AIBU to take my son into the female changing room?

[JustKeepSwimmingAlong]

I’ve taken my kids swimming tonight, both have separate swimming lessons and I swam with one while the other had theirs. Eldest is male, 9 and has multiple additional needs including ADHD, ASD and some physical disabilities which means he struggles to change himself. Youngest is in nursery so can dress herself but does need supervision. We got out the pool and realised all the changing rooms were full. There were 8 classes on over multiple pools, as well as general swim on at the same time. There’s only two family/accessible changing rooms and the others are all individual. There were literal queues for the large changing rooms.
I then noticed people going out of the group change. I’ve not used it before, but there was a male and a female changing room, so we went in the females. There was no one in it so started laying out the kids clothes and getting them to shower. Got them out the showers and started to get them dressed and people started coming in. There were a couple of mums with young girls and boys, and then a teenager looking girl came in by herself. She immediately came over to tell me that we were in the female room. I explained my son needed help getting changed and the changing rooms were full, but this room had been empty so we’d used it rather than standing wet and cold waiting for a changing room.
We were nearly Finished and my son was fully dressed when she arrived. He sat next to me, facing the wall and we left within a few minutes. During this time, she did get changed, so we didn’t delay her. Now I’m wondering if I was unreasonable?
I don’t want to make anyone uncomfortable, but I really don’t know what else I could have done in the situation? There’s too many classes and too few changing rooms, and we need a larger/accessible one, but they’re the only ones with baby change so they’re really
Popular. The lessons are every week so now I’m wondering what I can do next week? Would I be unreasonable to keep using the group change if there are no other options available?

I assume because she's female then it felt natural for her to go into the female space, where she's always gone.

9 is a bit too old. You need to use the group change.

I think that if the mother thinks it's fine for a male to be in the female changing rooms then they must think it's fine for a female to be in the male changing rooms. They can face the wall, after all. That way the disabled persons needs are prioritised regardless of sex or gender, just as they are when the boy is in the female change.

And if they suddenly think it isn't fine after all, perhaps they could have a think about why that is.

I find it equally depressing that people are still trying to justify taking males into female only (with the exception of under 8's) spaces.

@YireosDodeAver

She CAN’T send him to stand outside the door. Or have him in a changing room by himself.

He is autistic/adhd and physically disabled.

He has no awareness of danger and is prone to wandering.

He is at risk of injury, death, abduction, rape to name a few risks.

This is a disabled child we are talking about.

They shouldn’t have to go home in dry robes because her son has a disability.

They should be able to get changed just like everyone else and it is the leisure centres responsibility to provide appropriate facilities.

If using the women's was a big issue for the child with a disability then the parent should take them into a family room.

All of this is true.
It doesn't give a male the right to be in a female only space however.

My disabled child is 14 should he be allowed in the female changing?

a male 30 year old who is disabled should be be allowed?

where do we draw the line? Where does dignity and privacy for everyone come into it?

The answer to lack of disabled facilities isn’t taking away from another group.

See, it’s attitudes like this that cause a lot of the issues for mothers of disabled sons.

Do you think it doesn’t occur to us that they need to learn boundaries? Do you think non of us also have daughters whose rights we are concerned about?!

It isn’t our fault that the majority of places don’t have suitable provisions for us to use-

if the able bodied community saw it for what it is- a money saving exercise by the providers which targets the disabled because there are fewer of us and we are less likely to be in a position to make a sustained fuss about it (not to mention that the majority of planning decision makers are able bodied and don’t actually know what is needed)- and stopped blaming the victims for doing disability/parenting wrong when we are put in positions where there isnt a solution that suits everyone- then things might actually get better for everyone.

@Sirzy

I completely agree with this.

OP has had one unfortunate experience when she unexpectedly found there was no provision and had to do her best to cope.

Going forward the leisure centre has a duty to make suitable provision and OP should kick up until her son is accommodated.

Using the female changing room is a big issue for boys/young men but in this instance the “family room” wasn’t accessible. She opted for the empty room and now is looking for other solutions. Suggesting places she can’t use or that the child miraculously gains the ability to care for itself is ableist and unhelpful.

