Man in ladies loo (with little daughter)

[CallmePaul]

Hello Mumsnet, 1st poster here.

So I'm the man in question here, my 4yr old girl needed the loo in a big store today, went into the men's, stinky & horrible & the only 1 available cubicle is engaged, the disabled one is locked & my little one is busting.
I opened the ladies door, wow much nicer than the men's! I asked loudly if it was OK if a man came in with his little girl to the loo, got an OK from a cubicle, business attended to.

Washing her & my hands afterwards I got a pretty loud tut & mumble of humph womans toilets, from a lady who just entered, I get it, I'm a bloke in a ladies loos, I really shouldn't be in there.

I've never taken her in the ladies before, always the men's & some pretty nasty loos at times.

So acceptable behaviour from me or was I out of order?

Far too many Karen's about these days, it's not like you were using the loo yourself was it?!

Please don't use ageist, misogynist slurs.

No, not appropriate. You should take her to the accessible toilet instead.

Totally fine! I wouldn’t want my little girl going into really gross men’s loos either! Traumatic. (I’m a woman for what it’s worth).

Why on earth would those of you who said no be offended by this? What do you think the dad is going to do?

I'm shocked by how many people have an issue with this. I really wouldn't care in the slightest, you've got a child with you! Everyone is in a cubicle so what's the big deal 🙃

why do people get so worked up about this! I bet so many mums take their little boys into the womens all the time, I know I do, wouldn’t even cross my mind to send him into the men’s! Such dramatic responses from women who have nothing better to do than moan about men. If there was a post from a women complaining about how there partner had taken the little girl into a man’s toilet then they would agree that a child shouldn’t be in the mens toilet and how irresponsible of him!

You did the right thing.

I am not a fan of men being in a female toilet but if I saw a man with his daughter, I would assume he must have been desperate or had a valid reason. TBH, I don't think I would keen for my daughter to go to the mens especially as they are mainly urinals

The child is 4. She has been using the toilet at school or nursery unaccompanied presumably. You could have sent her in alone while you waited outside.

^^ OP. Don't be invading women's safe spaces.

@ThelmaBorden I appreciate your point, in a regular case your suggestions may have worked, but it seems in this case it was rather urgent.

BTW, there are woken who end up "othered" because they look particularly masculine and are told they don't belong in the ladies

I'm used to it and, as I said to the last woman who mistook me for a man, I'd be challenged wrongfully than have her fail to challenge a man who might be there for nefarious purposes. But no thanks for using me as a human prop for your woke luxury belief that single-sex loos aren't needed.

The child knows the layout at school. My 4yo would have been very uncomfortable going into a new set of toilets without me. You can obviously see the difference here?

why do people get so worked up about this! I bet so many mums take their little boys into the womens all the time, I know I do, wouldn’t even cross my mind to send him into the men’s! Such dramatic responses from women who have nothing better to do than moan about men

yes exactly. So he should have taken his child into the men’s. Some people are such idiots.

She is a 4 year old girl fgs . There really are some nasty fuckers on MN .

Far too many Karen's about these days, it's not like you were using the loo yourself was it?!

FYI there's no possessive apostrophe. If you're going to use a lame insult, at least make it grammatically correct.

I'd have no issue with a dad taking his daughter into the ladies' loo. There's cubicles and I wouldn't really want my daughter having to navigate the urinals. Appreciate others may have a different view.

He could have asked for the key to the disabled loo.

Not ideal but still better than invading women's spaces.

What about the woman or girl who was also desperate but had to turn tail and leg it somewhere else because there was a strange man in there? She doesn't matter obviously.

Yes more family toilets would be great but they aren't going to happen if we just give men free reign in the ladies because they think it's ok.

OP obviously thinks he did the right thing anyway so I'd assume he's only posting to get attention or get permission for the next time.

if you thought you’d made the right decision why post on mn asking AIBU?

Somewhat amazed actually! Didn't know it was that busy on here or it would provoke such a reaction.

Happy that it seems the majority don't think I'm a maniac sex pest, but really bemused at the vitriol from some, more than bemused really.

now ask Paul what he would do with his daughter if he needed a slash himself or even…
anything more complicated, whilst he is out, a sudden urgent call of nature,
where is his 4 year old daughter at that juncture ?

taking your daughter into women’s with a warning seems like a better idea than taking your daughter into men’s - some people are just too comfortable at urinals.
i also think young children would need help to avoid too much contact with a public toilet, so waiting outside is not always a good option even the child can technically manage alone.
i understand safety concerns, but if you’re clearly accompanying a young child, people need to chill.

TOTALLY fine with it - I spent a lot more time withmy dad as a very young girl in the 70s 80s (where any public loos were GRIM) He always used to literally whizz me in and out of stinking horrid male loos because he was too scared to enter the female, it was GRIM. I occasionally see a Dad and young daughter in female loos - absolutely no issue - no idea why any woman would be bothered - what are dads supposed to do? You can see the dad really doesn't want to be there. Total lack of understanding if you think this is wrong for heavens sake! I see loads of young boys in female loos with their mum. No different. People love to make a fuss.

Oh look - someone's ageism is showing.

Any woman who uses the name 'Karen' as an insult comes across like she's waving in the air going 'Oh not I'm not like them! I'm so cool! Please like meeeeeeeeeeee'.

You should be going in the disabled/family bathroom.

You do know you're in AIBU, right? Not IKIBUBIDC or LMTYWIAR or FUIDWIL.

I know I'm being unreasonable but I don't care
Let me tell you why I am reasonable
Fuck you, I do what I like

They aren't yours to give away. They aren't even other women's to give away. Since it's now obvious that a significant proportion of women would be unhappy, and a smaller proportion would experience trauma or PTSD, what can you do?

Write to the shopping centre, campaign for more family loos, plan better, go to places with more provision, take your partner, female friend or relative if you are going somewhere with only female provision, take a pair of marigolds and clean beforehand, camping potty? What will you do to make the situation better?