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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to not sit down with this colleague?

225 replies

Bella60 · 05/11/2023 20:21

Okay, so had to name change for this one! Last year I was in a temporary management position at my school (I’m an English teacher) and part of my role was to promote whole-school literacy. I implemented a vocabulary online programme to KS3; I held parent assemblies about reading; I created monthly newsletters based around reading and book recommendations; I held a book club each week; visited other schools and did other stuff in the quest to improve literacy in the school and I had data to prove these things were starting to make an impact. Anyway, the Head then decided they wanted a ‘whole-school literacy lead’ so I applied for the position along with a science teacher. The science teacher got the job. Honestly, I’m fine about it because in hindsight it’s a mammoth task. The stuff I was doing was fun but the job description was huge! Last week, the science teacher who got the job asked for a sit down so she can go through all the things I did last year regarding literacy because she and SLT are keen to continue what I was doing. She said in the email she was also keen to hear what ideas I have for the future. So, I emailed back and gave her my contacts for the vocab builder platform and recommended a zoom call with them. I listed the things I had done last year and talked about what worked well but didn’t agree to meet her. Now SLT are turning up the heat and insisting I meet with her telling me that because I’m an English teacher I’m more knowledgeable about literacy and it’s ’my duty’ to support her and the school. (They actually said those words) WTAF?? I’m normally really laid back and will help anyone but I feel there’s a line here- I’m thinking if I wasn’t good enough for the position then why now are my ideas good enough?? What do you think? Am I being out of order by not sitting down with this teacher or should I stand my ground and say no?

OP posts:
Original poster
Bella60 · 05/11/2023 20:40

@Dacadactyl I'm astounded. Nothing surprises me about the school environment anymore.

OP posts:
echt · 05/11/2023 20:40

I think the vague approach would do, but surely all the documentation about the present literacy initiatives is "public" within the school, i.e. already available to staff?

wildwestpioneer · 05/11/2023 20:42

Sparklesocks · 05/11/2023 20:27

I’d be tempted to go down the weaponised incompetence route, meet with her but say I don’t have any new ideas beyond the ones Ive already implemented/shared - but best of luck, I’m sure as the literacy lead you will come up with some…😉

Edited

This is exactly what I'd do. Just reiterate what you've already told them and don't come forward with anything else. It's up to the new lead to push it forward now

Clarinet1 · 05/11/2023 20:46

I’m with those who go with stressing to her that
it’s her role now! I might even say something like “I wouldn’t presume to give you ideas when you’re the literacy lead!” (I have myself been in situations at work where I’m expected to train others in tasks I don’t seem to be considered capable of myself).

Original poster
Bella60 · 05/11/2023 20:46

@echt it is all there and SLT know about it so odd that there needs to be a discussion with me. I don’t blame the science teacher who got the role as she’s being pushed by SLT.

OP posts:
Anneta · 05/11/2023 20:47

I would cover your back by meeting with the science teacher - but only because you are the English teacher - as it seems she may have reported to senior management that you are being uncooperative. However don’t offer any other information other than advising her on how she can take over the extra work you have been doing as you have outlined in your email, like the weekly book club etc. Certainly do not offer her any new ideas or offer to help with implementing extra tasks that you are not now being paid for, as that is now down to her.

Noideawhatisgoingon · 05/11/2023 20:51

Nothing surprises me with schools anymore - so much piss taking and not being treated as a professional. No wonder so many people think we’re child care / incompetent / whatever we behave atrociously as a ‘profession’.

I’d bet my bottom dollar anything you shared as an idea going forward would magically become her idea and that would be even more annoying.

All the advice is great - meet with her, go through what you’ve sent her in the email and weaponised incompetence is the way forward! But don’t do it in your own time.

PlanesFlyingIn · 05/11/2023 20:52

I agree: WTAF! CF SLT!
Sparklesock’s idea…love it!
Plus make it clear you’re only receptive to discussing how she’ll implement the plans she suggested during the interview. After all, she has to impose her own cachet on the task. 😉

BeeCucumber · 05/11/2023 20:55

Agree to meet in working time. Smile and nod at their ideas. If they ask for your input - just say that you would not dare to presume that you could do a better job than the official literacy lead.

ThrallsWife · 05/11/2023 20:55

I second meeting with her to cover your back - your role or not, you know how being obviously uncooperative with whatever SLT want is being dealt with. And if your SLT members have the cheek to ask you to, essentially, help the new Lit read do her role despite rejecting you, they don't seem the type to have much common sense.

A whole-school Lit role is really Lead Practitioner territory due to its whole-school nature and comes with a hefty salary uplift if so, unless anyone is already on UPS3.

In your meeting, go over what you did last year. If you feel generous, you can go down the coaching route and essentially get her to come up with the ideas herself. Make sure to minute everything you go over in your email and have it as backup for your own performance management meeting as evidence for wider school involvement, perhaps to still climb up the scale.

