Page 23 | Friend won't leave kids for a few days with husband

Whattodo17xx · 2023-10-02T09:19:19+00:00

My friend and I are mid 30's. She is married with two kids. I'm getting married next year (no kids). Been friends since we were 8! I am having a very low key wedding, max 16 people and would like to go away with my friend for 1-2 nights somewhere like Paris instead of a hen do next year. Just us two. Her kids will be 7 & nearly 3. Her husband works full time from home. I suggested going away Fri-Sun over the school holidays. She has basically said no because her youngest wouldn't cope that long without her. Is this normal for women not to want to leave their kids at this age? Having no kids it seems OTT to me but then again, I don't know what it's like. AIBU to think she could easily have a few days away with me with a years notice?

momymu · 02/10/2023 15:45

Her 3yo is a bit too young imo. I started going away for 1-2 nights with my friends when my youngest was 8 I think. Plus, some people want to spend their available time with their DH and children only.

WinterDeWinter · 02/10/2023 15:46

MargotBamborough · 02/10/2023 14:53

I agree with a lot of this.

I only got to have what were, by UK standards, short maternity leaves. And my job involves a fair amount of travel. I had to do one overnight stay a week after I started work again after my first maternity leave, when my son was still breastfeeding through the night. I had to pump milk on a construction site and in my hotel room before and after dinner and before breakfast. I went on two Monday-Friday transatlantic work trips, one when my son was 11 months old and one when he was 13 months old. So because I had had to do these things without much real choice in the matter, and my husband had had to cope, I knew we could all cope. That gave me the freedom to have a couple of much needed weekends away with my friends, which my husband fully supported and encouraged. It was actually my husband who had never spent a night away from our children until very recently.

Meanwhile my friend, whose son is 6 weeks older than mine, can't even go for a child free brunch on a Saturday due to her partner's learned incompetence and her son's expectation that she will be around all the time. So she brought her two year old along to the supposedly child free brunch I had left my own two year old at home to attend, and my other friend and I ate our own meals while hers sat untouched and congealing because her son could not cope with not being the sole focus of her attention for even a minute, and when I'd finished my meal I volunteered to take him outside in the pushchair for a little walk so she could eat her meal in peace. It was eye opening.

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I think this is really interesting. I would love to see some data on how the grown-up children of women who did attachment parenting differ psychologically from those who had multiple caregivers.

One of my children was with me all the time till 3, and the other went to a childminder at under one. The results are, I guess, what I might have predicted - the first is quite self-centred if I'm honest, and the second is more anxious. But they both have other difficulties - probably a mix of parenting mistakes I've made and genetics - and there are obviously more determinants too, and I am only a survey of one!

ColleenDonaghy · 02/10/2023 15:46

whatnot929 · 02/10/2023 15:42

You don't imagine it...you pick one.

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You pick the partner - although I do know women who've been unpleasantly surprised in that regard.

You don't pick the child. You can't dictate that they'll sleep, or settle without a breastfeed or won't have separation anxiety at just the point you have the chance of a trip away.

SouthLondonMum22 · 02/10/2023 15:46

Anonymouslyposting · 02/10/2023 15:27

What do you think the reasons are?

Personally I think it cuts both ways - it’s not just that men ARE fine with it but that they are more expected to be fine with it. Certainly at my work mothers with young children are given more slack when it comes to saying no to work trips than men who are expected to just carry on as though the kids don’t exist. I expect they’d also get more of a hard time for saying no to going on a stag do or boys trip because they want to stay with their kids. So I expect many men actually do feel like they don’t want to leave their kids but are less able to say so than women - obviously I’m just guessing here though, maybe I’m wrong.

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I agree.

Men are expected to be fine with it
Women are expected to always want to be with their children

I've shared this on here before but I wasn't even considered for a work trip which I thought would be a good opportunity due to the fact that I have a baby. I was outright told when I asked about it ''Oh, I didn't think you'd want to leave your baby''. 🙄

Darkmode2 · 02/10/2023 15:46

I'd be leaping at the chance for a weekend away from my two but everyone is different.

My dp is fully capable of looking after them on his own and they're happy to be left with him.

I don't think it's a bad thing for young children to be away from their parents every now and again

WongWifi · 02/10/2023 15:49

TiredMummma · 02/10/2023 14:14

Honestly it is so weird. Having kids doesn't mean you are suddenly meant to stop everything else in your life. It's unhealthy for the kids too, especially not to have a good enough relationship with their dad. The youngest kid is 3, not a baby! I've already left my 6 mo to go to a play, for a night out with a friend and for a class.

However, it is entirely up to her, I just personally wouldn't be her friend and would be rethinking inviting her to the wedding and invite someone who values your friendship instead!

Huh? You’d dump a friend for caring more about her own family? Weird.

