Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be so frustrated with shy child?

310 replies

LolleePopp · 04/11/2023 11:16

What do you do with shy 12 year old boys???
My 12 year old DS is sooooo shy with other kids.
He says he's desperate to make friends at his new secondary school.
But he's too shy to engage with anybody.
So he's not making any friends.
He really, really wants to be friends with people. He's not a loner who prefers his own company. He's a loner who looks at everyone around him and wants to make friends but doesn't know how to.
He started secondary school in September saying he was really looking forward to starting a new school and making new friends.
8 weeks in, he's made no friends at all.
There's 1 boy who he'd like to make friends with. So I've encouraged him to invite this boy to meet up outside of school. I helped him come up with ideas to suggest. I texted the boy's mum to try and help organise something. She said her DS would be up for meeting but that she is trying to encourage her DS to be independent so she said could they sort it out between them rather than us mums organising it. I explained this to DS and encouraged him to invite this boy to meet up. But he just will not invite him, even though he wants to meet up with him. After a few weeks of me trying hard to encourage him, last night he said "I'm not going to invite him out mum, I'm just too shy to ask him".
So that's that then.
Another new boy from new school invited him out for a bike ride with him and 3 others. My DS went, and came home 3 hours later full of smiles saying he'd had a great time. But since then, the mum of one of the boys has told me that the other kids all said my DS was really quiet and didn't talk at all or engage with the rest of the kids who were all chatting and joking whilst on their bikes. She said the other kids said my DS was too quiet. Yet my DS thought he had a brilliant time with them and asked them to let him know when theyre going again as hed like to join in, but meanwhile this other mum said the other kids probably won't invite him out next time because my DS was so quiet they thought he wasn't having fun with them. When in fact he told me he had really good fun, so I relayed this to the mum, but she said "Well they've met up a few times since then but didn't invite your DS because he was so quiet". DS has seen them out cycling round together without him and looked crestfallen.
There's another boy he likes, so I've texted that mum and she told me she leaves her DS to arrange his own social life now he's started secondary. So I've told my DS this and encouraged him to invite this boy over to ours or to meet up, but again, my DS won't invite him.
He's been going to an out of school club for 1 year and hasn't made a single friend there.
He hates competitive sports, so he will not join any football or rugby groups (much to my DH's frustration - DH is not sports mad but he insists a team sport would be good for DS's confidence, but DS refuses). He tried cricket but dropped out after 2 months. I've suggested judo at my DH's suggestion - flat no, he absolutely hated the look of it when I showed him kids of his age doing judo on YouTube.
In primary, he had 5 friends but the dynamics between them in year 6 were awful, constant fall outs and unpleasant behaviour on a non stop basis, a lot of horrible behaviour aimed at him (as well as at each other) so they've all fallen by the wayside now.
DS is a brilliant person. He talks loads at home, really makes us all laugh, has amazing insight into things (insight that is superior to his age), understands people really well, has very high levels of emotional intelligence - there are so many situations on this level that he just 'gets' and can talk eloquently about things on an emotional level that other mums tell me their kids of same age can't do or don't get at all, he has lots of interests (but none them transfer in to clubs). He gets on brilliantly with his sister, who is not shy at all.
It's really weird - when he was a little boy he wasn't shy at all. He ran around with a big bright happy open expression on his face, he was born with a "Hello world!" temperament. Then around the age of 10, shyness kicked in, and 2 years later it's much worse. He's getting more shy as he gets older.
I can see that this comes across really badly to other kids.
We were out at an event the other evening, and throughout the event, several boys in his school year that know him smiled and said Hi to him on individual occasions (not a group of boys, but 1 boy, then 10 mins later another boy, etc.) and DS didn't smile back at any of them. He did reply to each of them with a hello, but he came across as so stand offish. I talked to him the next day about how he came across to them, but he just said "I'm so shy mum, I freeze and clam up when they speak to me, I hate it but I don't know what to do because I can't help it".
I've encouraged him to join clubs at school but he won't because he doesn't know anyone. Obviously I've explained that no-one knows anyone at first, but you go and then you get to know people. But he will not go.
I'm at the point where I despair.
I can see him spending 5 years at school not making any friends.
If he didn't care about friends and was happy in his own little world then I'd think fine, that's just how he is. But he tells me he really, really wants to make friends.
I've talked to his school about it and asked for their support, and they said he needs to join school clubs. That was their only solution and 3 different staff members have all said the same thing. But he won't go to these clubs.
So what do I do?!?

