Should he stay or should he go?

[Howbadistoobad]

My DH is just a bit too clueless on the adulting, parenting and domestic front. Our eldest is 12 and we have a house, two cars, 3 kids and 2 pets so really he should be into the swing of this by now!

Examples of things he can't really do:
Earning - he's literally the brainiest man on earth but has no clue about how to get on at work. Has had three jobs in his life and has been made redundant twice. Currently on a temporary contract. Will be interesting to see if they make him permanent. He is currently saying it is a certainty but I bet they will find plausible excuses and not. As a result I have stepped up my career to be primary earner, which would not be my preference as a mum of three with one still not yet at school tbh.

Cooking - needs to be told what to cook and left a recipe. If it's anything beyond basic he'll get v stressed and shout at the kids while he's doing it so I return home to miserable, stressed children (and increasingly DD12 will have stepped in to rescue him either from the cooking or the younger two but then she will blame me for leaving her to deal with it all)

Shopping - again needs spoon feeding with detailed list. Quicker to just go to supermarket myself. Can't take more than one kid with him because apparently too stressful. ???

Choosing lunch/snack for kids or even himself - I'll arrive home an hour after lunch or after school and they'll have had nothing because he was "waiting for me". They will be climbing the walls or helping themselves. Basically he just doesn't seem to know how to put a bit of lunch out from the fridge. Left to himself he just snacks on weird beige food like Weetabix several times in a day or toast and butter. If I didn't put fruit and veg on his plate I don't think it would occur to him to eat any.

Caring for the kids - Being at home with the kids just seems to make him and them stressed. Youngest one in particular hates being left with dad. At one time, he was our primary carer doing 2 days per week but he got really depressed. I was having to make sure he was awake and up before I could leave for work so had to stop that. I am not actually sure he has ever taken all 3 kids anywhere on his own. He would treat it as a military operation. He doesn't know what to do if the little one (DD) needs the toilet, basics like that.

He's not totally useless at everything btw. He is really v good at hobbies. He's taken a new big team sport up in the last couple of years and is clearly getting pretty good at it. And he has a hobby at home that he is a total perfectionist about, completely self taught. So he can learn when it interests him.

My question is: would my life be easier with this kind of annoying help from Slightly Clueless Husband or as a single parent of 3?

DH has ADHD. I could almost have written your post. The being amazing at what interests him is what many don't understand is a huge red flag for this condition. DH will hyperfocus on certain things. Yes it can be a hobby but it can also be a particular drawer in the kitchen or the cupboard under the stairs.
He loves me and the DC but wouldn't think of planning for us all and finds it difficult to have empathy. He can especially clash with DS who also has it. I'm the voice of reason.
After many years he has accepted how difficult he is to live with and sought help. It has quietened his mind allowing him to stay on mundane tasks better and is less anxious. Yes, I've enabled this behaviour but like you we were young when we married and I didn't know much better. The boiling frog analogy is a good fit, from for my taking the mental load to allowing him to opt out of parenting. It crept up on me then I simply dealt with what I had.

My dh also admitted he felt suicidal often due to his genuine not being able to get anything right. Not the talk of a lazy idle dh. Once found him wandering the streets in a very cold wet evening absolutely distraught. Don't be too quick to assume he is just a twat.

I am almost certain I have ADHD, and am in the process of being assessed. The hyperfocus on things that interest me to the detriment of other things is a huge thing for me.

But I don't check out of family life. I force myself to do at least the bare minimum of things that need to be done whether I like it or not. And I try to channel that hyperfocus into something useful like blitzing the bathroom or the kitchen every now and then.

I had one of these, generally good parent in terms of the fun or heavily planned and detailed stuff, fun to be with, easy to talk to, really he was my best friend, but, useless around the house, when left to his own devices, when expected to manage any aspect of family life alone.
It hit breaking point and as hard as it was to leave, I am infinitely happier as a single parent of 3. They're all disabled to varying degrees too, and it's still so much easier without his 'help'. I have one less person to plan for, organise, feed etc and I no longer resent the lack of support because he's not around for me to expect it. I even get a break now and again too - could never have happened before.

I think the key thing is that it's clearly affecting your eldest, who you said blames you for leaving her to deal with it. Children shouldn't feel like the adult, I say that as the child who had to grow up way too fast.

In all honestly, I suspect I am somewhere on the spectrum also, at least two of them, and that’s why I am not wringing my hands with an endless supply of sympathy.

