AIBU to take my son into the female changing room?

[JustKeepSwimmingAlong]

I’ve taken my kids swimming tonight, both have separate swimming lessons and I swam with one while the other had theirs. Eldest is male, 9 and has multiple additional needs including ADHD, ASD and some physical disabilities which means he struggles to change himself. Youngest is in nursery so can dress herself but does need supervision. We got out the pool and realised all the changing rooms were full. There were 8 classes on over multiple pools, as well as general swim on at the same time. There’s only two family/accessible changing rooms and the others are all individual. There were literal queues for the large changing rooms.
I then noticed people going out of the group change. I’ve not used it before, but there was a male and a female changing room, so we went in the females. There was no one in it so started laying out the kids clothes and getting them to shower. Got them out the showers and started to get them dressed and people started coming in. There were a couple of mums with young girls and boys, and then a teenager looking girl came in by herself. She immediately came over to tell me that we were in the female room. I explained my son needed help getting changed and the changing rooms were full, but this room had been empty so we’d used it rather than standing wet and cold waiting for a changing room.
We were nearly Finished and my son was fully dressed when she arrived. He sat next to me, facing the wall and we left within a few minutes. During this time, she did get changed, so we didn’t delay her. Now I’m wondering if I was unreasonable?
I don’t want to make anyone uncomfortable, but I really don’t know what else I could have done in the situation? There’s too many classes and too few changing rooms, and we need a larger/accessible one, but they’re the only ones with baby change so they’re really
Popular. The lessons are every week so now I’m wondering what I can do next week? Would I be unreasonable to keep using the group change if there are no other options available?

@sollenwir

Every pool we have been to, and the private swimming lessons we go to at a school pool has communal changing rooms. Males and females together. Or a family changing room. The leisure centres have cubicles. But the school pool is one changing room for the children to get changed in.

So no I didn’t know anything about this 8 upper limit thing, just like OP.

This just feels like another disability quagmire to wade through tbh.

Is it from 8 they are to be banned from female spaces or from 9?

I hadn’t noticed any hassle at toilets either because mainly we’ve been using disabled due to the sodding hand dryers in busy public toilets.

I can't believe I just read this.

@JustKeepSwimmingAlong There are going to be lots of moments like this for the next few years. The SN boards will probably give you a more thoughtful response and ideas about how things can be managed. The reason disabled people have rights over and above your standard human rights is their path is harder and harder to navigate. It sounds like you did your best in the moment, but it is really important you protect him going forward. Talk to reception.

Well, tonight you've learned that it's not acceptable to take a male into a female only space and that it's normally only kids under 8 (7) who are allowed in opposite sex communal changing rooms.

You've also hopefully realised that while we (mostly) don't want males in female only spaces, regardless of disabilities, most of also agree that you shouldn't have been put in this position and that disabled/SEN facilities are often woefully inadequate.

Speak to the pool, ask if they can remind customers that the accessible facilities are only for those who actually really need them, and not just to have a bit more space!

The dryrobe idea might work, if you can persuade him to try it?

but it is really important you protect him going forward

Yep, he doesn’t deserve to endure abuse, or ridicule due to the fact he needs his Mum. Nor be put at risk.

I’ve had this exact debate on here before- my son can’t use the bathroom alone (ads/adhd/dyspraxia and physical disability- when he needs to go to the toilet he needs to go NOW). I am a wheelchair user and married to another woman (this is relevant).

There are many places where the only accessible toilet is through the single sex toilet- ie a large cubicle at the far end of a row of cubicles.

My son is 9, so too old for female sex toilets. I am 40, so too old for men’s toilets.

The consensus on here was that it’s tough, we shouldn’t go to places, or I should only take my son out if I can magic up a man to accompany us everywhere.

The fact that the shit provision of accessible toilets/changing places unequally affects women as we are by far the most likely to be carers is irrelevant… feminism only reaches as far as able bodies women with able bodied children- no intersectionality here please.