OP posts:
Etincelle · 04/11/2023 19:59

My dds are 16 and 19 now but the 19 year old was a bit prone to being bullied at primary school. She got a phone in Year 6 and she just restricted her social media and WhatsApp to a few trusted kids who she knew were nice. That worked for her throughout secondary school. Things did improve for her at secondary though. It was a Comp, but the school were very hot on bullying and she didn't have any issues at secondary.

Badbadbunny · 04/11/2023 19:59

@Hernameisdeborah

Stick up for him whenever anyone makes sneery comments about him being quiet (and they will).

Sadly, teachers are often the worst for doing that. We had it every parent's evening with our son. "He's too quiet", "He should speak up more", etc etc. The fact he was getting straight A*s, never in trouble, always did homework on time etc never registered with them - they just had to moan he was too quiet!

Delpf · 04/11/2023 19:59

LolleePopp · 04/11/2023 18:58

OK.....
I am taking this on board.
How do you teach resilience from damaging text messages?
There is so much talk on the mums WhatsApp group about phone bullying amongst the year 7s, some mums sound really distressed about it and are saying their kids are refusing to go in to school because of horrible texts.
Some mums have screenshot the messages their DC have been receiving, and honestly, I've seen them and they are really psychologically damaging.
One screenshot was of a yr 7 texting another Yr 7 with details of how to commit suicide and telling them to do it, by someone she'd only seen around school and didn't even know. Other mums have shown texts their DC have received that involved abuse, racism, hatred, personal insults, humiliation, threats.....honestly, it's horrific. These are 11 and 12 year old kids.
The school is saying there's nothing they can do about it because they're not being sent during school hours, other than give assemblies about safe use of phones and 'being kind'.

You tell him that some people find upsetting others fun - it's like a game to them. He should not get sucked into their game and should never reply to these messages!

If he gets a nasty text, he should think about who sent it and why. The message says he's fat/ugly/stupid/deserves to die/whatever awful thing. Is it true? Obviously not. He knows he's a great person, that lots of people love him and that he is a net positive in the world. Why would someone send it? To make him feel bad/to provoke a reaction. Why would someone want to make him feel bad? Because they're bored/trying to make themselves feel powerful by hurting others/seeing what they can get away with/trying to be ~edgy/joining in out of fear. Is the person who sent it someone he should listen to? They're the type of person who sends awful messages, so no - they obviously don't respect other people and can't think very far into the future, so they are not someone to waste time on. It's normal to feel upset when someone says something nasty, but - the message was sent by someone who is not a credible person and the message is not true. Therefore, he should ignore the message and block the number. If he feels bad, he needs to remind himself that people he knows and loves - mum/dad/auntie/neighbour think he is clever/good/kind/good at x/y/z. Tell him he can come and ask you for a reminder about how great he is and how much you love him any time.
Remind him that if something upsets him or if he keeps thinking about it he should tell you/dad/sibling.

Really make sure he understands that he needs to tell you if something upsets him to the extent that he can't deal with it emotionally (or if any of the messages are racist/sexist/etc or threatening). Practice with him how he can move on from the messages by either doing something he enjoys or by listing good things about himself, coming to you for a hug, etc.

Vettrianofan · 04/11/2023 20:02

LolleePopp · 04/11/2023 17:52

A few have mentioned drama.
He's been going to drama every week for 1 year.

