To ask ds to leave home after this?

[wrappedalready]

I have 3 boys d.s.1 who is 23 and has moved out in the past but is back home at the moment.
I also have ds2 who is 8 and ds1 who is 6 but ds1 is a bully to the youngest, he allows middle son into his room to play PlayStation and listen to music but won't let the youngest in so he's left crying outside his room.
He is visibly irritated by youngest son for acting like any 6 year old child yet takes the 8 year old out buys him things and younger son is left in tears.
I have called him out and he says he doesn't mind ds2 but not ds1.
The youngest boys get on great when it's just them but when my adult ds is home he singles one out and then we have to deal with tears and tantrums.
I'm thinking about asking him to leave if he won't treat them the same,it really doesn't seem fair that he's bullied by his big brother in his own home at 6.

I think youre lucky ds2 spends time with any of them at that age. He obviously finds ds3 annoying and hard work as hes only 6! Maybe in a few years he will spend more time with him? Its not ds1 jobs to have 2 kids in his room constantly. If him and ds2 are spending time together then YOU play with ds3. How would you handle this if ds1 was 14/15? You cant just kick one child out! Inbelievable

What is ds3 actually doing when ds1 asks him to leave? Because if he's touching things he shouldn't/ has been asked not to, or spoiling the game for others (standing in front of the screen repeatedly, pressing buttons, singing when they're trying to concentrate, stuff like that), then it's natural consequences though ds1 can be diplomatic in how he communicates around that.

Some of the replies on this thread are disgusting.

If someone posted that their MIL was spending loads of time with one of their small children and deliberately and cruelly excluding the other, there would be choruses of “abuse!” “Go NC!” and “you’re allowing her to damage your DC!”

But because it’s a young adult male, it’s being totally excused and dismissed.

So much internalised misogyny on this thread.

Interesting dynamic. (S = son.)

S1 basically ganging up with S2.
Presumably S2 and S3 are full brothers.
Perhaps S1 feels a like there’s an (biological) Imbalance here that he’s trying to balance by getting closer to S2? By making S3 feel like the left out one?

And now mum is thinking of chucking out S1.

Has S1 felt a bit ostracised/left out in general since new dad came on the scene?
Does S1 feel like a fully accepted member of this new family?
Did he feel left out 10 (or whenever) years ago that the new dad came on the scene, and since new brothers have arrived?

At 23 S1 is still not fully neurologically mature. He still has some brain development to come! This may all be subsurface stuff.

OP decide what you want your family to look like and work back. Ie you want them all to get on. At the moment they don’t. Chucking out S1 isn’t great. Letting S3 suffer isn’t great. The only solution I can see is you and your husband spend more time with all the boys separately. There’s a book about love bombing by Oliver james which can help mend broken relationships with kids.

But the eldest has a Golden Child of his own there - the 8 year old.

OP this is the one post with advice that’s actually helpful.
Your 23 year old needs to step up and take responsibility for his role in family dynamics and future relationships with the children in the household. It’s fine that he enjoys his 8yr old brother’s company in small doses but not really the 6 year old. But the adult thing to do here is exactly what Wesel’s eldest has done - find a way to spend some time with his youngest brother. It doesn’t matter if it’s a chore rather than a pleasure. That couple of hours building lego or doing homework reading or whatever with the youngest is a long term investment in healthy family dynamics. And yes it’s partially or even mostly for the good of the relationship between the two youngest brothers. And if he can’t do that then yes, he needs to look at moving out so he isn’t part of the daily family interactions and his preference for his 8yr old brother doesn’t cause major long term issues, just perhaps the occasional holiday tantrum.

My DD (and us) splits her two 8 and 6, so the 8 year old gets to do age appropriate stuff. Sometimes we take the 6 year old to soft play without the other because the eldest doesn't like it anymore. So occasionally wouldn't be so bad, it's the fact that it is constant. I'd say both occasionally, or none. Then you tell the 6 year old that when he's bigger he gets to join in more.

Have you asked your oldest why he finds the younger one annoying?
I'd say if your going to live here we need to compromise because whilst it's ok not to went to be round everyone all the time it's not ok to exclude the youngest and treat him badly for no reason.

I wouldn't throw DS1 out over this but I would be having some stern words about his actions and the impact because bullying like that would not be tolerated. If he couldn't pay attention to that then I would consider it more seriously but it would be a last resort. I wouldn't want to throw any of my children out and I think it would have to be much more serious than this, which I think could be sorted with some communication.

How does your 6 year old behave when in DS1's room? Does he fiddle about with everything and make a huge mess? Does he misuse things like phones, tablets etc? Or does DS1 just relate better to DS2, in which case he still needs to moderate his behaviour towards DS3.

There must be a middle way somewhere. It's a conversation you should have with DS1. There must be a reason for this even if it is that DS3 is just slightly too young for them at the moment.

It might be that you have to do something yourself with DS3 more often.

Why isn't the 23 year old who works full time and pays board allowed to say who and who isn't allowed in his personal space.
The OP has admitted she hasn't asked why the 6 year old suddenly isn't allowed in the bedroom and why he's stopped taking the 6 year old anywhere, maybe before packing his bags she needs to find out why he's started throwing him out. I think she'll probably find he was misbehaving!

