pictures I attached. Funny that.

Grandad's Pride is being read on milkshake on channel 5 - not acceptable! AIBU
OP posts:
TheKeatingFive · 01/12/2023 17:14

Ffs 🤦‍♀️

grandadspride · 01/12/2023 17:16

I replied asking about the pictures specifically. Asked if he thought it was appropriate

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ArthurbellaScott · 01/12/2023 17:24

The point about 'censorship' is actually quite important.

I'm a strong advocate of free speech.

But it's worth looking into 'book bans' in the US in recent years. In many cases (not all) these have been highly sexualised books that have been removed from school libraries.

Free speech does not extend to putting pornography or extremely violent content into schools.

'48 percent of titles banned in the last school year included themes or instances of violence and abuse, some of those including episodes of sexual assault. Forty-two percent of books banned covered health and wellbeing topics, including mental health or substance abuse; 33% detail sexual experiences between characters, 30% include characters of color or discuss race and racism, and 30% have LGBTQ characters or themes'

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/09/21/us/book-ban-increase-pen-america/index.html

So while it's easy to say that books shouldn't be 'banned' - on the whole I agree with that statement - it's important to look closely at the implicit suggestion that all printed material ever should be freely available to all ages.

Book bans continue rising in the US with more targeting 'sexual' and 'inappropriate' content, free speech group says | CNN

Book bans in public schools rose by 33% in the last academic school year, with many efforts targeting titles perceived as “sexual” or “inappropriate,” a new report from the literary and free expression advocacy group PEN America shows.

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/09/21/us/book-ban-increase-pen-america/index.html

Circularargument · 01/12/2023 17:42

grandadspride · 01/12/2023 09:18

Because my 2 year old doesn't need to be brainwashed about gender politics. Also doesn't need to know what drag is, considering it's adult entertainment

Exactly the s28 tactics from the 80s. But you're not bigoted, dear me no.🙄

A 2 year old won't understand gender politics. You are afraid he or she won't grow up being suitably afraid and ignorant of people who are different. Be honest.

Bad, bad parenting 😑

StarlightLime · 01/12/2023 17:43

Circularargument · 01/12/2023 17:42

Exactly the s28 tactics from the 80s. But you're not bigoted, dear me no.🙄

A 2 year old won't understand gender politics. You are afraid he or she won't grow up being suitably afraid and ignorant of people who are different. Be honest.

Bad, bad parenting 😑

Ridiculous post. Every bit of it.

TheKeatingFive · 01/12/2023 17:49

A 2 year old won't understand gender politics. You are afraid he or she won't grow up being suitably afraid and ignorant of people who are different. Be honest.

Bad, bad parenting

This is what people think of safeguarding. Not a priority, when you could be signalling your 'tolerant' and 'accepting' credentials 🙄

TheKeatingFive · 01/12/2023 17:50

You're a bad parent if you object to your toddler being exposed to BDSM and paedophilic themes.

Welcome to 2023 people. What a time to be alive. 🙄

grandadspride · 01/12/2023 18:00

If that makes me a bad parent then I wear the badge with 'pride'

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