It's very common at the older style pools which don't have changing villages - you'd have to ask at your specific pool for their exact policy (or look online) but it's common to expect 8 and above to use their own sex changing facility.

My swimming has a sign up - boys over 7 years are not allowed in and you must use the family change area.

@Heresapickle this is why I would opt for the presence of unisex accessible individual toilet 'rooms' as much as possible. By rooms I mean toilet, changing table (adult sized), hoist, accessible sink, etc.

@Heresapickle

I’m in agreement with you. I am the main carer for our DS and DH works long hours to compensate for that.

I can’t magic up a man either. And I also have physical disability, though not wheelchair bound.

JennyPublic’s attitude rather than to accommodate and support and uplift disabled people where they are being failed by an establishment is to castigate and attempt to exclude them.

We need the general able bodied public to be complaining about this too.

@sollenwir well that obviously won’t be happening for us.

I am interested in keeping my child alive.

@sollenwir

All the local pools in our area are a freeforall. Unisex changing.

That is their policy.

I'm not suggesting you deliberately go to a pool with this sort of changing set up but they are still a reality for some folk. Changing villages are easier to navigate, of course. Our local pool has separate changing plus one disabled cubicle, whereas the bigger and more modern pool further away has a village set up.

Presumably with cubicles though, and a limited number of accessible/larger ones?

Absolutely, things would be so much better if these things were commonly available instead of like hens teeth.

It would also help if other people didn’t co opt them because the queue is too long for the normal ones, or they have a pram they don’t want to leave, or they will only be a minute etc etc.

But as @Robinni says, if more people cared about this than that might change, but the attitude is always that it’s an afterthought at best, and usually just an inconvenience.

Having known someone who let their child at age 6 or 8 which ever age is usually written on the door have her son run out as he was approached by a man being inappropriate in public toilets I would never take the risk. It really depends on the place. Where we have swimming lessons there are lots of families so my older son can go in on his own. My 6 year old stays with me. If we are at the beach and it’s a bit isolated both boys come in with me. If someone wants to complain they can do so until the cows come home. I will still put my kids safety above anyone’s preference. If others don’t want to do the same that’s their decision. We sometimes stay at a caravan park, my 9 year old can use the toilet and showers in the men’s on his own during the day, but if he goes to the toilet after dark he comes into the women’s with me. The only person who has an issue with it, is him. Everyone does the same. No one cares. If they do, I don’t really care.

It's refreshing to see decent facilities, but you're right, there's a long way to go.

Yep. But still I personally would prefer proper male and female spaces; the doors of the cubicles aren’t big enough and some of the men are perverted.

Then we'd be back to it being harder for mums to help their older boys who need more support but cannot go in the female area.....cubicles with longer doors would seem obvious....I wonder why they're not?

Yep. Most places can’t manage to have one actually accessible toilet/changing place, never mind enough to actually cater to the need.

@sollenwir

I am not about to avoid anywhere due to disability.

I do not think that is the answer. Disabled people shouldn’t be excluded from anywhere.

I cannot leave my child alone to change.

1. he can’t change himself
2. he wanders and poses a risk to himself - particularly at a pool where he could drown!!!
3. he is vulnerable to sexual abuse/being abducted due to his lack of social understanding and implicit trust in everyone

So I’m sorry but if I find myself at a pool where there is no disability provision or even a disabled toilet I would be forced to have him change in with me.

If anyone complained, I’d say to take it up with management. And then I would challenge management and complain about the situation we had been placed in.

@sollenwir

I don’t think the current situation is appropriate for mothers or children.

The men aren’t just perverted about women… some of them are there to leer at the kids.

re. The doors - money probably.

You're disagreeing with whatever I say, so I'm going to leave it here. I wish you and your family well going forward.

@sollenwir

Sorry, I’m not looking for a fight.

But I do feel appalled I’m going to have to face another layer of crap to deal with within a year or so.

Apologies if any of that got deflected at you.

I had genuinely thought there wouldn’t be an issue until about 10/12 🤷‍♀️

Thank you for your good wishes. Take care.