To dread winter with my toddler?

[Summermeadowflowers]

Since DS started sleeping through, which was around 18 months, he’s woken early and this is often around 530. Tweaking bedtimes and naps doesn’t seem to make any difference to this. Sometimes he’ll have a spate of 630-7 wakeups but then will start waking earlier and earlier until you’re back at 530, or earlier.

It was miserable enough last winter but now we have a baby as well. Last night I woke to express milk at 230. Then DD woke at 330, I got her settled again at 4, then bloody DS woke at half five.

DH does take him when he can but if he’s working away or even if he’s in the office he has to leave at just before 7. It’s the longest morning ever before we can go out then we go out somewhere then DS gets really tired and stroppy in the afternoons because he is so tired.

No point to this, just a moan. I do love DS very much but I hate this particular habit he has so much, and I worry about DD as it inevitably disturbs her and the last thing I want is her being in this awful pattern too.

I promise I’m not irate at all @NameChange30 . It goes to show how tone can be misunderstood. I’m a bit bemused people are so keen to insist the Gro clock will work - I’m guessing you don’t all work for them! - but no irateness. Just, um, answering I suppose!

@mewkins he doesn’t nap - with me anyway. Sometimes does at nursery. Either way makes no difference. He either wakes early or doesn’t.

Husband is helpful when he’s here. He often isn’t.

@Muchtoomuchtodo a gro clock worked wonders for my nephew too. He'll be 7 soon but my Dsis been using it for years now. Prob since he was 3 ish. Now he just plays quietly/reads in his room until its 7am etc then he goes to find Mum. He's full-on all day & has got SEN - sensory processing disorder & maybe mild ADHD but he's always gone to bed well & slept through as my Dsis is a single mum & has always been strict about bedtime routines etc. In the mornings she is tired/waking up & they have breakfast & quietly watch TV together etc & he knows this is how their day starts - not loud, noisy toys etc or running around being silly. Appreciate all kids are different but it is possible to train kids to a certain extent even from a young age. I also appreciate she foesnt need to worry about waking up another DC or DH so that does take some pressure off her but she does have neighbours as she lives in a flat so she doesn't want him making too much noise so early. Good luck OP - my kids are 15 & 19 but I still remember with horror that phase when my DS decided to wake at 5 ish as a toddler for months in a row. Just awful!

DS was exactly the same. Gro Clock made no difference; strong willed kids don’t give a shit about a clock telling them they can’t get up yet.

It’s honestly easier just to go with it and adjust your days accordingly. Start your day properly then too. Get out of the house as early as you can and then chill at home in the afternoon.

My kids are strong willed and cooperate with little else. But bizarrely it worked for them.

Im not saying it works for all kids, of course it doesn't, I'm just saying just because your child is strong willed doesn't mean it's not worth a try.

Ah fair enough, yeah it does sound rough either way as the sleep deprivation will wear you down. I'm always up before the birds (and the sun in the winter) and enjoy autumn/winter so I wasn't sure what the impact was.

Yes it's brutal, been there

At least they'll be in bed early, no light evenings

You just have to go to bed early yourselves too

I have a feeling this may not be helpful but my DS was the same, although it gradually moved to 6/6.30am, and continued that way through to teenage years. If we allowed the boys to stay up late for a special occasion when they were older DS2 would still wake on the dot at 6.30am and be horrible.

We tried absolutely everything and nothing worked for any length of time, the only plus side was that he was a really good sleeper and good at bedtime. I just learned to live with it and got DH to do his share as much as possible.

This was, and still is, my 7 year old. Except now he wakes at 5.30 without disturbing me, gets himself breakfast, and is all ready for school by the time my alarm goes off, so all I have to do is get myself ready for work and drink my coffee and take my cheerful wide awake boy to school. Compared to friends who are dragging their moaning kids out of bed and dashing to get to school on time, my mornings are pretty awesome now. But yes, the price I paid was when he was 18months old and getting up at 4.30am waving storybooks in my face saying "tory?" I also had a baby back then...my younger child is 5 now. It was tough. Hang in there ❤️ it's all worth it.

Do you think you could do with vitamin D supplements? Not saying the waking up early isn’t an issue (I would die) but since it seems to be the biggest issue in the winter maybe it could help?

@LoveBeingAMum555 yes - DS is great at bedtime, sleeps through - I shouldn’t complain. It’s just so bloody early!

@Kwasi absolutely!

Ok, so nothing anybody is going to suggest can possibly work. You've either already done it and it's failed or you know it's not even worth bothering with in advance.

The Gro light can be useful in other ways - you can use it as a light that doesn't completely wake everybody up compared to big lights or lamps, which is easier on your eyes and head when you're feeling fragile because his screaming coincides with your chosen time for deep sleep (chosen because you're choosing to pump at a time that makes it most likely you'll be in deep sleep at that point). It might help him stay calmer rather than being wide, wide, wide awake the instant you go into him and switch the light on as he's been dreaming.