As a child, I was selectively mute and could not speak to strangers at all, this went on until late teens. I had problems with food, a very restricted diet, anxiety and insomnia issues. My attendance at school was poor, and then I dropped out before taking any GCSEs.

I couldn’t cope with my own hygiene or attending Drs, dentists, or mental health professionals.

Household chores are caring for family were beyond my wildest dreams at that point.

Today, as an adult, I have taught myself many skills, I’ve had to be self taught most of my life because I find new people and environments difficult.

I didn’t want to, and it was awful to learn, and initially many times I did it in tears, but I had knew I had to… I didn’t have any support.

Even someone as low functioning as I was, have now over time, and with effort, learned to cook, clean, manage repairs, health, mental health… and I now take care of the young kids in my family on the weekends when I’m free, and even enjoy it. Practice makes perfect, or close enough to perfect.

It’s totally possible. There is no excuse for not trying.

If I had had someone to enable me, I would no doubt be following one of my passions in joggers and hoodie day and night.

Everyone can step up to the plate somehow, and he sounds more intelligent and capable than most.

What you DO NOT do, is have three children knowing you struggle with certain basics. I have had and never will have children for exactly this reason, it’s not fair to the kids or the partner. And I didn’t want my children to suffer as I did if it was partly hereditary, it would break my heart to see them struggling.

So he's very intelligent and is interested in his hobbies but not basic adulting or parenting
Yes you and DC would have a happier and relaxed life without him
Your 12 year old is more capable than your DH

It would have been useful if you'd have said he had been on a performance improvement plan in your initial post - far more relevant to your concerns than the redundancy itself.

25 years of professional and managerial experience across multiple sectors and experiencing a range of redundancies in that time. Also countless articles in management press saying the same things. Redundancy in the UK is about an organisational change not about sacking people for poor performance - there are different methods for doing that that are actually far easier.

I presumed there was performance issues by the very fact that the Op included that he’d been made redundant twice as a part of her frustrations with him

Sorry I haven't rtft but the bits I have read suggests he probably has depression and is masking it or trying to

Growing up he was a big fish in a little pond, at work he has found he is only mediocre. That is a very hard lesson to learn.

Dss was similar at school, small impoverished town, he was by compassion a genius to his peers. Repeatedly told by his parents and the school etc. Got to uni to.find actually although yes he is very smart, there were people far smarter and he was only really top of the middle. It hit him really hard.

Op I would suggest that you have a sit down without kids and lay it straight, he needs to get help and deal with his behaviour or ship out.

Yes

but in many poor performing and / or poorly managed organisations - redundancy is utilised as a tool to dispose of dead wood.

And odd that given your extensive experience, that you’d think otherwise

Indeed to quote you @Eleganz on another thread we were both on…

but if people are talking about streamlining the organisation that is definitely a euphemism for redundancies.

He’s not very smart at all though is he?

You might think he is because he ‘smashed’ university but he can’t even function to be even a quarter of a good dad or man.

Why are you with him? Because he can talk about current affairs and used to be clever at uni?

Obviously you and your children would be better off without him, he’s constantly neglecting your children and you don’t seem to mind.

Can't agree with the idea that he neglects the kids @Itsbritneybitch22 . He loves them very much and I'm sure most people we know would say he is a good dad. He just seems to make heavy weather of actually looking after them when he has to do this alone.

Your OH sounds like a fourth child and it would drive me crazy . I would have noticed issues before having 3 kids with him though .
If you enjoy his company I'd persevere but if not I'd move to be a single parent

@Howbadistoobad

He can’t/won’t cook for them and waits for you to come home, unless u read this wrong?

Doesn’t help your youngest pre schooler go to the toilet.

These are just 2 neglectful things I read … not going to even get into how stressed your children are when being alone with him - your actual words. Your 12 year old is doing the parenting/cooking when he’s in charge.

And you won’t leave him because you can’t trust him for the week he to look after them?

I would say this is neglectful and I haven’t mentioned half of what you’ve said.

Yeah, gotta agree, OP, you're setting a pretty low bar here for 'good dad'.

Reading this ADHD is jumping out at me. I also have an ADHD so recognise it in others but I think it's really important to say that as a woman and a mother I simply can't get away with behaving as he does, despite my struggles. I have had to get coping strategies in place so I am a decent wife and parent. If it is ADHD he needs to address it, take ownership and then work out his coping strategies. If you are NT you can help him do this but don't never be a martyr and don't be up doing it for him, give him a chance to step up and cope.

Op he’s been parenting for 12 years and he can’t ever go to the supermarket with more than 1 of his 3 children

Surely, surely, as some point over the last decade you’ve said “WTAF. WTAF H!!”