Aye, you are too over invested. Creating extra drama. I have several children to raise at once and can't get too invested in friendship groups as it is nothing to do with me. I am not there at school with them. It's their life.

Please by all means I would seriously consider counselling (one of my DC attends regular sessions for trauma related stuff) and help your DS in this capacity.

Please don't micromanage his life, you will cause more damage. I mean this in a kind way 🫂

Delpf · 04/11/2023 20:05

But ia with other posters that he shouldn't have to learn to be resilient to abusive messages (at age 12!) and repeat that personally I would move him to a different school. Good on him for saying he doesn't want to be pushed out, but what's the point of staying? I don't think sticking it out is going to benefit him in any way, whereas a clean slate likely will.

SpringingJoy · 04/11/2023 20:05

OK.....I am taking this on board. How do you teach resilience from damaging text messages?

By not giving too much weight to it in front of him (if it happens, phone wise). And the same with any face to face bullying or ignoring or unpleasantness.

Tell him, teach him, that some people are just arseholes. And that their behaviour/comments/messages say more about them than him. ANY instance of bullying whether in rl or virtually, approach with a 'my goodness, what an absolute arsehole Sophie is. How horrible she sounds'. Block. NOT 'oh my goodness, are you OK, I'm so sorry' etc. Make the messages or incident about THEM, the bully. and not about him.

Not giving weight to it doesn't mean ignoring it. Report to the school (or police if very serious) and block numbers. But ime, less overt sympathy for the child will help them, not harm them.

Your reaction is everything op (not to heap pressure on, sorry). The more importance you place on such incidents, the more you let them affect you or you dwell on them, the more he will.

Etincelle · 04/11/2023 20:09

I agree that the culture of the school sounds vile. Were there any nice kids at his primary that moved to the school? Did he used to have friends over at primary?
I didn't like the culture at dds primary really. (And it was a very popular over subscribed school.) Their secondary Comp has a much better culture though.

Vettrianofan · 04/11/2023 20:11

Most teens communicate through Snapchat and Discord these days. I have two teenagers and they use mainly online communication with friends outside of school.

I hear you OP, there are some seriously nasty shits out there posting stuff online amongst their peers.

Please consider getting your DS a cheap phone. You don't want to ostracize him from his peers.

jolaylasofia · 04/11/2023 20:13

get him a phone and stop trying to force friendships. it's strange for a boy in year 7 for their mother to try to arrange things and talk to other moms about get togethers.
Other kids will find this strange too. Please stop being so involved. you are hindering him

HamBone · 04/11/2023 20:14

Tell him, teach him, that some people are just arseholes. And that their behaviour/comments/messages say more about them than him.

@SpringingJoy I agree that this is an important life lesson. A boy at DS’s middle school seemed to take pleasure in putting other children down and I said the same to DS- that “Tommy’s” behavior said more about him than the people he picked on. DS decided to keep away from him, as did many other children.

I’m the same as an adult-if I don’t like a person’s behaviour, I keep our interactions to a minimum.

Hernameisdeborah · 04/11/2023 20:23

Badbadbunny · 04/11/2023 19:59

@Hernameisdeborah

Stick up for him whenever anyone makes sneery comments about him being quiet (and they will).

Sadly, teachers are often the worst for doing that. We had it every parent's evening with our son. "He's too quiet", "He should speak up more", etc etc. The fact he was getting straight A*s, never in trouble, always did homework on time etc never registered with them - they just had to moan he was too quiet!

Yes, absolutely agree, teachers can be terrible for this!! It's so frustrating when you're working hard, achieving good grades and doing your best yet teachers just focus on you not being chatty enough for their liking and making clear they think you're defective in some way. It's horrendous. All the more reason why I feel it would help if the OP keeps backing up her son and sticking up for him if anyone does comment unhelpfully on his quietness. Basically, keep impressing on him that he is fine as he is. It should at least help him feel he is worthy of friendship and respect and hopefully help him in the longer term.

