For not wanting to give daughter cultural name

[Sia2822]

Hello
I am irish living in the UK (my parents are both Irish and we moved here when I was 2) My partner is Tongan in the pacific islands born in New Zealand in to the Māori culture.

Our first child (a son) was named a Māori name as he wanted and we went through all the names and compromised on one.

I really want to call our daughter Orla which is an Irish name, I don’t just want to call her Orla because it’s an Irish name, I want to use it because I’ve always loved that name and said I’d call future child it. If he doesn’t like that name (which he says he doesn’t) then I have 20 or so other options I like but he just says he doesn’t like them all. He doesn’t even think after I say the name, it’s just an instant no. I’ve asked him to find some baby girl names he likes and he made a list but they’re all Māori names and to be honest I don’t like them. He’s asked me to find a Māori girls name that I do like and although I’m sure there is a few I will like, I want to choose a name I truly want this time not be restricted to a certain culture of names.

Ive told partner that baby may be half tongan but she is also half Irish so it shouldn’t matter if she’s named a Māori name or not, his response to that was Ireland and England have “no culture”. I’ve suggested a Māori name as a middle name but he’s having none of it. Says baby needs a Māori name and that if she has an Irish or English name his family will feel hugely disrespected and that it’s important baby holds her culture in her name.

AIBU for not wanting to choose a cultural name this time?

Does your husband follow rugby by any chance? Would he have heard of the Irish rugby player Bundee Aki? Bundee has 4 kids and they have a mix of Irish and NZ names.

Did you win the circumcision debate OP?
doing this when a child is 7+ seems cruel to me. They will remember exactly what happened and who did it to them.

@Sia2822 He sounds awful-I take back anything supportive I said. My Tongan relative is nothing like this-please don't let him tell you this is how all Tongans behave.

Poor children, they will always feel culturally conflicted. I speak from personal experience.

Just say 'when I hear the word 'culture', I reach for my shillelagh'.

I cannot help thinking that there are two meanings of the word 'culture' that are dishonestly conflated by the husband (or maybe he does not know any better?).

1. The culture of a society - its ways, rituals, beliefs, and so on.
2. Culture - appreciation of things like opera, art, literature, learning, etc.

Ireland has both, in abundance, and he sounds like the worst kind of dick to tell you otherwise, so much so that I believe you should get rid of him.

My children are from a mixed heritage background they have English first names and their dads culture middle names. Your husband needs to take a step back and listen to your point of view not just a straight no. You aren’t married you can register your daughter’s birth yourself. Also what on earth does he mean when he says Irish and English have no culture? Cheeky bugger.

Actually the first one there, drop the leading N at the start and you have the Irish word for laughter - Gaire (pronounced goy-ra).
That could be something to consider.

If anyone wanted to chop off part of my little boy's willy, they'd have to step over my dead body first.

Unfortunately I'm not surprised by his comment about "no culture" - having grown up in Australia with one English parent I had that the whole time, the English have no culture, nothing of value, passed on nothing positive to Australia ... (only a legal system, language, basic moral structure, etc etc - and few Australians understand how much the English sing) When lots of appropriate effort is put into visibly maintaining cultural traditions, other traditions become invisible. If you are going to stay with your partner, it is absolutely vital that he is given a crash course in Irish and English culture (and then his education continued!) and you make it clear that your children need to understand and value both sides of their heritage. Insist you need to learn more about Maori culture yourself as much as he needs to learn about Irish and English ways, and he will have nothing to complain about. (even though, arguably, he clearly has an awful lot to learn if he is going to remain in the UK)

How you start sorting that out may influence how your naming difficulties get solved. Very best wishes.

Tell him to find one of his own. He’s disrespectful and plainly awful.

I am genuinely concerned about your partners plans for your son op.
Names aside the issue of delayed circumcision would be non negotiable and if you feel the same please make sure you take steps to ensure this will not happen.
Unfortunately from your posts this relationship and mutual respect within it seems untenable.