It’s really horrible behaviour from anyone. There’s no way I’d stomach a 23yo being unpleasant to a 6yo. Tell him straight that he should be ashamed of himself.

He needs to get his own place and stop living with mummy. If he doesn't like he can leave. The op pays the bills in the house why should she look at it objectively. Would you allow your adult child take the piss?

Op should tell him my house my rules don't like it you know where the door is. The op isn't obliged to continue spoon feeding her 23 year old man child.

I’m really not bothered if im going to be popular or not here.
yes. It’s bullying. Your DS1 is 23. 23!!!!!!! He isn’t 13. My DP became a father at 25 for goodness sake.
the thought of a poor little 6 year old being ganged up on and a 23 year old older sibling encouraging it really makes me sad. In his own home as well. If you can’t feel comfortable and loved in your own home then where can you!!!!

No, DS1 should not be a baby sitter, I do agree there, but equally, he should not be a bully so a 6 year old is crying.

id tell him if he can’t be nice he has to leave. The 6 year old is a CHILD.

He might not work at all or pay house keeping regardless if he is or isn't he is sharing a house it isn't right for a 23 year old to pick on his 6 year old brother. He should be big enough to talk to his mother if he is misbehaving rather than shut him out.

Your ds1 is an adult who bullies a 6 yo?! Genuinely concerning! I'd send ds1 to therapy so he figures his shit out and I'll tell him to live elsewhere. The priority is to protect the mental wellbeing of your 6 year old, who is such a young child, and preserve the relationship with your ds2. Also, what kind of example is ds1 showing to your 8 yo? That's its OK to trest others this way! Sounds really horrible, sorry but ds1 has no place in your home rn.

She's said he works full time and pays board. She's said he spends time do other things with the 6 year old, but the 6 year old wants to do everything the 8 year old does.
The 6 year old needs to learn boundaries and that he can't always do what his 8 year old brother does.
He's not picking on him he's choosing to do different things with each brother - which is a perfectly fine thing to do!
Plus he's not the 6 year olds Dad his mum should be the one asking what is happening, but after the instant "should I throw him out" and "my 6 year old isn't annoying he's charming" comments I suspect that the 23 year old instantly gets accused of bullying the 6 year old before he even gets a chance to explain.

Choosing to do different activities with different siblings isn't bullying.
How is choosing to do an age appropriate activity with the 8 year old that isn't appropriate for the 6 year old to do going to affect the 6 year olds mental health?
He's 23 he works full time and pays rent he should absolutely be allowed to decide who is allowed in his personal space.
He's told his mum that he's annoying when he's in the room with both his brothers. His mum needs to teach the 6 year old that is a privilege to be allowed in other people's rooms not a right and if he behaves appropriately then he might be allowed back in.

Warped behaviour from a 23 year old tbh

Your 23 year old son should have enough maturity, to not leave your 6 year old in tears. It’s the low kindness level that seems disappointingly questionable, to me. Doesn’t he feel sorry the baby brother? Surely there is a more tactful way to deal with a very young child and he should know that, as an adult.

why do you want an 8 year old and 6 year old to be invited into the room of an adult anyway, to play video games. I would not let children this young play video games. I understand that the point is that one child is being excluded, but neither should be playing video games. You’re the parent. I can see that a 6 year old wouldn’t necessarily have the maturity or comprehension of rules, to be able to play such games effectively, which is why your adult son doesn’t want him around. So how does asking your adult son being asked to leave, solve anything.

is what you’re saying, ‘let your 6 year old bother play video games with you, or leave the family home’, what you are trying to say? Hmmm.

asking the 23 year old to leave is going to alienate him.

tell your adult son, that his brothers are very young people who have feelings and deserve to be treated with respect. That’s the rule in your home. Tell him that you require everyone in your home to operate with respect for all, in your household and it’s non negotiable.

She didn't post that he works full time she said he has come back home I checked before I quoted you. You're justifying foolishness he needs to grow up and treat his siblings accordingly and not his play toys. Let the children play amongst themselves and he needs to get a grip and sort himself out. There is a reason why he is single you don't read about a girlfriend or mates I wonder if it's because he enjoys playing children's games with children?

She replied on Facebook which is where I found this thread that he does other stuff with the 6 year old he just doesn't want him in his room and that he's taken the 6 and 8 year old out a few times but said he can't handle the 6 year olds tantrums, and that he indeed works full time and pays board!
He's 23; he's the 6 year olds sibling not his dad is not up to him to deal with tantrums! At 6 he shouldn't be having full blown tantrums at the word no!

He can leave if he wants then he can have his own space. I moved out at 19 had a baby at 20 I didn't move back in with mummy and daddy I sorted myself out quickly. I don't feel sorry for him he has the world at his feet and he would rather play video games with his 8 year old brother. Don't he want to challenge himself to get more or is his mother's apron more comforting.

I did exactly that because I had to advocate for my two younger sons who were about the same age as your two, #1 son was 13 years older than the middle son. He didn't get on with the younger twos Dad and it was making home life miserable.

She's not spoon feeding him. He also does work and pay board.

If she were to just ask why the 6 year old suddenly seemed to begin being excluded she could well find that there is a reason she hadn't been aware of, such as bad behaviour and messing things up once in the room.