What kind of family dynamic did you grow up in OP?

@cultureplanet Yes of course I have but it's very clear to me that it's more so that he is trying his best (or at least what he currently believes to be his best) and can't rather than won't. So yelling doesn't actually get me anywhere, in fact it typically makes him more anxious and therefore less able to adult and therefore me more miserable in the end.

I have ADHD. I ended up as a single parent to five children so I had to FORCE myself to do some stuff that confused the hell out of me and that I really didn't want to do, or I would have lost my children.

We muddled through. I'm not quite sure how, but they all went to school on time, fed and clean and maintained hobbies. All adults now and I can hyperfocus to my delight in my own time. But yes, unless the ADHD is so severe that it needs medical attention (which OPs DH can't be, or he would have sought it by now), then you really can get through with lists and writing every thing down. Our wall calendar was a thing of wonder (and also huge).

Em.... dont you know you are a single parent to 4?

He knows you or your 12 year old will always step in and sort it so why would he even try to sort himself out?

OP - I see a lot of similarities in your life to mine. But with a couple of very important differences:

Mid-to late 40s, I'm the main breadwinner. 2 kids, oldest is 12.

If I am around, DH wouldn't feed a child, put a child to bed, think about bath time. If I wasn't around, he MIGHT do these things, but seldom well, and never on time. (this is in the past).

He can't (or struggles massively to) plan, organise or anticipate.

DS has recently being diagnosed with inattentive ADHD. We are 90% certain that DH has it too. We have discussed whether he should seek a formal diagnosis, and possibly, medication. We are not certain becuase... and this is where my life and yours diverge massively..... DH has worked extremely hard to overcome many of these challenges. He is not 100% there but the difference today vs years ago is notable. Some examples:

He worked in the arts originally. Stopped to get a better lifestyle. Tried various forms of more traditional office jobs which was a nightmare - was fired, made redundant, stressed etc. Became a SAHD for a few years and while we had some moments, worked hard to constantly improve in terms of anticipating DC needs, thinking ahead etc. For example, he was almost NEVER able to get himself and DS out the door - it just felt too overwhelming for him. Eventually he created a list of actions prior to departure and stuck to it religiously. Their world expanded accordingly. Booking/planning/researching activities felt very overwhelming so I'd start by doing some initial research, then encourage him to book it then over time, he'd get more comfortable and confident.

As the DC have got older, he has retrained in a one-to-one role, managed centrally and is excelling. Money isn't great, but he's still the primary carer, does all school runs etc. So it's fine for us.

Food - he's still not brilliant, but a) kids are old enough to remind him they need feeding and b) he has a small selection of options he is comfortable whipping out (some of which I've helped him to learn) and c) I try to accommodate this challenge for him by preparing/meal planning/shopping.

He has slowly taken on more actual workload at home AND more mental load. Some is the bigger, less often stuff like insurance, cars, dental etc, but some is more day-to-day focused like garden, bins, general tidying, bedding, laundry, home IT support etc, Each one has taken effort - often initiated by me then continued by him. He now regularly does the shopping (I do all meal planning and shopping lists though) something he found completely overwhelming and would take him 3 hours previously, and is responsible for most of the laundry-related tasks (I'm still more likely to realise washing needs to be put on, and as I WFH, it's easy to do. He however will absolutely hang it up, does all the folding/sorting/putting away etc). He has taught himself various DIY skills so he can do all that.

It hasn't been all smooth sailing to get here, but I can honestly, hand on heart, say that today my resentment levels are almost non-existent. There are the usual small niggles (his inability to put things in the dishwasher! :) ) but between the number of hours he's now working, the childcare he does, the volume of chores I do NOT have to do... I feel pretty good.

The difference is that in the almost 20 odd years we've been together, DH has consistently and regularly acknowledged that he is poor at certain things and then done his best to adapt and improve.

This is all very long-winded, I apologise, but I think the key issue is not whether or not your DH has ADHD. The issue is whether he acknowledges that he is shit and that he should put the work in to fix things.

I grew up with a sometimes depressed sahm who did 100% of the housework and weekday childcare and a dad who worked long hours in professional services but prioritised parenting and dipped into cooking and shopping at weekends.

My dad struggled to look after us on his own for any length of time tbh - mainly because house became a complete bombsite and he really didn't know how to operate the washing machine or the hoover - but he has a real talent for connecting and entertaining kids, cooks really well and we always had the best fun when it was just him.