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Original poster

To think this child’s crying outbursts are too much?

287 replies

ForgotTheBiscuits · 14/10/2023 01:23

My DS’s friend, 4, has almighty meltdowns whenever he has to do something he doesn’t want.

For example, I collected both my DS and his friend from a party, and as soon as it was time to go, this kid begins crying, not actually tears but just the sounds, lots of sound. He refused to say thank you to the hosts or wish the kid ‘happy birthday’ before we left. It went on for the entire 20 minutes journey home. It bothers me that I can’t attend to my own child at all when this is happening, as dealing with the meltdown takes all my attention.

There is no consoling, I have tried on many different occasions when this happens (it’s very frequent!) to reassure, comfort, give hugs, distractions, humour - nothing works! He just commits to the crying and won’t engage at all, won’t listen or even make eye contact. And it goes on for a very long time!

When this boy is playing and doing what he wants, he’s has pretty good manners and makes eye contact, is affectionate and talkative.

His mum is incredibly gentle and I don’t think he even gets short shrift at any time from her. I would spontaneously combust if my kid did this all the time, it’s bloody annoying to say the least.

I’m good with kids generally, having worked with hundreds of them over the years, and have always been able to find a way to calm a child down somehow, but this kid has me at a loss and drives me insane!!

Is this Highly Sensitive Personality or something else?

OP posts:
Jellycats4life · 14/10/2023 11:25

There is no such thing as Highly Sensitive as a profile.

The woman who coined the term wrote her book using her nephews as case studies. They were subsequently diagnosed with autism.

So whenever you see someone describe their child as a “HSP” just consider that to be autism in denial.

When this boy is playing and doing what he wants, he’s has pretty good manners and makes eye contact, is affectionate and talkative.

I take this to mean you have decided he cannot be autistic? Because my autistic children are capable of these things, on their own terms, and are still autistic.

MyGooseisTotallyLoose · 14/10/2023 11:26

TumblingTower · 14/10/2023 10:54

I don’t think the post is mean spirited, OP clearly does a lot for the Mother and child. She herself is struggling and it’s made harder by the child’s behaviour. She’s taking on a burden she doesn’t have to.

Agree, and I feel for her own child who sounds like he's being overlooked when this friend is here, even at his own birthday mum is spending a lot of time with him even down to mum leaving his party to take the other boy home?

Wolvesart · 14/10/2023 11:33

I don’t think I’d let anyone else collect my child if I had one that was prone to tantrum tears. Mind you, most parents are still staying at parties with their kids at 4-5 yrs.

As regards anxiety vs tantrum vs drama queens/kings they tend to grow out of it and it doesn’t stick around as a personality trait for long. I can only think of one lass we knew who always had some kind of meltdown - at parties in particular - who’s still exceptionally stroppy as a teen

Carpediemmakeitcount · 14/10/2023 11:41

YouJustDoYou · 14/10/2023 11:24

My ds was like this at 4. He was a total nightmare (my others weren't like this. It was a "him" issue). It took a number of years of constantly, CONSTANTLY, working on/with him, never letting him get away with anything even once, always having to helicopter him, reprimand, teach etc, but at 10 he is now a fantastic kid, renowned for his manners amongst other teachers and parents, and he's just a lovely little human. It was bloody hard work though. I can imagine if we took family advice to "just let him get on with it" (ie stop being so strict with him) he would've continued to be an absolute fucking nightmare. He was just a very high needs, intense, frustrated angry little boy who didn't really understand the rules of anything. Just took hard work and time.

Is he the youngest child or the middle?

Well done on your resilience and consistency in getting him to where he is. Parenting can be a challenge until the child clicks into place. A lot of parents give in to their child's demands because they can't be bothered. As they get older they are setting their children up to the hard way in life of learning how to behave because no one else will put up with it and they shouldn't have to. Well done mummy.

Seaside3 · 14/10/2023 11:48

If I'm looking after someone's kid, it absolutely is my place to 'parent' them. It's OK to tell the child to stop crying. They're causing a distraction whilst your driving and it's potentially unsafe. I.would expect anyone looking after my child.to discipline them as they see fit too. (Clearly not physically).

We can't possibly tell if the child is just doing it for attention, or is nd, or any other reason. I think, if you've followed the advice of doing a count down etc, and told him what to expect, but he still screams the place down, it's fine to say 'no, not this time, buddy' in a tone that makes him stop.

I don't think your thread is mean, it sounds like you're a kind person who is looking for ways to deal with a difficult situation.

Therealjudgejudy · 14/10/2023 11:59

You need to start putting your own son first, especially when it comes to his birthday party.

