To be so frustrated with shy child?

[LolleePopp]

What do you do with shy 12 year old boys???
My 12 year old DS is sooooo shy with other kids.
He says he's desperate to make friends at his new secondary school.
But he's too shy to engage with anybody.
So he's not making any friends.
He really, really wants to be friends with people. He's not a loner who prefers his own company. He's a loner who looks at everyone around him and wants to make friends but doesn't know how to.
He started secondary school in September saying he was really looking forward to starting a new school and making new friends.
8 weeks in, he's made no friends at all.
There's 1 boy who he'd like to make friends with. So I've encouraged him to invite this boy to meet up outside of school. I helped him come up with ideas to suggest. I texted the boy's mum to try and help organise something. She said her DS would be up for meeting but that she is trying to encourage her DS to be independent so she said could they sort it out between them rather than us mums organising it. I explained this to DS and encouraged him to invite this boy to meet up. But he just will not invite him, even though he wants to meet up with him. After a few weeks of me trying hard to encourage him, last night he said "I'm not going to invite him out mum, I'm just too shy to ask him".
So that's that then.
Another new boy from new school invited him out for a bike ride with him and 3 others. My DS went, and came home 3 hours later full of smiles saying he'd had a great time. But since then, the mum of one of the boys has told me that the other kids all said my DS was really quiet and didn't talk at all or engage with the rest of the kids who were all chatting and joking whilst on their bikes. She said the other kids said my DS was too quiet. Yet my DS thought he had a brilliant time with them and asked them to let him know when theyre going again as hed like to join in, but meanwhile this other mum said the other kids probably won't invite him out next time because my DS was so quiet they thought he wasn't having fun with them. When in fact he told me he had really good fun, so I relayed this to the mum, but she said "Well they've met up a few times since then but didn't invite your DS because he was so quiet". DS has seen them out cycling round together without him and looked crestfallen.
There's another boy he likes, so I've texted that mum and she told me she leaves her DS to arrange his own social life now he's started secondary. So I've told my DS this and encouraged him to invite this boy over to ours or to meet up, but again, my DS won't invite him.
He's been going to an out of school club for 1 year and hasn't made a single friend there.
He hates competitive sports, so he will not join any football or rugby groups (much to my DH's frustration - DH is not sports mad but he insists a team sport would be good for DS's confidence, but DS refuses). He tried cricket but dropped out after 2 months. I've suggested judo at my DH's suggestion - flat no, he absolutely hated the look of it when I showed him kids of his age doing judo on YouTube.
In primary, he had 5 friends but the dynamics between them in year 6 were awful, constant fall outs and unpleasant behaviour on a non stop basis, a lot of horrible behaviour aimed at him (as well as at each other) so they've all fallen by the wayside now.
DS is a brilliant person. He talks loads at home, really makes us all laugh, has amazing insight into things (insight that is superior to his age), understands people really well, has very high levels of emotional intelligence - there are so many situations on this level that he just 'gets' and can talk eloquently about things on an emotional level that other mums tell me their kids of same age can't do or don't get at all, he has lots of interests (but none them transfer in to clubs). He gets on brilliantly with his sister, who is not shy at all.
It's really weird - when he was a little boy he wasn't shy at all. He ran around with a big bright happy open expression on his face, he was born with a "Hello world!" temperament. Then around the age of 10, shyness kicked in, and 2 years later it's much worse. He's getting more shy as he gets older.
I can see that this comes across really badly to other kids.
We were out at an event the other evening, and throughout the event, several boys in his school year that know him smiled and said Hi to him on individual occasions (not a group of boys, but 1 boy, then 10 mins later another boy, etc.) and DS didn't smile back at any of them. He did reply to each of them with a hello, but he came across as so stand offish. I talked to him the next day about how he came across to them, but he just said "I'm so shy mum, I freeze and clam up when they speak to me, I hate it but I don't know what to do because I can't help it".
I've encouraged him to join clubs at school but he won't because he doesn't know anyone. Obviously I've explained that no-one knows anyone at first, but you go and then you get to know people. But he will not go.
I'm at the point where I despair.
I can see him spending 5 years at school not making any friends.
If he didn't care about friends and was happy in his own little world then I'd think fine, that's just how he is. But he tells me he really, really wants to make friends.
I've talked to his school about it and asked for their support, and they said he needs to join school clubs. That was their only solution and 3 different staff members have all said the same thing. But he won't go to these clubs.
So what do I do?!?