BettyPhuckzer · 04/11/2023 20:34

It's so difficult for him after such utterly horrible nastiness at primary

But he needs to learn resilience and how to ignore avoid and push away / block the nasties and how to encourage and reach out to the nice kids

Saying he's shy and can't reach out = I'm scared and I don't want to be bullied which is totally understandable but he has to learn to push through the fear

You are so fearful yourself, OP, that you aren't allowing him nor are you encouraging him, to push through, and interact with his peers in the way kids interact

Of course he'll be bullied again. It's inevitable.

But you are smothering him with love and not empowering him to learn and grow

I absolutely get WHY you are doing this but you are holding him back

He needs a phone

He needs to be taught strategies to reach out (saying he's shy isn't an excuse to be used)

He needs to be taught strategies to overcome the bullying which is bound to happen

Please stop treating him as though he's 5

And please teach him that shyness can = rudeness

Etincelle · 04/11/2023 20:41

Hernameisdeborah · 04/11/2023 20:23

Yes, absolutely agree, teachers can be terrible for this!! It's so frustrating when you're working hard, achieving good grades and doing your best yet teachers just focus on you not being chatty enough for their liking and making clear they think you're defective in some way. It's horrendous. All the more reason why I feel it would help if the OP keeps backing up her son and sticking up for him if anyone does comment unhelpfully on his quietness. Basically, keep impressing on him that he is fine as he is. It should at least help him feel he is worthy of friendship and respect and hopefully help him in the longer term.

I agree too. We had this with dd1 at Primary. Not at Secondary though. I think she was still quiet at Secondary but the teachers there didn't seem to see this as some huge failure thankfully

PurpleSneakers · 04/11/2023 20:49

@madnessitellyou totally agree about self-fulfilling prophecies
Your son should start thinking about all the times he has had success socially in the past- talking with other kids, communicating with relatives, those times we just lose ourselves in conversation. Even thinking about the times he has smiled at someone or made eye contact - all of those things are a great success and show that he can be confident socially. He needs to drown-out that shy label - it is not serving him well. Replace it with another label - he is making an effort to be social (or perhaps quietly confident).

Maybe he can start by thinking about some questions he might like to ask his new friends to break the ice - ‘where did you get your bike from’ etc

He will start to believe in himself.

Hotpinkangel19 · 04/11/2023 20:51

Are you definitely sure he isn't ND OP? He sounds very like my son - he has Aspergers.

Boomboom22 · 04/11/2023 22:33

It is quite weird to even know any parents in yr7 up tbh. Def don't be messaging them unless you are friends with them separately.

XelaM · 04/11/2023 23:21

LolleePopp · 04/11/2023 19:06

And everyone is sharing numbers of others.
So kids are giving out numbers of people in their contacts to other kids who ask for them, without asking permission of the person whose number it is.
One kid I know in Yr 7, known them for years, really lovely kid, has had a tirade of bullying messages from a kid at school they've never even had a conversation with. Really cruel messages. This kid, who received these messages, has radically changed from confident and outgoing to having anxiety and not wanting to go out. But because the messages were sent at night, the school say they can't get involved.

What is it your son likes about his current school? The kids sound horrible and the management sounds absolutely useless. Any phone incidents at my daughter's school (VERY few) have had the Head come down on the perpetrators very swiftly and effectively.

So the parents and Head at your school know who the kids are that are sending these messages yet nothing is being done by either school or parents? That's awful. I would change schools.

What makes your son want to continue at this horrible establishment?

He needs a phone to have a social life but maybe you keep it and only give it to him once you've read the messages for an hour after school each day? Something like that. Better than not being able to communicate with anyone at all.

Leftlegwest · 05/11/2023 04:27

LolleePopp · 04/11/2023 12:06

Oh no, he's not actually mute.
I mean he's quiet, but not wordless.
He's chatty with people he knows well.
He's shy with people he doesn't know well.

This sounds like a possible misunderstanding as to what SM is. I would suggest looking into it further as from your description of what he is like with his peers it does sound like SM.

