To ask ds to leave home after this?

[wrappedalready]

I have 3 boys d.s.1 who is 23 and has moved out in the past but is back home at the moment.
I also have ds2 who is 8 and ds1 who is 6 but ds1 is a bully to the youngest, he allows middle son into his room to play PlayStation and listen to music but won't let the youngest in so he's left crying outside his room.
He is visibly irritated by youngest son for acting like any 6 year old child yet takes the 8 year old out buys him things and younger son is left in tears.
I have called him out and he says he doesn't mind ds2 but not ds1.
The youngest boys get on great when it's just them but when my adult ds is home he singles one out and then we have to deal with tears and tantrums.
I'm thinking about asking him to leave if he won't treat them the same,it really doesn't seem fair that he's bullied by his big brother in his own home at 6.

Dc3 is being unreasonable if he thinks it's ok to go in dc1s room and fiddle with his stuff. He can understand that at 6.

Dc1 is being unreasonable if he is winding up dc3 when dc3 is not causing trouble

Dc1 and dc2 should not be playing video games for long patches as it's not good for either of them.

You may have to step up for dc3 for a couple of years until he is mature enough for gaming ( or longer if he takes longer to mature) so he has other things to do. Can he have a friend round?

If dc1 is still living at home that will help him save for a deposit but he needs to recognise that subsidised housing comes with requirements to be supportive to the household. Make sure he does household tasks to be a role model to his brothers.

Tell him he either treats them equally or he moves out.

Equally may mean no longer letting the 8 year old in his room either. Are you willing to accept that?

OP isn't expecting the adult child to entertain them. She's expecting him not to pick and choose in favour of one all the time, and take action that he knows will distress the other. If an adult can't understand that that's not acceptable, then he's really immature.

Suppose, say, your brother came to stay with you and repeatedly chose to play with one of your children and shut out the other who is left crying and distressed, would you really think was acceptable? Would you not be saying to him something to the effect of "Look, I don't mind if you don't want to entertain the children, but if you do, you have to be fair about it and not just favour DC1"?

My dsis has three girls eldest couldn’t stand the middle one but could the youngest .
It life .
You can’t force relationships
so what your saying is the two youngest have to have a relationship but the eldest abs middle can’t .
sometimes people just gel .
Why can’t you spend time with your youngest it’s not the eldest job.
He’s not childcare and middle son clearly likes his elder brother and doesn’t mind him hanging out.
I wouldn’t throw my child out .
Id tell my youngest he can’t always get what he wants though.

so what your saying is the two youngest have to have a relationship but the eldest abs middle can’t .

No-one with basic reading comprehension could get that out of OP's posts. She's just saying that the oldest, an adult, can't bully and exclude the youngest. Why is that unreasonable? Would you tolerate an adult bullying your child in your house?

YABU

Your oldest is 23, you can’t expect him to want to be around a 6 year old all the time. You can’t expect him to either entertain all of his siblings or none of his siblings- what a stupid ultimatum! It’s okay for him to spend one on one time with his brother. He doesn’t need to spend time with both of them together every time.

You need to teach your youngest son that it’s okay for him to not be invited to every little thing - how’s he going to react when people at school don’t invite him to every party? It’s not possible for someone to be included in absolutely everything so he needs to build resilience to it and not start crying outside doors. You’re ridiculous for letting that happen btw - you should move your youngest somewhere else and play with him yourself.

ultimately your oldest does find your youngest annoying. In time they can build a good relationship but you need to stop trying to force it. As long as your oldest isn’t being abusive, I don’t see the issue with your oldest not wanting the youngest in his room.

This. It's your house, your rules. And at 23 it's not unreasonable that he be asked to move out if he's behaving in a way you don't like. Younger kids are annoying, and it's not surprising he'd find the youngest brother irritating at times, but the eldest sounds to me as though he's quite enjoying the 'divide and rule' bit, which is an unpleasant trait. He sounds very immature.

Blimey, I am shocked by some of these comments! A 23 year old absolutely should be kind to both of his brothers. Excluding one is a type of bullying. Also, why shouldn't a 23 year old, living at home for free, not help his parents by babysitting his considerably younger siblings from time to time.

Families should be there to support and help each other. Now, I'm not saying that he should be forced to look after his two younger siblings all the time. I highly doubt that is routinely happening and I highly doubt that the OP is foisting her 6 year old on him and neglecting to look after him herself, as people have suggested.

But he is a 23 year old grown man who needs to exhibit greater tolerance and fairness. He needs to grow up and stop acting like a child himself.

Kick him out if you want. However, your oldest son doesn’t have to like both the youngest kids the same 🤷‍♀️ It’s not a very good life lesson for the younger one E.g. if he cries and screams enough then he gets his own way.

@halloweenn

'He doesn’t need to spend time with both of them together every time'.

But is he also spending any time alone with the 6 year old? It really doesn't sound like it. That is the point.