Sounds really similar to my daughter. I suspected she had ASD. An assessment showed she has mild ASD. It’s mainly social environments, like your sone once she’s comfortable with people she can literally hold court, engage and have fun. It’s really peers she struggles with. It might be worth organising an assessment to rule it out …

Encourage him to join a drama group , great fun and builds confidence.

I can’t comment on ND but I’m diagnosed with GAD ( I don’t think I’m ND, just very anxious) and social anxiety is very inhibiting. It definitely manifests as being too anxious to talk to peers and makes it harder to form friendships.

The good news is that anxiety can be successfully managed and the sooner it’s addressed, the easier life becomes, IME. Wishing you and your DS all the best, OP. 💐

I completely understand your reluctance to get him a phone (and the finance issues that are associated), but having access to a phone would massively help with the asking potential friends to hang out / do things on a 121 basis. So you have at least two options I can see, you could buy him a super cheap phone and a £10 a month sim with included texts and minutes OR (and this may be your better option for monitoring bullying texts), you could let him contact a few potential friends on your phone - set him up with WhatsApp under his own name but on your phone and then you can vet messages that come in but it gives him an easy way to make contact with boys that he thinks he might want to do something with.

I have a 12 year old too (in year 8 as he is summer born) and he is very quiet in big groups but is chatty in small groups or 121 and he isn’t actually shy at all - he has a lot of confidence in himself and who he is but he is just a very quiet individual and is an introvert. Funnily enough he is super popular at his small private school as he’s not a big personality so he is very easy to get on with, and it sounds like your son is similar. I bet once he finds his people he will be fine and will make really good friends, it’s just a case of finding them. I would advocate doing something out of school to make other friends too, my children are all very sporty so they do sports clubs, but scouts, music, chess, art etc are all other options. I always think that then if they do have a falling out at school, they can draw comfort from their out of school friends until things are back on an even keel at school.

I’d ask the gp or school to refer him to the children’s primary mental health team for support around anxiety and possibly social anxiety specifically. There’s funding in a or of nhs trusts for CBT sessions from an educational mental health practitioner. This is for specifically low level types of anxiety and to try and prevent escalation to higher levels leading to crisis. If left untreated this could get worse. School haven’t been very helpful in suggesting clubs. Pastoral team should be able to facilitate some small group work for students who have similar issues and to help them learn to socialise more easily. Ask to speak with head of pastoral or sendco

Hi Op, your post was originally about shyness, but actually what you have outlined is not so much about your son’s personality but a bigger situation around toxic behaviours at school. It doesn’t sound like he is shy so much as in survival mode.

Your son has experienced bullying historically which will likely impair his ability to connect with new friends. The incidents you describe with Ben/Chloe would make any child doubt themselves — this is different to being shy or introvert. It also sounds like the school is struggling as an institution to control bullying and bahaviour going downhill with no pastoral support staff at present. Children who have been bullied, or who have not yet found the security of a new group, are vulnerable.

I completely see why you want to avoid him being on social media, but you are cutting him off from the nice kids as well as the horrible ones by preventing him having a phone. It’s very simple — kids communicate by phone, that is how the majority of interaction happens. He cannot join in. I genuinely think that a phone will help him — but tell your son you’ll be keeping tabs on his use. Set up all the parental controls and make spot checks with and without telling him (I do with my son and I tell him to remember the phone is actually mine on loan to him!) Talk to him about what is ok to send and receive via phone — as a rule of thumb, I tell my son that if he isn’t happy for his form tutor to read a message/meme then he shouldn’t press ‘send’. Likewise with what he receives.

Re the suicide instructions exchanged on WhatsApp between year 7s, this is a serious safeguarding matter and, without delay, needs referring to the School Safeguarding lead and to the governors. There will be a safeguarding Governor, the details it will be on the school website. Screen shot the messages and include them with your email. It’s the kind of thing that it’s tempting to assume will be fine and feel like you are interfering — but unless the school is informed they will not know this is happening and can’t address it. Pastoral team or not — it will have to be addressed by the senior leadership team. If someone has already reported it, that’s well and good, but it’s always better to have more reports than to have this going on with everyone assuming somebody else is escalating it.