Being a martry is doing you, his mum and the boy no favours

Dragonfly909 · 14/10/2023 12:06

I'd be interested to here more about what you did as I have a 3 year old one of these @YouJustDoYou !

Original poster
ForgotTheBiscuits · 14/10/2023 12:16

margotrose · 14/10/2023 08:39

I don't think this thread is very kind.

He's only four, he has a mum who is clearly quite unwell and as a result, he is doing a lot of things on his own or with a relative stranger taking him. That must be quite overwhelming for a child who has barely started reception.

I wouldn't be indulging the tantrums and would probably just ignore them but I don't think it's nice to come on and start a thread that will just encourage people to bash his mum and call him a brat.

my main reason for posting was to gauge other’s opinions and possible strategies. And yes, some validation of my struggles to deal with this and read that it would challenge others too. But obviously not to pour scorn on his mum or the child himself, who is only 4 and is in need of support.

I’ve had some really helpful ideas which I’m very grateful for and will put into practice. I will invite his mum to my boy’s birthday, as I really like her and whilst I’d like to give her a break, it would definitely result in a better outcome for everyone if she’s there too.

OP posts:
Carpediemmakeitcount · 14/10/2023 12:16

overand · 14/10/2023 09:18

@TumblingTower I have seen the looks from other adults when my child is having a meltdown - and they are not compassionate, they are judgemental, just like much of this thread.

When my little one is screaming, hitting, kicking and hurting himself and I'm down at his level trying to comfort him, it makes me sad knowing there are people out there shaking their heads, tutting and thinking he's a brat rather than a struggling child.

I think most parents have those feelings when their child is having a tantrum. Be consistent keep on going and if you have to remove him from the situation. When I see children having a tantrum I think to myself been there done that wore the t-shirt. Don't worry about what others are thinking you focus on your child and his moment. Also, he probably doesn't like the idea of you dragging him about it's boring and he can't have fun with his toys. It's a part of growing up that all children have to get used to.

Carpediemmakeitcount · 14/10/2023 12:30

How does she engage with him op is she hands on with him. He is probably calling out for attention from his mum she needs to wake up and put some effort into him.

I was ill and the way I was treated by professional people the disabilities they were trying to pass on to my daughter that was not true and they admitted this later. Mental illness can be selfish as well as debilitating because you don't see the people around you only how you feel.

She needs to snap out of it quickly and if you are her friend give her some home truth's. The only person who told me the truth was my partner and I did hate him for it but he was right. Everyone else felt sorry for me and mollycoddled me and that made it worse. Ask yourself this because I had this realisation the other day if she was well would you be doing all of this and would you call her your friend. None of those people are around me now because I had to fight back against people feeling sorry for me.

Original poster
ForgotTheBiscuits · 14/10/2023 12:31

Yalta · 14/10/2023 10:04

I think that this child isn’t necessarily whinging/shouting fake crying about the event ending or what is going on in the immediate vicinity. But about his mum and the home life and differences he perceives around him.
He is trying to draw attention to the fact his mum isn’t there to pick him up, his mum isn’t there to take him places. A party/day out ending just brings back all the memories of what is going on at home.

Dont know what is happening with his mum and if this is a terminal diagnosis/ long term health issue or a temporary set
back with a time line to recovery but in the gentlest way, could you suggest to your friend she gets some counselling/therapy for her ds who is clearly struggling with the status quo

Thank you, this is very helpful. I think because his mum is the centre of his universe, and she’s not able to be there at these times, it’s rocking his world in a bad way. His older brother is very good at emotional regulation, but in this case I worry he keeps to much in, for fear of disturbing an already wobbly apple cart.

Its a difficult situation, but as this mum has so little support, and I can help, despite it being a challenge, I will persevere!

OP posts:
Gymnopedie · 14/10/2023 12:34

This COULD be an ND child.

This COULD be a spoilt brat.

He COULD be reacting to his home situation.

No-one on here knows whichever way.

OP it might not be possible for your own child's party because it's for a couple of hours, but could you (from her health point of view) pick her up when it's time to get the DCs to go home, so that she's there with him?

zingally · 14/10/2023 13:06

Frankly OP, you're not this child's mother - and as much as you're trying to do her a favour by helping out with him - I think it's time to start being less available.
You've already been MORE than kind with all the ferrying around and everything, and honestly, that's a huge ask on the part of his mum. After all, you are JUST the mum of his current chosen best friend. Just pure chance.
I get that the mum is disabled, or whatever, but she needs a better support system for herself and her high-needs child than just "little Tommy's mum".

As for when you're next lumbered with him and he's screaming in the car, maybe a short dose of "Freddy! Will you just BE QUIET!" said at a forceful volume, might be just what he needs. It certainly won't do him any harm.