TooOldForThisNonsense · 02/10/2023 15:49

Personally I think it’s OTT but it’s up to her. I think if you have a child free wedding (which is fine, no issue with that) you kind of need to accept some people won’t want to come.

WhatapityWapiti · 02/10/2023 15:51

Kemper · 02/10/2023 10:35

The thing is, if a woman with kids of that age posted on here that her bloke wanted to go on a European city break for two days with a mate he would get his arse handed to him

Really? Why? What’s wrong with a man going away for a weekend now and again, as long as his partner also gets to do the same? My husband went on a low key weekend away with 3 of his oldest mates recently, as one had had a tough time recently. No issues from me (DC is 7 but he also went away now and again when DC was most younger ages too. As did I)

Oblomov23 · 02/10/2023 15:51

No. Any woman who can't leave their children with their dad, at that age, has got issues. Why wouldn't youngest be able to cope? With daddy?

mathanxiety · 02/10/2023 15:51

I wouldn't have left my kids with my exH for two hours, let alone two days. He was an angry man who took it out on them.

I think you should consider that your friend might not be able to afford to go or might have a child who would miss her badly, or that her husband doesn't parent with patience or kindness or common sense.

I don't like the idea of a bride or groom summoning their besties to weekends away, whether for 'last time' holidays or hen dos or destination weddings. One of my DDs is heading to a hen in Cancun next spring and has to use some of her precious annual leave to go, plus spend money on a trip she definitely wouldn't have chosen to take were it not for the fact that she's a bridesmaid.

TooOldForThisNonsense · 02/10/2023 15:52

Sorry just re read. It’s the hen do, not even the wedding? In that case YABU. I was fine leaving my kids but wouldn’t want to spend that kind of money on a hen do so I would (and did back in the day) make an excuse not to go. Not being able to leave kids is a good one. If I had limited funds and/or annual leave I wouldn’t be spending it on a hen do.

ReadingSoManyThreads · 02/10/2023 15:53

YABU

Yes, it's normal and you are being unreasonable by questioning this. She's an adult, and has made a decision based on her own family dynamics and it's unreasonable for you to not respect her decision.

mathanxiety · 02/10/2023 15:53

Whattodo17xx · 02/10/2023 10:43

You have to 'owe' your husband for looking after his kids one weekend?

You'd be surprised at the arseholey behaviour of some men.

MargotBamborough · 02/10/2023 15:53

WinterDeWinter · 02/10/2023 15:46

I think this is really interesting. I would love to see some data on how the grown-up children of women who did attachment parenting differ psychologically from those who had multiple caregivers.

One of my children was with me all the time till 3, and the other went to a childminder at under one. The results are, I guess, what I might have predicted - the first is quite self-centred if I'm honest, and the second is more anxious. But they both have other difficulties - probably a mix of parenting mistakes I've made and genetics - and there are obviously more determinants too, and I am only a survey of one!

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There must be so many other variables as well though.

I realise that what I described sounds like the opposite of attachment parenting, but I also breastfed for 16 months and co-slept for most of the first year.

His little sister is not yet 9 months old, I've been back at work for a few weeks already and she is also breastfed and co-sleeping, but because she won't take a bottle I've told my boss I can't do any work trips for the time being.

I know we somehow managed to get my son from being a co-sleeping little limpet to sleeping independently in his own room every night but I can't remember how we did it, so now we have to figure that out all over again.

He's very affectionate but I wouldn't say he was anxious.

It's hard to tell what is nature and what is nurture, isn't it?

WhatapityWapiti · 02/10/2023 15:54

SouthLondonMum22 · 02/10/2023 15:46

I agree.

Men are expected to be fine with it
Women are expected to always want to be with their children

I've shared this on here before but I wasn't even considered for a work trip which I thought would be a good opportunity due to the fact that I have a baby. I was outright told when I asked about it ''Oh, I didn't think you'd want to leave your baby''. 🙄

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I was once in a meeting when candidates to attend a conference were being discussed and exactly this was said about a female colleague (who was not there). I told them that they absolutely must not assume this and she had to be given the choice. They actually thought they were being considerate 🤦‍♀️

(She said no in the end, but she was glad they asked).

ReadingSoManyThreads · 02/10/2023 15:56

Oblomov23 · 02/10/2023 15:51

No. Any woman who can't leave their children with their dad, at that age, has got issues. Why wouldn't youngest be able to cope? With daddy?

Don't be ridiculous. It's biologically normal for babies and young children to have a much closer bond to their mother, you know, the person who grew them, birthed them, and breastfed them? The mother knows her toddler better than anyone and if she's worried her young child will be distressed without his/her greatest source of comfort for a few days, then that's absolutely the right decision to decline to go.

Sanch1 · 02/10/2023 15:57

It's another one of these MN things, anyone wanting to leave their kids is a terrible mother and everyone is supposed to be tied to their kids until they are teens its bonkers. In real life anyone I know would happily come with you as asked. For the record OP I dont think YABU unreasonable at all! I just had a lovely two nights away without my 3, 7 and 10 yr olds and they were perfectly happy and safe with my DH.