Scouts is a good call. Anything he might enjoy which increases his social circle is good. And if your son finds likeminded, nice kids amongst so called ‘dorks’ or ‘misfits’ then who cares what the horrible crowd call them? It’s actually quite cool to be a nerd, it has kudos of its own for teens, especially when nerds are in numbers. I would encourage your child to think past these labels anyway as they are mostly imposed by the very children he doesn’t like, doesn’t trust and whose behaviour does not suggest they are a very good judge of character.

I do hope things improve for him. It sounds like he is a great kid and that he knows his own mind if he is keen to remain at this school and not be deterred by primary school bullies however vile they may have been. Remember that he only needs to find one person he can get alongside so I would just continue to reassure & encourage him of his worth, get him that phone so he can keep in contact with the people he does like. If he can go to scouts etc with a different ‘pool’ of kids — this will be an escape from the school dynamic.

X

Oh bless him. Can he try clubs outside of school as well - the fear of rejection may be less, for most people but especially someone with an experience of being bullied/treated not so nicely at school.

I'd ease up on the sports focus as well. My parents also believed a lot in team sports for development, so I worked hard to excel at sports. But it went against my nature and tbh I never had that camaraderie with my teammates (though of course we went out together, had fun, group hugs etc). In uni, I explored other clubs, and found people and activities I reall "clicked" with. Those used my natural talents too so were great sources of confidence and genuine self development for me.

Looking back that's what a lot of my friends had in primary and secondary school, while growing up, so it's a pity I didn't sort of have permission to be more "myself", even in clubs deemed a bit losery etc.

On the phone, I don't have a solution but most kids at that age text to arrange hanging out. It's not really like primary school anymore where you can go up to someone at the playground and ask if they want to go play at yours.

I’d see about a therapist for your son, he needs help to combat this. It hurt my heart to see you say he’s stand off ish, this is basically what I’ve heard my entire life starting around that age from my own mum too. And it hurt me everytime.
I sought therapy for different things when I was an adult and I have managed to overcome it to a degree as in I have lots of friends and I’m very quick to talk to people. I do still get called stand off ish a lot. For me, I’ve realised it isn’t shyness, just an awkwardness that I don’t know how to behave. I don’t understand how to behave when people are being friendly, when I’m being given gifts, when meeting new people. It’s very very hard. I’m not shy. I’m actually quite extoverted. But I am just very very awkward. And I have to really work hard against it.
my heart hurts for your son xx

I typed my comment about wishing I had "permission" to join an "uncool" club, before I saw the "scouts is for dorks and misfits" post! Please encourage him to go with his natural talents and inclinations (it may take a while to find it), it can be a great source of belonging and confidence. Maybe look for outside school activities if the school club doesn't go well too.

If he has lots of interesting insights as you say, and likes to express himself, maybe an activity/club where he's "allowed" to do it may help? Something like broadcast or writing?

I'm sorry if I've missed it mentioned but I'd really really recommend reading
'Quiet: The Power of Introverts in a World That Can't Stop Talking' by Susan Cain. It a something I read in bits with my dd to help her see that being quiet was okay and I think helped her to stop seeing herself as 'shy'.

I actually welled up reading your op as my daughter was exactly like this, desperate to make friends but would clam up/ look at the ground etc when somebody tried to befriend her, I remember her sobbing to me on her twelfth birthday about it. She's fourteen now and whilst still shy with some people (I suspect she always will be) she's now got a really lovely group of friends (after a few rough starts with unkind kids) she sounds very similar in that she was always very happy when she's was younger but got 'burnt' by some of her friends turning on her.

We were very lucky in that the staff in her school were incredibly understanding and one teacher in particular (who recommended the above book) made some really lovely points about her not having to talk if she didn't want to (comparing it to consent at being touched etc) and encouraged us to work on her confidence and self value and letting making friends take a back seat to that, it was frustrating and there were so many times I tried and failed to encourage her to take a chance and then eventually she agreed to go to a non compulsory school event and managed to find the courage to join in.

There will be other children who have similar traits even if not as obvious. The other thing I found really helped was being direct with other parents about how hard she found it, some look at you like you have two heads but occasionally somebody will get it and make a bit more effort/ encourage their kids to make an effort. I found one mum who had herself been shy as a child and even though our daughters never got very close it meant dd was invited to things occasionally even if she wasn't brave enough to go and that really helped her.

I'm not sure if any of this is helpful or makes sense (one handed typing with my youngest sleeping on me!) but I just wanted to say I get it! It's so frustrating and heartbreaking.. but there is hope.

