Man in ladies loo (with little daughter)

[CallmePaul]

Hello Mumsnet, 1st poster here.

So I'm the man in question here, my 4yr old girl needed the loo in a big store today, went into the men's, stinky & horrible & the only 1 available cubicle is engaged, the disabled one is locked & my little one is busting.
I opened the ladies door, wow much nicer than the men's! I asked loudly if it was OK if a man came in with his little girl to the loo, got an OK from a cubicle, business attended to.

Washing her & my hands afterwards I got a pretty loud tut & mumble of humph womans toilets, from a lady who just entered, I get it, I'm a bloke in a ladies loos, I really shouldn't be in there.

I've never taken her in the ladies before, always the men's & some pretty nasty loos at times.

So acceptable behaviour from me or was I out of order?

It's not like you were peeing in the sink so I would have had no issues with it.

My 7 year old son was busting for a wee the other week and there was a LONG queue for the women's so I took him in the mens! The cubical were surprisingly clean in M&S!! No one seemed to mind!

Wouldn’t have bothered me and If I was in the queue I’d have left you go first.

Presumably OP didn’t have his knob out though, unlike the men in a men’s toilet.

It's a long time since ours were little it's the grand children now but there's no way I'd let our kids go on their own.

I think it's absolutely fine OP. Your 4 year old takes priority, she couldn't wait and you called out to make sure it's okay. No way in hell would I let my 4 year old use public toilets alone, womens or not.

To all those women who 'freeze' or hate men being in their 'safe space ' what do you do when a male cleaner is in there? It's not as If you went into the women's toilet for yourself.

Wouldn’t bother me. It’d be different if you were using the loos but you were accompanying your daughter. No way on earth would I send my 4 year old child into toilets alone like some of these replies are suggesting! You did the right thing.

You did right by your daughter, and I'd hope my husband would do the same for our 3 year old girl

They could campaign to increase cleanliness, have more family toilets, reduce male violence, any number of things. They don;t though. Far easier to have the service bots do everything.

Anyway OP hasn't been back. There's a fucking shock.

Depends on the state of the men's but tbh if the mens is really disgusting and not just stinky then I think it's fine to go in the womens if the child is unable to toilet alone. I had to take my daughter into a men's toilet today (I am a women) as the women's was out of order and the sign said to use the men's and I was disgusted at the state it was in and didn't want her in there being exposed to the man using the urinal.

I think it’s fine. Not ideal maybe but understandable. In a pub near me there’s a sign in the ladies’ loo which says men might be in here as it’s the only loo with the space for a baby changing mat and the pub encourages families. No one minds.

I left a venue that had unisex mass loos because I couldn't use them. Raped twice, I couldn't drop my knickers in a room where strange men were the other side of a partition that had gaps top and bottom. You aren't harmed by single-sex spaces but I am harmed by the lack of them. It's not up to you to decide that I don't need single-sex spaces just because you are lucky enough not to need them.

I can’t believe people would rather a four year old goes into a toilet in her own where there would be potential strangers, than her dad take her in. There’s cubicles once inside, it’s not like he can see women peeing. I bet the majority of these people would bring their 4 year old son into the women’s and not send them in to the men’s alone.

Purely on the basis of you being a dad with a small girl in a hurry , I’d have had no issue. I’ve helped out a dad in this situation before myself by offering to go in the ladies and clear the way/ check before he went in. As it went I must have given off ‘safe’ vibes because he instead just asked if she could go in with me and my little girl. I obliged. This was many years ago as DD is now an adult. You were okay in this situation though. In future, save yourself the stress and ask DD to give you a bit more notice. I managed to get mine to ask to go well before bursting so DH would have had time to wait for disabled loo/baby room if he’d have been in your shoes.

Exactly!

The ‘woman’s space’ is not truly a woman’s space when there are male workers there all of the time.

My friend is a single parent to a child with additional needs.
He is now in his 20s but needs 1-1 support at all times.
If the disabled loo is busy then she really struggles because women say he can’t be in their space and men say she can’t be in their space.

I think when there is a genuine reason then it’s fine.

I do think there needs to be more unisex toilets as this is an issue so many parents face.
I’m also sick of queuing for the ladies when the men’s are usually free.

Oh for goodness sake. What a faff. I think it was fine. You called out 1st. Men's loos are no place for children

why? Because they’re gross and men can be dangerous. So why should they be in women’s spaces?

All of these people saying they'd let a 4 year old in public toilets alone, how do you know there aren't drug needles in the cubicle? Or other things. Never worth the risk, and not one i'd choose to risk with my child.

Another shining example of mumsnet insanity. 9,10,11 year old boys cannot be expected to go to the men’s toilet and a perfectly fine to use the women’s toilet with their mummy, but a four-year-old girl should be able to go to the toilet completely by herself. Seriously, it’s fine. Don’t worry about it and ignore these people on here.
also, all of use saying the four-year-old should be able to do it by themselves would be the first ones to scream child, neglect by an incompetent father when you saw a four-year-old by themselves in the toilet.

I’m talking about a loo brush at home, obviously. Seriously, girls and women seem to be able to manage toilet etiquette but boys and men apparently can’t if the men’s toilets are always so rank. My question is: why is this? Are boys and men held to lower standards than girls and women? Are they not taught to clean up their bodily fluids and secretions after themselves?

I'd have no issue with a dad with a female child. I think you were right to ask first. As others have said toilets frequently have male attendants.

I have no issue with a man going in to the Ladies with a small child.

I take it you're offering to clear up the mess? 🙄

I had a DD who was still having accidents at four.

Honestly, there are some right arses on this thread. How surprising. 🙄

Tbh I often see women using the men's loo when the queue fo r the ladies is too long (( in pubs etc )) and no, this wouldn't bother me.

Then it's not a ladies' loos any more, it's been made unisex. Why can't the pub remodel the gents to make space for a baby change table? The ones that pull down from the wall can fit into the same space as a standard cubicle.

bet the majority of these people would bring their 4 year old son into the women’s and not send them in to the men’s alone

yes. You go in the parents sex’s toilet not the kids. You’re fucking your own argument

Stay out of women's toilets if you are not a woman.

It is not rocket science.