Saz12 · 14/10/2023 13:23

If comforting him and hugs dont work, then how about a clear "I can see you're very upset. We love you and dont want you to be sad. But just now we (eg) need to get home".

Fivebyfive2 · 14/10/2023 13:42

SkyFullofStars1975 · 14/10/2023 09:39

He's got you right where he wants you. You're focused 100% on him and not your own child.

I would tell Mum that she has to come too, as you can't deal with his meltdowns every time you leave somewhere.

Op please for the love of God ignore yhis.... Because yeah the 4 year old kid with a sick mum who can't manage to spend much time with him really "has you where he wants you" when he gets upset.

This is really reminding me why I hardly come on here anymore. It's so depressing. We have a small child whose mum is ill and he's probably struggling. Maybe additional needs but even without, he's got alot going on.

But yeah let's all pile on, call him a brat, make assumptions on how awful his mum must be. Because we're all so much better, aren't we? Jesus.

Balloonhearts · 14/10/2023 13:49

I'd honestly just raise my voice to be heard and tell him to pack it in, he's acting like a 2 year old and you won't be taking him anywhere again unless he stops this ridiculous whinging.

It's usually enough to call it out and bring his attention to the fact that his friends aren't having babyish tantrums and they stop. That's why they behave better at school. Peer pressure, they don't want to look silly in front of their friends. Point out that they're doing just that and most kids just stop.

Original poster
ForgotTheBiscuits · 14/10/2023 14:04

His mum isn’t awful by any stretch, she’s a wonderful mum who by nature is very gentle (she’s not doing ‘gentle parenting’, that just her personality). I feel she’s taken the path of least resistance perhaps as a way to get through the day, not because she’s ignorant, but because the day needs getting through.

OP posts:
Original poster
ForgotTheBiscuits · 14/10/2023 14:09

It’s been really helpful to consider that every time I turn up or am there instead, that’s a bitter reminder that mum isn’t there at these times. It must feel very frightening to feel that your one and only isn’t there when you need her.

I am committed to being a good friend and will try the tips kindly suggested to help. Equally, not to take on more than I can manage.

OP posts:
chaosmaker · 14/10/2023 14:10

You are a great friend for taking on your friend's child so much when she's having a rough ride. Also for maintaining the friendship between your children. Sometimes going through the routine can do wonders. With some of the children I support, even saying we are going home to see mum is calming for them. I usually repeat the routine but with one child I support, it totally depends on his mood as to whether or not this works. Good luck and definitely involve his mum in coming up with solutions. Maybe she could go through things before he even comes out with you.

StarlightLime · 14/10/2023 14:11

Who's looking out for her older children, op?

BellaTheDarkOverlord · 14/10/2023 14:12

Had this with a friends kid who is NT age 5. Holiday for 2 days with them. He won a teddy Dog from a stall at a fair and had a melt down because he’d spent all his spending money in the shops within the first hour of being there. His younger sister (3) wanted the dog and hadn’t won anything herself. She was excited when he sold the dog to her so he had more money from her. He then took the money he got from
selling to her and spent it within minutes in the shop. Later in the day he had a meltdown that the Dog he won he didn’t have anymore and his sister had it. Cue a meltdown of screaming, throwing himself on the floor and curling into a ball. His parents gave in and took the Dog from his younger sister and gave it back to him. Sister was now without her money and without the teddy. My heart breaks for that little girl how her brother got her money and the Dog and she got nothing.

We bought our dd a toy in the shop which was similar to one he bought. He had another meltdown that he didn’t have that exact one. It’s so exhausting.

Sisters birthday this year and I can see pictures of him getting toys too…

Mrsjayy · 14/10/2023 14:13

Does mum get out at all does she realise that he is unhappy on these drop offs ?
You have had some right shitty replies on your thread well done for rising above it all,

WeightoftheWorld · 14/10/2023 14:14

junbean · 14/10/2023 01:34

At home his tantrums gets him what he wants. It will continue into adulthood if they don't wise up.

That's not necessarily the case. My 5yo is still like this very often, always has been, and it's absolutely not because behaving like that gets her what she wants! She absolutely doesn't get a return on her investment for the tantrums, at all, never had done. She's cried and screamed incessantly since she was born tbh.

StarlightLime · 14/10/2023 14:16

The kid is desperate for more time / interaction with his Mum. Why aren't either of you listening to him?

funinthesun19 · 14/10/2023 14:48

He sounds like my 5 year old DD. She has suspected Autism. People who have never been in this position will ever understand how complex and difficult it is.

Sometimes it’s more than just a naughty or rude child.