My DGS WAS diagnosed with autism at the end of primary school. His principle struggle is social skills. He plays football and it takes him a while to gel with a new team. You can’t get frustrated with him. Just encourage him but you also can’t force him to be sociable. Have you had a chat with his school?

I think your son would benefit from a therapist. I think you’re correct to hesitate to get him a phone. Perhaps an Apple Watch would work better if he must have a way to communicate.

I do this with my DD, it’s really allowed her to find her voice and become more confident.

Is it possible he was traumatised by what happened with his last group of friends? If he was sociable before and not now. Or could he (as someone else suggested) have ASD which has gone undetected until now. Some of the behaviours you describe like not responding to other social cues would support this, like not picking up on how quiet he appeared around the other boys when out cycling.
Im really sorry he’s going through this I was shy at primary school. Just making him feel totally accepted at home will give him a safe base to come back to. He’s obviously confiding in you which is very positive.

Op I think initial reply would've been he needs to see a qualified counsellor to work through what the bullying did to him in terms of shredding his confidence to pieces , he still obviously scarred by it all and subconsciously it will be why he's holding back out of fear of it happening again but he won't know it or just to hesitant to admit it, as itl be like admitting they won somehow. However given that these 3 bullies/abusers are still at his school then flip it around and think how would it be of that was an adult seeing their abuser everyday at work in close contact etc. It would tear that adult apart and mentally mess them up,so your young ds needs you to step in and remove him from this situation altogether as clearly its too much for him to handle yet. At this point maybe understand why he doesn't want to move schools and see of another school can fit that criteria. Or it'll be the long road of building him up bit by bit and hoping he gets over the past with professional help.

I am sorry this is hard for you.
As a shy child myself I really feel for him. As some posts have said - The ‘label’ of shy made me far far worse. Although I had friends and was not shy with them, I found school hard. Talking sometimes made me really anxious.. worried about saying something particularly interesting and really over analysing everything. With some people I would sit in silence.

Emotionally he sounds like I was, emotionally intelligent. Perhaps the bullying has really set him back and worried about what people think of him. Could some CBT help him?

Being so sensitive as a child can mean you really worry what people think of you. I think if the people around you all see you as ‘shy’ this starts to be how you see yourself and it’s hard to change this.

As an adult I chose a job where I worked with people and now have completely overcome this.

I would get him assessed for autism and adhd. If he has neither then some counselling might help.
I grew up in the 80's, had a terrible relationship with my mum, was bullied by teachers and repeatedly sent for hearing tests because I was 'shy'. Turns out I have high functioning autism. Unfortunately I didn't find this out until I was in my 30's, life has been a struggle!

Your poor son being with his bullys

Moving school may help

My first thought was he needs a phone so can text people to meet up

Yes bullying online can be awful but check his phone often and if uou see anything then contact school/police

I hear good things about scouts and they go out and meet up etx

Agree qbour clubs - music - drama - reading - chess - Lego etx

Summer clubs in holidays any activities he likes so can meet people

Boy I knew was painfully shy. Parents got him into martial arts. Transformed him. Maybe worth a try?

You just described my situation with my 13 year old to a T. It is heartbreaking to watch.

He’s in secondary and doesn’t have a phone - he’s going to be socially isolated as all communication is via social media. You aren’t helping him you are socially isolating him.

Could he try a martial arts class? Judo, kickboxing, karate? They’re not competitive but can be great for boosting his self esteem.

I think some CBT or a few sessions with a licensed psychologist would help him enormously. Sounds like he is a little ‘stuck’ and may not have fully processed the bullying he encountered at such a formative age.

You sound like a great Mum and the other Mums have given you constructive feedback so it’s apparent that he has some anxiety around making new friends and having the confidence to do so.

This is a easily remedied and with a little bit of professional help he should be able to flourish.

The best thing he can do is join a drama group. We have seen children change so much in a few months to being confident and joining in.

As a child I was called 'shy' and really struggled right upto my 20's, I assumed that was just my personality. It was only when I read about social anxiety that I realised, I wasn't shy, I actually had anxiety. It's only when I addressed this that I started to get better, I wish I had known about it sooner. I see in your posts you have mentioned anxiety, please get your son mental health help. Start with looking up tips and techniques he can try to practice. Speak to your GP, he may be able to do some online CBT courses.