Cornettoninja · 02/10/2023 15:57

Why wouldn't youngest be able to cope?

have you met any three year olds? Why do they do anything?

It’s absolutely one of those ages where they inexplicably develop separation issues or sleep issues or any other number of issues. Tbf it could just as much be something up with the seven year old and the fallout of being away for two nights just isn’t worth it. Who knows what’s going on in their house.

SparklyTwinkleGlitter · 02/10/2023 15:59

It might be because she’s a mum and doesn’t like leaving her kids or it might be that she doesn’t enjoy pubs and clubs and being around people who drink?

My friend recently invited me to join her and her two other friends for her hen night in the nearby city. Luckily it was quite short notice so I was able to politely decline but I wouldn’t have wanted to go anyway, as I don’t drink and I hate hanging out with people getting drunk. I start to feel very uncomfortable and a bit like a vegan stuck in the middle of a barbecue with everyone eating medium rare steak. You know stand out like a sore thumb and don’t belong with that crowd.

Yellowlily8 · 02/10/2023 16:00

Before having a child, I thought I'd be fine to leave her with DH for the weekend now and again, but once she came along my feelings changed drastically, in a way I really couldn't have understood before I had children. I just don't want to leave her.

ChaosAndCrumbs · 02/10/2023 16:00

My children would struggle. I would be very unlikely to leave them for a hen weekend, even if it was just me and the other person. I couldn’t say if I would a year from now, as I don’t know if they’d manage better then or not. My eldest (ds) has ADHD but that wasn’t recognised until recently so I wouldn’t have been able to name any extra needs to help others understand - they’d just need to accept I knew my children best.

Lots of people are happy to do things like this, but my children just don’t respond well to it. I try to gradually increase their ability to manage without me (eg. Introducing sleepovers, babysitting with trusted people) but I can’t change the pace they manage it at, only encourage.

Three is still pretty young and 2 full days and nights is a long time for a young child. One little girl of a similar age was sobbing at DD’s nursery the other day as her mum had gone away for work and Dad explained she was finding it tough. Obviously that Mum had to work, but knowing my dd would be similar I wouldn’t do it unless I had to.

FrenchandSaunders · 02/10/2023 16:00

I could be a bit uptight with bedtimes, food, routines. I had twins so it was my way of coping, with hindsight. I think it did them the world of good when they were left with DH for a weekend ...... far more chilled about all that stuff.

Playingintheshadow · 02/10/2023 16:00

My children were a LOT older before I went away without them for the first time.

I just didn't want to. I worked full-time and they were in nursery/school, so my time with them was precious.

No regrets.

WhatapityWapiti · 02/10/2023 16:01

ReadingSoManyThreads · 02/10/2023 15:56

Don't be ridiculous. It's biologically normal for babies and young children to have a much closer bond to their mother, you know, the person who grew them, birthed them, and breastfed them? The mother knows her toddler better than anyone and if she's worried her young child will be distressed without his/her greatest source of comfort for a few days, then that's absolutely the right decision to decline to go.

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The younger child will be 3 when the trip happens! As soon as I finished breastfeeding my DH and I made sure that our child saw us both as equal parents. I’d be appalled if he had a closer bond to one of us than the other.

mathanxiety · 02/10/2023 16:01

Whattodo17xx · 02/10/2023 10:56

See this is interesting because this has to work both ways.

As far as I'm concerned, I make lots of effort with my friend. Kids are 99% of the time in tow with her which is fine. But is it not ok to request some 1 on 1 time with my friend as well? I don't want to talk about children all of the time, I want to enjoy her company.

I have struggled to even get my friend away for dinner without the kids recently. This seems to be getting worse the older the kids get, not better. Btw I ask my friend to dinner just us two maybe twice a year, for her birthday and Christmas. It was a few weeks ago and her husband was fine to look after both her kids, but when I arrived to pick her up the youngest wasn't settled, and despite her husband telling her he would be fine, she ended up bringing him to dinner at 8pm. It changed the dynamics entirely. It didn't even cross her mind that it would bother me?

I suggested the weekend away a year in advance so she could have a think and I can tell deep down she really wants to, but it's like she physically can't leave them if that makes sense. I suggested just the 1 night away too...

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I don't think you're being a good friend here.

You're not meeting here where she is in her life, which is 'full-on mother of young children and trying to do her best in that role, as she sees it'.

You don't want to talk about children all the time though, and your efforts to take her away from them for the odd dinner or weekend are not selfless acts of love for the woman she used to be.

You say you want to enjoy her company, but you want to ignore the person she's become and you want her to do that too - you want her to be the friend to you that she used to be and you're resentful of the fact that she's engaged in her role of mother (as she sees it) to the extent that she is.