I'd use it as positively as I could for myself while still not actually contributing more - because you're right, you're not paid for that anymore.

PastorCarrBonarra · 05/11/2023 20:55

Yes, I’d meet with her and be polite and enthusiastic but I wouldn’t do her job for her.

Spidey66 · 05/11/2023 20:57

How cheeky of them. If your ideas were so good, they should have given you the post especially given you're an English teacher not a science teacher!

LittleMooli · 05/11/2023 20:58

Sparklesocks · 05/11/2023 20:27

I’d be tempted to go down the weaponised incompetence route, meet with her but say I don’t have any new ideas beyond the ones Ive already implemented/shared - but best of luck, I’m sure as the literacy lead you will come up with some…😉

Edited

This

Original poster
Bella60 · 05/11/2023 21:00

@Noideawhatisgoingon ive been teaching for 17 years and I’ve come across odd things in the 3 schools I’ve worked at but this has dumbfounded me! I feel like I have ‘door mat’ on my head but at the same time, I feel I’m being unreasonable. I can’t work it out!

OP posts:
Original poster
Bella60 · 05/11/2023 21:01

@Spidey66 the Head made the point that literacy was a whole school thing and nothing to do with English so there was perhaps an agenda by employing a science teacher to do the job. The whole thing is strange though!

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Alltheyearround · 05/11/2023 21:02

Agree with above. Cheeky fuckery.

If you'd like a couple of ideas to send her off with then I'd suggest -

Two things we do (FE college library) are a world book day sale (donated books from kids and parents/general community). Need storage and quality control.

Our primary did one in the hall on WBD and it was great. Books 3 for £1 and everyone is a winner.

Also a free book stall - similar to above and someone needs to keep an eye out for tatty/unsuitable - but all free - take one and or leave one you finished with. Could be for parents (encourage kids to see them read) and or for the children. Can run all year round.

Smile sweetly and tell her you hope its all a great success.

Head tilt, tinkly laugh, off you go hun optional, but you can imagine doing these even if not childish enough to do it irl.

I sometimes lock myself in a toilet cubicle to swear quietly and stick 2 fingers up when similar happens at my work. Very therapeutic I find.

WrongSwanson · 05/11/2023 21:03

LittleMooli · 05/11/2023 20:58

This

Show quote history

I wouldn't do exactly this because I imagine they are quite close to appointing the wrong person. And you might want SLT to think you do have plenty of ideas up your sleeves.
I'd highlight that you felt you gave quite a competent handover but if she has any specific queries about what you did last year you are happy to talk them through but that you will defer to her on terms of the future direction of the programme

ExcitingRicotta · 05/11/2023 21:04

How bizarre! Did they give you any feedback on your application/interview? Were they trying to keep the Science teacher in the school..?
You’ve had loads of good advice here already OP, so just to reiterate, you are not going crazy!

Alltheyearround · 05/11/2023 21:05

But you'd be perfectly within your rights to not pass on ideas, only that it might look a bit snippy on your part and may not win brownie points from SLT. Depends on how much image management you want to engage in.

Up to you, however the suggestion from pp about not having thought about it now its passed out of your remit sounds reasonable.

Aurasauras · 05/11/2023 21:06

Well two options:- play the long game, be seen to be a team player and hope you get the next promotion.
Or, be very busy, direct her to the resources and let her work it out. There’s a danger when you spoon feed people that they never learn to eat. She needs to learn the skills. This option may make you unpopular though.

Noideawhatisgoingon · 05/11/2023 21:08

I think (for I am a wise old bird) that the feeling unreasonable feeling is because you want to be a ‘team player’. You’re obviously passionate as you’ve done the job for the year and had great ideas so because you’re nice and want to do the best for the children (that old yardstick to beat yourself / for other people to beat you with) you feel you should be helpful.
But they are seriously taking the piss.

Original poster
Bella60 · 05/11/2023 21:08

@ThrallsWife thank you for this. You are probably right. SLT are vicious in my school. I could just be opening myself up for problems in the future by not meeting with her. The TLR is shocking btw. Its under 3k.

OP posts:
SD1978 · 05/11/2023 21:08

I'd say that one sit down, isn't unreasonable at all, and it looks a bit childish not to. A short meeting, outlying what you did, but I wouldn't be giving on going support or assistance with the role

Original poster
Bella60 · 05/11/2023 21:10

@Noideawhatisgoingon you’ve summed me up!

OP posts:
stardust40 · 05/11/2023 21:10

Teacher here as well and I think asking for the hand over meeting would be good practice. This doesn't mean you have to tell her lots of ideas etc just make sure she is clear on what has been done and what's on the current action plan. It will give her the opportunity to ask anything that she is not sure of. Once you've done that you are no longer needed to do anything further.