Was we unreasonable to withdraw our child from a school church service?

[Dad0f1]

Hello everyone new member here just looking for some advice/reassurance that I/we've made the right decision regarding withdrawing our child from a church service at school.

So our DS who is our first child started Reception this September at our local CofE primary school and although neither myself or my OH are church goers we felt that this was the best school for him as the other practical nearby choices were a RC school or a two form entry state school which our DS would not have coped with.

And to be fair our DS has settled in nicely making lots of new friends and seems to be enjoying it however, the other week we was informed that the children would be attending a 'School Communion Service' in the nearby church that the school is attached to and not having a clue what this was I enquired with the Head of RE what the service entailed, how involved DS would be in the service and what was expected of him during the service.

As I suspected the service was in their words 'a simplified child friendly version of the Holy Communion Service' which would include bread and wine for those who were confirmed (as apparantly the children are offered the option to be confirmed if they wish in Y6) but the Reverend overseeing ther service likes to get the children involved so will offer all the children confirmed or not a wafer if they want one.
Also 'prompts' would flash up on a big screen at various points during the service to let the children know when to say 'Amen' etc.

Now to the reason why I/we chose to withdraw my DS from this service. Although the Head of RE made a point to explain that worship is voluntary at the school and that the children are free to take part in worship as much or as little as they wish. I very much doubt that children aged 4 or 5 can grasp the concept of this especially as they are at an age where they want to please the adults around them.
This is also made difficult for them not to be involved if they wish when they have 'prompts' flashing up on a big screen to help/nudge them into reciting a paticular phrase and when everyone around them is then repeating it parrot fashion.

Whilst we do want our DS to learn about Christianity we also want him to make up his own mind about whether to accept it or reject it in later life.
So AI/WBU to withdraw him from school church services that are being conducted like this or should I let him experience them bearing in mind his young age?

yep but maybe this school is better in other ways, and hopefully over time they can stamp out the religious bit so it better reflects the fact that no-one goes to church any more or really believes in the Bible

'Were we being unreasonable?'.
Whatever happened to basic grammar being taught in all schools.

You chose a C of E school!!!! He will feel pushished and left out - a service alone won't affect his decision making around religion when he is old enough. All he will feel is left out and upset his friends got to go on an exciting trip

Obviously I can’t say for sure in every church school but Google “foundation governor” which is obligatory for all CofE schools. IME of a few schools there’s a prayer at every meeting before it starts- you should be able to check the minutes.

Of course you have that right. Whether it is the right thing to do is entirely up to you.
I am an atheist from a long line of atheists. I can mumble along to the Lords Prayer and sing 5 hymns. I never went to a church school or to church.
When we moved all the local schools are Church of England. So youngest DD enjoyed the singing assemblies and went to Church twice a year. She doesn't believe any more than we do but the skills of respecting beliefs, pragmatism and learning about religion are valuable life lessons.

We’re atheist so did not send our children to a religious school. Clearly you feel you’re entitled to what you consider to be the perks of a religious school while not respecting their adherence to that religion.

What’s wrong with a 2-form entry school? My kids go to a 4-form entry primary school which is rated outstanding and I’ve had zero complaints about. Given your atheism, surely the non-religious school would have been a far more sensible choice.

I think you are being unreasonable. My children go to a Catholic school and while 85% of my daughter's class are Catholic. Those who are not, all go to the church services the school hold once a term. The service is very interactive, with lots of singing. I am friends with the mums who are either non-faith, Hindu or Muslim and they understood this to be the case when enrolling their children into the school. Their children also join in with all the start of the day, lunchtime and end of day prayers.

Given that the school governers give up their time for free, I think they ought to be allowed to say a short prayer if they want to. By all accounts it is a pretty thankless task and many of the parents are unappreciative of the work they do.

This. I can't imagine what harm you thought it might do.

As a child, we visited a temple to learn about how they worked in practice. The ability to choose religion comes from being informed.