@Heresapickle we have already discussed how there need to be more unisex, accessible facilities, and there definitely does.
You say here: 'It isn’t our fault that the majority of places don’t have suitable provisions for us to use', and that is correct, however it also isn't the fault of the females using the female only spaces, and thus not expecting males to be in there. The answer is not eroding female rights, and saying 'there is no other option' (not quoting you here, just an example I have heard) doesn't mean we can go on to ignore female rights.

It wasn't 'the empty room', it was a female only changing area.

It also shouldn’t always be presumed it will be disabled people.

If your feminism doesn’t acknowledge intersectionality then it isn’t really feminism.

How do people manage with slightly older boys? What happens if they take a long time to get ready? Do you keep waiting or go in to the men’s?

If they look 6 then I don't think anyone would mind them being in the opposite sex changing room as they wouldn't know they were 9, unless you ran into a classmate or similar. If you mean they look 9 but act like they are 6 then that doesn't make them a small child, an adult sized 14 year old could be developmentally 6.

Try not to stop swimming! If all us disabled folk just give up and stay at home then the dickheads that cause this issue win!

My son can’t wait either- I take a big robe (like a dry robe but cheaper!), put that on him and take him straight home (via a complaint to staff that there isn’t anywhere for us to change!).

I’ll be damned if I’ll let this stop my son from (or me!) from getting to have a life.

@TomeTome

What are you talking about? Of course he ain’t any less than anyone else. That’s why there are family changing rooms provided. At busy times, you have to wait. He just has to wait. He can’t use the group female change just because his changing rooms are a bit busy.

We all have things provided for us. When they are busy, we have to wait. That doesn’t make him any less than us. By saying he should be allowed to use the female only room, you are actually saying that as a male, he is worth more than us and we should just move over. No. No way. The OP and her kid can just wait like everyone else.

That’s a weird attitude- reality doesn’t matter, it only matters what it looks like.

It wouldn't bother me, but I know it would bother other women and girls so for that reason older children should either be changed in the changing area of their sex, family changing, or if there as disabilities/SEN any accessible changing space.

Making women's changing mixed sex isn't the solution.

Parents who take older children of the opposite sex swimming need to ensure that there's appropriate changing facilities at the venue they choose so that the default isn't to take them into the opposite sex changing.

The point here is if the accessible changing rooms were reserved for those with disabilities only and everyone respects that, then the whole situation wouldn't have arisen.

When mine used to go swimming, there was one wheelchair accessible room, several large cubicles and many individual cubicles which could easily fit a parent and child. Only children were swimming at this time.

There was a mother in a wheelchair. Everyone could see that... yet she frequently had to wait for a family to move out of the wheelchair accessible room to be able to help her child change. (This was the only private shower as well which I presume why people kept using it)

And that is part of the problem... even when there are facilities they get taken up by others.

YABU I'm afraid.

9 is too old for a boy to be in the female changing rooms.

@Kendodd

As I’ve said before - autistics have queue passes in most places/special assistance to avoid queuing at airports.

It is not that they “don’t want to queue”, it is that if they did queue they may end up with him screaming, yelling, lying on the floor thrashing around, self harming, lashing out and hitting others to name but a few things that can happen with meltdowns. Then she’ll have several days at home after this where he won’t eat or sleep properly and will have increased distress and greater chance of another meltdown.

Adequate provision should be available without having to queue.

The main reason there are queues is because they have lumped baby changers into a disabled space and thus opened it to families.

To resolve this they can put the baby changers in the mens and womens facilities.

Put that point to the leisure centre OP.

Where is @SerafinasGoose presuming that it will be disabled people who make way?

Perhaps we need to stop referring to third spaces, in recognition of the fact that third spaces are already provided for disabled people, and start referring to fourth spaces for this purpose instead.

To me it's about women and girls feeling comfortable in their own spaces. An older boy that appears to be a six year old is only likely to make a girl feel more uncomfortable than an actual six year old if she knows him.