How is the oldest sibling, by not wanting the youngest sibling in his room, bullying him? By saying this is “bullying” really diminishes and cheapens the word and the actual bullying people go through. Age is not relevant here - if the youngest takes over the game or messes around in the room or is a really dominating presence that spoils the moment, it’s normal for siblings to not want to spend all their free time together. Any age would find that annoying. Ultimately you can’t dictate how people spend their free time or how siblings socialise, forcing a relationship won’t help the situation. Neither will banning the oldest sibling from interacting with middle child.

@Passepartoute its not the uncle is it though, not the OP’s brother. It’s not someone coming into your house is it? Completely different scenario. It’s the eldest home, and within their home it’s their own bedroom we are talking about.

However looking at you scenario my sister will often come and do something with my eldest and not my youngest, as my eldest enjoys and can do stuff that her teenage/young adult children want to do.

OP explained he finds the 6 year old sibling irritating, so why does the oldest need to spend time alone with a small child that frustrates him? When the 6 year old matures, he might find him more tolerable and they can naturally spend more time together. He’s fine with how the 8 year old acts. We have all been on the receiving end of annoying, loud, boisterous, obnoxious, whiny, dramatic children. It’s not hard to imagine why a 23 year old isn’t endeared to that.

If was OP, I would gently ease them into spending time together by family activities like cooking together, eating together, watching shows together - as in everyone in the household not the oldest being forced to entertain the 6 year old. Spending time together in group settings will naturally pave the way to spending time together one on one.

So many people are missing the fact that there is a 6 year old feeling extremely left out constantly to the point of tears.
Playing with mum or having a friend over won't make up for the fact that he will still have these feelings because he's still being left out. It's not just being allowed in the room it's the fact the eldest takes the 8year old out shopping too. It's so very damaging for the 6 year old and regardless of how the eldest finds the 6 year old, it's not acceptable to be rubbing this in his face.

It needs to be addressed and sorted asap. I'm not saying he should have the youngest in the room with him but some sort of compromise like gaming downstairs together maybe? If he won't budge then the amount of time he spends with the 8year old needs to be cut down so this allows the younger 2 time together.

Whilst we don't have to like everyone in life, the youngest is 6, a child. Not another adult or even a teen close in age to the eldest. How he presents (likely a typical 6 year old) has no bearing on how he will in a couple of years but by then the damage will be irreversible. The eldest may be seeing him as annoying, but 6 year olds can be, this doesn't mean you treat them harshly for just acting their age.

Irrelevant if he finds him annoying, his 23, an adult. He needs to learn to be patient and kind to his SIX year old brother. Poor kid it would piss me off.

Yes, instead of addressing it, throw the eldest out. 🤨

My son is 17 and it’s rare he’ll allow his 12 year old brother and 8 year old sister in his bedroom, occasionally they’ll go in together, DS might watch him gaming and DD sits on his bed and strokes the cat, he’ll sometimes give them both a lolly or biscuit from his draw and then ask them both to come out of his room. He’s never excluded any of them, it does feel unfair your son does this but I don’t think threatening him to leave is the answer, maybe a chat about how his brother is feeling would be the answer and how it’s unfair to exclude people, even family members.

@Fraggeek you are placing undue emphasis on “left out”. Not being invited to everything or included in everything is a normal part of life, it’s something children should be taught how to deal with and process in a healthy manner:

People can’t get everything they want all the time. The parent shouldn’t force the other party into social situations to prevent the child from being upset, because you won’t be able to do that with every situation in the future - and your child will not be equipped to handle that when it arises. Just because someone is crying, it doesn’t make the other party unreasonable. Children blow things out of proportion as they can’t regulate their emotions, it doesn’t mean the other person has done something egregious or that the child needs to be pandered to.

If the six year old is annoying at home, what makes you think he isn’t annoying at the shops? Little kids want to touch and buy things that pique their interest and get upset if you say no. I don’t think the sibling needs to put himself in the position of parent or childminder and regulate that if he’s not comfortable doing so. That’s not going to improve their relationship.

THIS.
An irritating 6 year old is vastly different to a more sensible 8 year old.
Those are huge age gaps, it's lucky that the oldest one at least amuses the 8 yr old.

I'd be giving notice to the 23 year old to move out promptly.

He is bullying his youngest sibling.

He's teaching your other child it's okay to bully his youngest sibling.

He's teaching your youngest sibling to cater to a bully, his brother who gleefully runs hot and cold with him at the bequest of his adult sibling who should know better.

At 23 he is a full grown adult. He can clearly see that his behaviour is upsetting one of the children- yet he continues to do so.
You either stop him paying the 8 yr old so much attention as I’m not allowing him to go out with him etc or ask him to leave.

Give him notice to move out. Tell him it's clear he's causing trouble between the children and you are not willing to allow it anymore

What a cunty post, on so many levels

Once again, a thread that brings the MN child-haters out in full force. Some people should be banned from having kids because they clearly resent them for being children. I mean, you give birth, you get a child ffs 🤷‍♂️ 🙄

Jesus Christ, how dramatic. No one hates children if they acknowledge it’s on the parent to raise their children, not the oldest sibling. No one else needs to endure the annoying parts of raising children aside from the parent - it’s their lifestyle choice after all. People will tolerate the cons of having their own children but they don’t need to tolerate the cons of other’s children all the time - that doesn’t mean they’re resentful of children.