To think he should be expelled for threatening me outside school?

[fedupteacher9]

Do I just need to suck it up ?

I am being routinely assaulted and threatened by students in my new job which I have been at for one term.

I am currently in a support role (school librarian) after leaving teaching, thinking the pay cut would be worth less mental anguish of abuse from students.

I have had 2 books thrown at my head by 2 different students. One was expelled and then unexpelled because the school feared being fined by the LA for incorrect expulsion. When he was unexpelled, I was aghast that he felt comfortable coming back into my library and sitting on his phone when he was meant to be in his lesson. Multiple times I had to get on call to remove him. SLT have obviously not taken this seriously.

The second boy has yet to face consequences. Headmaster told me his punishment would be a year ban from the library: for assaulting me?! Am I crazy?

If I told you what happened today, you wouldn't believe me. On the street I live on, a student approaches me and my partner and points a watergun at me. 'I should shoot you for kicking me out the library'. My partner just said 'come on lads, behave' and we walked away. This is my dream job, I competed with 50 other candidates for it, and one term in and I am applying elsewhere, to private schools where this shit won't happen.

If you are wondering why this is happening, these boys are retaliating to being removed or banned from the library by me for poor behaviour, truculence, abuse of staff or insubordination. I am not raising my voice at any of these boys.

I'm fucking livid.

I'm sorry you're going through this.

I was a PTC/Faculty Head/middle manager in a Scottish secondary school. No school is going to exclude a pupil for something that happens outside school. You could report the little darling to the local police*, but there's no guarantee that they'll act. (Been there. Got the t-shirt.)

On the other hand, it works both ways. I'll not divert your thread by telling the story at this point, but my husband once gave a bold boy a piece of his mind. My HT ruled that there were no consequences to me because it happened outside school hours.

I'm sorry that you're in this position, OP. The fact that the kids feel comfortable using the library as a place to skive lessons is the SLT's failure.

*There are some real weapons out there, made to look like toy guns.

Report to OFSTED? It's the only thing heads seem to care about.

Report it. Yes the school should do something. In any case I would create a paper trail. Write to the head saying you have been assaulted and threatened. Ask what the school will do to ensure you are not abused and threatened.

Putting things in writing focuses people's attention.

i am trying to dm you but it is not working.

how long ago was this?

is it the case that my boyfriend could potentially have acted (perhaps taken the gun and smashed it, nothing violent) without repercussions for me?

is there SERIOUSLY nothing a school can do if a student is threatening and intimidating a teacher outside of school? surely not!

YANBU

Fuck the school and their “discipline”. Call the police.

Plenty of schools absolutely would discipline a pupil for behaviour out of school, if they're in uniform.
I'd report to the police in your case, op, since your school management seems so shit.

This wouldn't go down at my DDs state school. This is a your particular school problem and you should definitely report that incident with the threat to shoot to the police. You don't know what else is happening around safeguarding and there may be a reason he's still at the school. The more you report the better. Please don't assume it's better in private. I've found private can be even worse as money talks.

I would report it to the police. It's assault.

I'll take a bribe to be abused over being abused for free any day. I have worked in private before and the difference is astounding.

I do not work in education and highly recommend you also don't work in education. I think you need to be more robust/resilient or work in a different sector.

You were threatened with a water pistol, even if you had we squirted I would not see this as a violent act.

It took place outside school so in my view is a police matter.

😂

You can also report the treat on your street to the police if you want to

My daughter has been to three different private schools and I have never heard of teachers being threatened or things being thrown at them at either of the three schools 🤷‍♀️

I'm new to Mumsnet, so maybe I'm doing something wrong. Also, my internet connection keeps dropping out.

At one point, schools would deal with offences outside school. A private school might well expel someone. A state school? No chance. At least, not in Scotland.

If you work in a good school with a decent SLT, they could probably ensure that you didn't encounter the miscreant in the library again.

The only thing that you can do is to report this to the police.

As to the possibility of your BF acting - the same law would apply to him in this scenario as with any other situation: you're only allowed to defend yourself.

Reason I left working in education. Kids don’t care, parents don’t care, SLT don’t care. So I stopped caring.

It's pretty clear that this isn't the job for you.

It's hard to tell whether it's a "school problem" (IE bad management) because your reaction to being threatened with a water pistol is so over the top.

Either way I think you'll be much happier elsewhere. I suggest you make the move before your partner opens themselves to accusations of assaulting a child for threatening to shoot you with a water pistol.

I’m a school governor we will, and do, discipline and exclude pupils for behaviour outside of school.
The permanent exclusion should have gone before Governors, and should any decision to overturn the exclusion.
The Headteacher can exclude for this behaviour, they are choosing not to.
Speak to your Union rep

You have absolutely no way of knowing that it was only water in that water pistol. Unfortunately, student miscreants can be wonderfully creative.

If you'd be quite happy about someone you met at work approaching you in this way, then bully for you.

I don't know the content of that water pistol, it could have been bleach or something corrosive, I don't know that he was just referencing the water pistol or if it was a more serious threat, and considering I have been assaulted twice, I would say that my reaction is fairly tame, I don't want to be harassed and intimidated in the town I have lived in since I was born for no reason, I have a right not to live in fear from your feral children

What??
Approaching a member of staff on the street, outside of their workplace, and threatening them with being shot is not a violent act????!!!!! You have a very high threshold for intimidation and threats.
This is a child, threatening a woman on the street with murder essentially. How is this ok? Or not violent? What happens 1 year down the line when he’s figured out how to get his hands on a real weapon?

I'm really happy for your daughter. My DD has been to 2 different state schools and has also never been threatened. Her best friend is at a N London private and has been, after moving there from state. Not sure what anecdotal experiences bring to the discussion though?

@WearyAuldWumman I feel sorry for Scottish teachers in that case. You definitely get excluded for behaviour outside of school in England. Lots of the time that's how it happens due to things being recorded. Esp when it's in uniform. Things like fights in town etc.

To me these are WAY OFF expelling level offences. It's rubbish you have to put up with it, don't get me wrong.

But a kid's education and life chances shouldn't be jeopardised for a water gun and getting a book thrown at you, which are both not exactly high stakes issues.

@XelaM Let's not forget private schools are motivated by money - mine (okay 20 years ago) let back expelled pupils all the time, their parents made lovely donations to help sway that decision. I'm talking knives, drugs, fights, prostitutes on school trips. They all got let back in.

@XelaM I just want to add- your DDs teachers haven't been threated- that YOU know of. That doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I doubt what's happened to OP is general knowledge.
However, it is not the norm and it wouldn't go down in any of the schools I've worked in or sent my child to.
I'm astounded some people here think this isn't behaviour that would lead to at least a suspension. The member of staff isn't safe and it is shocking people are ok with this.