HeffyAgain · 05/11/2023 06:59

LolleePopp · 04/11/2023 18:47

I'm really interested in scouts. To me it sounds great.
But DS says he has heard kids in Yr 7 saying "The dorks and misfits go to scouts".
Is this how scouts is seen??
Can someone educate me on scouts?

With kindness OP as I do understand that your son is having a tough time at the moment, does he know what the definition of a misfit is? Because at present he very much is one and if he wants to find his tribe it isn't going to be with the popular kids right now is it?
My son has been scouting since he was about 6, well before kids care about who is popular! He has loads of friends from there that he still keeps in touch with now even though he has left school.
Scouting in my area is so popular they have a year or more waiting list to join.....so we must have plenty of dorks and misfits to choose from.

LolleePopp · 05/11/2023 07:03

HeffyAgain · 05/11/2023 06:59

With kindness OP as I do understand that your son is having a tough time at the moment, does he know what the definition of a misfit is? Because at present he very much is one and if he wants to find his tribe it isn't going to be with the popular kids right now is it?
My son has been scouting since he was about 6, well before kids care about who is popular! He has loads of friends from there that he still keeps in touch with now even though he has left school.
Scouting in my area is so popular they have a year or more waiting list to join.....so we must have plenty of dorks and misfits to choose from.

He didn't even know what a dork or misfit is. He told me he heard a group of kids saying this, then asked me what those words mean. He isn't saying this, he's telling me he heard others saying it.
And you're right, he's not fitting in at all. He knows that.

OP posts:
TheGoogleMum · 05/11/2023 07:14

I think scouts is a good idea, he doesn't need to tell anyone at school he goes

HeffyAgain · 05/11/2023 08:00

LolleePopp · 05/11/2023 07:03

He didn't even know what a dork or misfit is. He told me he heard a group of kids saying this, then asked me what those words mean. He isn't saying this, he's telling me he heard others saying it.
And you're right, he's not fitting in at all. He knows that.

Sorry if I sounded harsh, I am overly protective of scouts because of the opportunities it has given my son over the years!!
There are plenty of kids that go that you can see probably don't fit in at school for various reasons and plenty that go because they have been there since they were little and school isn't a problem, they just enjoy scouts.
If he is worried about kids finding out he goes he could always join one a town or so away so he's less likely to bump into anyone he knows? Scouts are usually very accommodating especially if you explain the issues your son has been having.

Boomboom22 · 05/11/2023 08:04

How does an 11 or 12 year old not know what dork or misfit means? Are there wider issues going on with his social understanding and literacy level?

Quisto · 05/11/2023 08:11

The kids at scouts are quite a mix. They aren't the cruel, too cool for school kids. There was thread on MN last year asking if it was "quirky " kids who went, and there were lots of positive replies saying how good scouts had been for their ( possibly quirky ) children. My son's troop is all boys, the troop in the next village is 50/50 boys and girls. They all know each other and end up at the same Senior School. My son was quite surprised to discover a girl in his tutor group went to the neighbouring scout troop. He only found out when they did a joint scouting activity. One mum sent her boy in yr 6 as he was moving to a new area for Secondary, he made a few good friends from scouts that he now sees and interacts with at school.

hadrianswallsycamore · 05/11/2023 09:03

This poor kid doesn't know what a dork or misfit is and isn't fitting in. I understand your fears about phones. My youngest once had some horrible messages via Snapchat. I contacted the school and tracked parents down. I told them that as the children were under age I would report the parents to police if we received any further messages. Nothing more was received.
Please let you son have a chance at fitting in and get him a phone. If he doesn't have a way of contacting people, knowing the vernacular that kids use, know the cultural references they have etc he isn't going to be able to fit in. It's like in the 'old days' the kids that weren't allowed to watch tv/Grange Hill/eastenders etc missed out on the chat and couldn't mix as easily

Swipe left for the next trending thread