I do not want religion thrust upon my DC but would want them on these types of visits. I'd never want to be the one who prevented their learning in life.

Fwiw, my eldest wanted to be a Christian for a whole year until she learned about another religion and hasn't brought anything up again. Her best friend at the time was quite religious and said people who didn't believe in God wouldn't go to heaven. You just have to explain and balance views at home. For example: "Some people believe that, we don't but Christians do although it's not been proven there is heaven. It's OK if we have different beliefs in life."

YABU I don't believe in religion and I don't believe in religion in schools. But to send a child to a church school then withdraw them from church seems ridiculous to me. It's all part of the school ethos.
I sent my child to a non church school and asked them not to be taken to the church or the mosque as part of their lessons because I am an atheist and for this I am still to this day labelled racist by the deputy head and it was nearly 20 years ago.

Surely this was written by a bot.

Don't you think it will be worse for him to be singled out against all his peers to not attend this service?

I think withdrawing a small child from something that all of his peers are doing sets him apart from them. I remember the Jehovah's Witnesses being withdrawn from assembly in Primary and it set them apart and they were seen as different. Your child will make up his own mind regardless as to the school's input. Dsis and I went to the same school, were brought up together, I have no faith but my dsis has a faith that is all encompassing and her life and social life is devoted to her church, she is even married to the pastor.

I think you'll find that really quite a lot of people do both. I'm an atheist RS teacher. Forms of Christian worship are embedded in the history of this country - coronations, remembrance services, royal weddings, commemorations of disaster services, "traditional" weddings and funerals. Its actually quite helpful to have the vaguest passing familiarity with the form in case you end up at one of these things. I get so sick of the schtick they they should "stamp out" religion. There is no more proof that there is a God than that there isn't. Both are faith positions. If the OP doesn't want her kid near it then 100% she should not be using a faith school if there were other options available. Has anyone asked WHY faith schools are generally seen as better in terms of intake, outcomes, general behaviour etc? Much as some would be loathe to admit it they are obviously doing something right.

You sent him to a church school. Church schools PRACTICE religion, they don’t just teach it.

This is classic AIBU: OP asks if being unreasonable. Majority says you are. OP refuses to listen and digs in, making you wonder why they asked the question if they didn’t want to hear that they ABU!

I’m an atheist but I do wonder why people are so very scared of their kids learning about religion? Surely us atheists need to understand religion to reject it?

I preferred my kids to have exposure to all sorts of ideas and views to give them a rounded world view - and I shared my views with them. At no point did I or do I feel they have to believe everything I do!

You send him to a church school and withdraw him from a
Church event. You're going to spend the next six years doing a lot of withdrawing.

This is not the right school for your child.

OP you have already made your mind up that you are not BU so are only looking for support for your own opinion.

Good grief, OP 😆 YABU!

No don't agree at all.

Just to add that there are three crosses on the flag: of St George (red), the largest, then St Andrew (white) and St Patrick (red). The latter two are saltires, the slanted white and red shapes. St Patrick's is from when Great Britain and Ireland were joined as the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland in 1801. Saint Andrew is the patron saint of Scotland and as it happens, today is St Andrew's day.

Or it’s not the right school for you.

Err. Do you not celebrate Christ’s Mass every December?

How can you expect your dc to choose when he is older if dc is not exposed to choices?

@ghostyslovesheets "’m an atheist but I do wonder why people are so very scared of their kids learning about religion?"

I don't know a single person who doesn't want their child to learn about religion.

I agree. I'm suspicious of atheists who are afraid to let their kids learn about different religions. Equally, I'm suspicious of religious people who are afraid to let their kids learn about different beliefs.

Surely we should be exposing our kids to as many different ideas and experiences as possible so that they can make up their own minds? If we're convinced that our own way is the only "right" way, then presumably we will be confident that our belief systems will stand up to even the toughest scrutiny?

That said, I would never have chosen a school for my dc that was dominated by any one single religion. My preference was for dd to be exposed to all sorts of world views so that she could form her own opinions.