Man in ladies loo (with little daughter)

[CallmePaul]

Hello Mumsnet, 1st poster here.

So I'm the man in question here, my 4yr old girl needed the loo in a big store today, went into the men's, stinky & horrible & the only 1 available cubicle is engaged, the disabled one is locked & my little one is busting.
I opened the ladies door, wow much nicer than the men's! I asked loudly if it was OK if a man came in with his little girl to the loo, got an OK from a cubicle, business attended to.

Washing her & my hands afterwards I got a pretty loud tut & mumble of humph womans toilets, from a lady who just entered, I get it, I'm a bloke in a ladies loos, I really shouldn't be in there.

I've never taken her in the ladies before, always the men's & some pretty nasty loos at times.

So acceptable behaviour from me or was I out of order?

I didn’t want him going to the men’s toilets. I didn’t want him exposed to grown men’s genitals at the urinals, whether I’m there or not. He would still be able to see them. Another reason why I’m shocked anyone would say to take a small girl into the men’s toilets. I must discuss this with my partner, because I do not
want her going into the men’s. I assumed he would be taking her to the ladies when he takes her to the toilets. But after reading this, it’s not a given. But I will be stipulating that he must take her into the ladies.
I think the hysteria on this thread is ridiculous. You’d rather a small child (male or female) be exposed to mens genitalia than a man, walk through an area where no women are exposed at all, because all women use cubicles. This is madness to me.

@saffy2 What if the 4year old was a boy out with his dad? Or your DS

Is it acceptable then for him to be exposed to grown men's genitals

I'm not sure I get this argument

@saffy2

I agree with you Saffy and pretty much said the same thing in my previous post. Given that adult males are far more likely to be predators than females I would not let a 4 year old go alone into men's public toilets. I think that's incredibly irresponsible parenting and I'm not entirely sure I believe the women on this thread who say they would. In any event, a child is likely to be exposed to naked male genitalia in the men's loos and I'm surprised at the number of women on here who think that's OK for a 4 year old girl. Consdering the furore around women and girls' safety, I'm staggered that any mother would cheerfully wave her unaccompanied 4 year old child off into a public toilet. My son was born in the 1970's and I wouldn't have considered doing that for one single minute even back then.

I was a single parent, so he was never out with his dad.
But no, I wouldn’t have been happy to be honest.
It’s ok for you not to get it, I don’t mind. But I don’t agree that it’s better for small children to be in a men’s toilets than a man to walk through a ladies toilets and into a cubicle with their child. And the hysteria on this thread hasn’t led me to think I’m in the wrong. I would prefer any man to walk through the ladies toilets foyer and into a cubicle while I am stood there fully clothed washing my hands, than a small child be taken into a men’s toilets where grown men are urinating in a urinal in the foyer, with the genitalia exposed. And I do not understand why anyone would prefer the child to be exposed, as opposed to no woman being seen exposed at all…because in the foyer all women are fully dressed and only washing their hands…no pants are down, no one is weeing in the foyer in a ladies toilet…no one is exposed and the man will not see anything at all untoward by walking through with their small child into a locked cubicle. Even if in the locked cubicle next to it there is a woman weeing.

I think it’s irresponsible parenting for any young child to be entering any toilets ladies or
mens alone. I think it’s disgusting that so many people on here have suggested that but then have a literally ridiculous hysteria about a man being a good dad and walking through a foyer of a ladies toilets where nobody is exposed at all. but they’re happy for a child to be put at risk in either toilets just so that they don’t have to see a man walk past them while fully clothed 😂🙈🤷🏽‍♀️

I'd have been perfectly ok with it! No one knows the capability of this man's daughter and what she can and cannot do! I really don't see the problem and if you did have a problem maybe wait one minute until his daughter had finished and they had both left before using the facilities.

.

Seriously?!?

Yes, we women should be made to wait to use our own toilets if a Great Dad Man decides to take his 4-year old in there.

if you did have a problem maybe wait one minute until his daughter had finished and they had both left before using the facilities.

Did you read what you wrote?

@saffy2

Hysteria is the right word. They would rather see a young child put in danger than let a father (who shouted and knocked before entering) with a young daughter quickly use the ladies. He hardly fits the classic pervert profile does he. All the women would have been fully clothed and at worst refreshing their lipstick or brushing their hair. If that's enough to make them reach for the smelling salts then god help us all. Anyway, as women (and many of them mothers) I can't believe they would lack such understanding and be so willing to send such a young child alone into public loos.

Nobody's elevating him to 'Great Dad Man'- that's your warped and screwy ideological take. And it's reaching. Sort your head out. It is the child's (future woman btw) needs that are at the heart of this.

I’m still stunned by the amount of people on here who think if you walk through a man’s toilet you see loads of penises flapping in the wind!!!

Well, in reality there is more chance of seeing genitalia in a male toilet with urinals than a male/female/mixed one without urinals, but I imagine you'd have to be actively looking to actually see much! Most of us probably aren't doing that, though it might be shocking to a little girl who hasn't seen a urinal before I imagine?

I reckon most kids take stuff like that in their stride. They’ve seen their dads, brothers wee. I don’t think 4 year old girls are actively trying to view a penis. It’s just not of interest

The only hysteria here is anyone pretending that a 4 year old girl can’t wait for a few moments until a cubicle in the men’s is free. There are endless situations where she would have to wait - on a long drive, or even if she went to women’s toilets with her mum where there was a queue.

And if the men’s is gross then that’s not women’s problem. There are also many situations where the girl have to use a gross unisex toilet eg on a plane or train.

The point about a 4yr old girl going on her own into the women’s toilets is that if they are women only she is at virtually no risk of coming to any harm. That is only the case when men are present.

Its a great point about 4 year old boys too - would the OP take his son into the women’s? With his level of aggressive entitlement, I’m guessing yes actually. How have men survived for the last 100 years without accompanying their daughters into women-only spaces? All these ridiculous hypotheticals (‘there might not be another toilet within 2 days’ travel’ etc) just make it even more absurd.

No men in women’s spaces. None.

Who suggested they were trying to see anything? Also, some little girls don't have brothers, nor have seen their dads naked (nothing wrong if they have innocently, of course).

Just the same as we all do when we have kids.
Plan ahead
When we have babies we all know what places offer baby changing facilities
If we are disabled people know where they can locate an accessible toilet.

Plan ahead to avoid the problem in the first place.

You did what you had to do, & we do have unisex toilets. But it would be useful to have more parent & child toilets.

My son was on a laxative medication too once, and I wouldn't have dared take him very far. Hellish time. Even the doctor warned me about them. Really it was a disaster waiting to happen.

I did actually and I stand by it. All I'm saying is if it really bothered you THAT much could you just not wait a minute? Or just get on with your own business! It's not like it happens all the time, maybe only once in your life you might come across this situation?

I see nothing more than a dad trying his best to look after his daughter! Could he have planned better? Yes probably. But none of us are perfect and we all get cut short from time to time!

Gosh, how wonderful to see such dynamic mothers all in one place whose parenting skills are almost superhuman. If only I'd known when my son was little that toilet emergencies were a result of my own stupidity.

It’s amazing that a child needing to use the toilet when out and about is considered such a huge parenting fail 😂

The long queues for womens toilets and
now we are expected to wait to use them whilst men are in there.

Maybe….just maybe the women are also desperate for the toilet.
The fact that we give birth means we cannot hold on for long.

Or is it ok for women to wet themselves whilst we wait for men to leave our toilets. Men still on top I see.

Well said 👏