@JustAMinutePleass

interesting! I’d say shame that your family want to get to know these kids but they have Irish names? So freaking what? They have darker skins so that’s a marker for Indian acceptance? Can’t Irish people have dark skins?

im quite old and until this day still a tad rejected as not being Indian looking enough or not having an Indian surname by my mum’s family. My Italian surnamed son even more so!

i laugh when they are AFTER ALL THESE DECADES still surprised when I understand the language and this is time after time 🤣🤣🤣🤣

I cannot believe that today my mum taking me home from an operation stopped at a shop run by people from the community and they were much younger than me (30’s) they were gobsmacked I was her daughter (we look alike).
I mean, oh please!

i was thoroughly loved by my English grandmother and her family though. At least that’s one thing. And my mum rails against those who are disrespectful to me and her grandkid, particularly in her own family.

op - you and your partner need some compromise. You need to lead on this, I think.

I don't see why your kids can't have names from both cultures.

I know that British colonisation of Aotearoa New Zealand was utterly brutal.

Does he think the colonisation of Ireland was any less brutal?

For him to lump Ireland in with England is really culturally insensitive.

What an absolute dick and incredibly selfish. I think you give him a choice of the names you like and ask to which of those he likes. If none, then that's his problem, not yours.

I totally disagree with @CurlewKate , just because he is living in the UK does not mean your heritage gets trumped. He can have a middle Māori or Tongan middle name. You have EQUAL right to decide your child's name. You are also living in the UK and not in Ireland so you deserve to give your child a name from your heritage.

He wants you to respect his culture and his family while showing no respect for you or your family etc. I can only see this leading to more problems as your children get older.

I would be evaluating your relationship to be honest, from your posts it isn’t just about names he sounds very controlling and that his way is the only way. Being parents is a partnership where you should work together.

Red flags here over your partner's controlling here.

Please please please do not let your son be circumcised 😢

Your partner is exerting his control so much here that he very much sounds like a bully.

And as for his offensive comment over us Irish having no culture, well, he can fuck off.

He's ignorant, controlling, bullying and this would make me dig my heels in even more and refuse to compromise on this. Name your baby Orla, do not allow for your son to have his foreskin chopped off (Bloodstained Men).

He sounds utterly vile. He's the big important man, so he calls the shots, you're just a mere woman and should do as you're told 🙄 He's an utter asshole.

As a Kiwi, I can completely imagine someone saying 'English and Irish have no culture.' I think it's a fairly common belief in New Zealand. It's because English culture is perceived as being quite similar to white New Zealand culture, minus the bits that make us unique - hence, 'no culture'!

And - this might not make me popular but it is true - most Kiwis are very confused about whether Ireland is a different country to the UK. The whole UK/Ireland/Northern Ireland/Great Britain/Scotland thing confuses the hell out of everyone. So I can easily imagine someone just saying England and Ireland together.

[I'd have higher expectations of someone whose own PARTNER was Irish, of course! Not excusing the man at all. Just putting into cultural context]

I'd get a prohibited steps order to prevent him getting him circumcised also.

Absolutely this. And tell him to get fucked. His family will feel hugely disrespected? Oh well. Don't know why you'd care about that when he doesn't respect one half of his children's culture.

Ireland does indeed have its own culture, he just seems to be ignorant of it.

Respecting his family's culture shouldn't be on your child's shoulders.

Tell him your dearest old great aunt was known as orla and it means a lot to you.

Also, ireland and britain have no culture? Racist of him to say that.

Why are you taking time to learn about his culture when he's so ignorant he believes England and Ireland have the same culture?

Unless you're in NI, neither of you live in your mother culture so both will be overshadowed by the prevailing UK culture where you live.

He sounds like an utter arse tbh.

Stand up for yourself. Orla is beautiful.

Throw his comments back at him. He sounds very controlling and belittling.

Do not let him multilate your child's genitals in some ceremony. It's as bad as fgm really, unless there is a medical reason which is very rare noone should be circumcising boys.

I'd be really, really concerned about the circumcision thing