If you set up drinks/cereal/blankets/cushions/etc where he's most likely to want to go - TV does some serious heavy lifting with the resolutely awake - you can curl up on the sofa whilst he watches Peppa Pig or whatever he likes most. Keep the main lights off, just warm lamps until you actually want everybody bright eyed and bushy tailed.

After doing the first part of the morning, get everybody out for fresh air. This includes when it's dull, blustery or raining. Not being in a confined space makes the noise less jarring and you need the daylight, then back for a snack (and coffee). Get as much done as possible in the mornings because he's making sure you have so much of them.

Do as many Baby and Toddler groups, preschool and activities you can and have afternoons doing 'less'. Then early tea for them so there's very little left to do in the evening after you've eaten and you're set for the morning.

It rarely lasts forever. But when nothing else will ever work, the only thing you can do is practical things to make it manageable and keep you healthy.

@NeverDropYourMooncup honestly - I stopped reading after your first sentence. Because yes - I am pretty satisfied I’ve tried everything. He wakes early, it’s what he does, this may change and even if it doesn’t we’ll get to a point where he isn’t waking everyone, but at the moment this is where we are.

Trust me, you don’t undergo fifteen months of 530 get ups, nine of those when pregnant, without trying Gro clocks and blackout blinds and treat it as a night wake up and this and that and that and this. (And on the odd occasion they sleep a bit later you endlessly over analyse what happened that day as to how you can recreate it again!) Makes no difference. I have tried

Earlier bedtime ❎ nope

Later bedtime ❎

Droppibg the nap ❎

Keeping the nap ❎

Shortening the nap ❎

Blackout blinds ❎

Gro clock ❎

Supper ❎

Moving to a bed not cot ❎

It’s just - well, it’s when he wakes up I suppose! And I did say I was moaning rather than seeking advice.

We would treat a 530 wake up as still night so lights low, no stimulation, get in my bed but you're not getting up. You can adjust bedtomes to what works for you if you want to list your evenings or be grateful he's not walking through the night. Reading your replies most seem to be putting up barriers to some decent suggestions.
Parenting isn't easy but we are the parents so we either suck it up or attempt to train them out of habits that don't work for us. Give the suggestions a go and see what happens.

I hope your offloading has helped @Summermeadowflowers

I think most parents have been there at some point, we all take different approaches and can cope with / are willing to accept different things from our dc.

Very few approaches work instantly or 100% of the time. just because some things haven’t worked in the past, don’t rule them out in the future or with dc2.

What would you do if he woke at 3am, get up and start the day? I’d treat 5.30am the same as 3am… it’s still night time, back in bed. Keep putting him back to bed. Once clock says 6.30am it can be morning but before that it’s night time. The gro clock only works if you use it as a visual tool and when it shows it’s night time you don’t allow dc to get up.

i did have a friend who used to pop a bowl of dry cereal by her dc bed when she went to bed herself. She said he would wake up and eat it, giving her 30 mins extra sleep.

Not many 3 yr olds grasp gro clocks! Bloody lucky if you have one who does. I’ve been in childcare for 40yrs and none of the kids I’ve looked after would have at 3

Funny. I also work in childcare and I've never met an NT child who didn't understand a gro clock. Plenty who didn't abide by it of course, but they all understood what each colour meant.

Also, all understood red/green man at that age which I would say is a similar concept (two colours, representing two different things).

I don’t know about anyone else but when you go to a baby or toddler group and have a chat with another mum in the same position, it helps: this is the sort of online equivalent. The Gro clock posts are bordering on a bit obsessive now!

Ah I agree OP, cold, dark early get ups are grim! I know you say naps make no difference but once they’re gone completely it might help eventually, it seemed to for our dd, or it might have just been growing out of a stage but by 4yrs she was nearly always getting up at 6.30. Fingers crossed it gets later for you too.

I mentioned this before, but I think it got missed. If your husband leaves just before 7, surely he can get up with your toddler, get ready with him around (like minions of parents do) and then wake you when it's the to go. That would give you nearly an hour and a half more each day.

It sounds like you've been doing all the early mornings even when pregnant. That's really, really not on.

Seeing as I was starting by agreeing with your standpoint that nothing will ever work, that was rather silly then, wasn't it?

It's not going to change. He's not going to change. You're not going to change him.

So what's left to change? You. Ways to try to manage it. Ways to give you the best chance of coping with his early waking. Ways to minimise the sheer awfulness and misery of the next couple of years until he's able to get up, get a cereal bar and switch the TV on to watch cartoons without doing himself or part of the house permanent damage, at any rate.

But hey, you were so busy with your fingers in your ears going 'la-la-la, I can't hear you', you didn't notice that.

Reading all the posts about gro clocks are making me laugh.its wonderful if they work but you have s fair enough idea if they will work for your child or not.
You are either lucky or unlucky if you have a child that does or doesn't lay in til a 'reasonable' time.
It's acceptance and going with it even when it is difficult.
It's nice to know there are so many of us in the same boat.for nearly 4 years I haven't had a good night's sleep and it's a killer.
Good luck to those that can 'trains their little ones to stay in bed longer but as someone said if you have a strong willed child you don't stand a chance.
The thought of leading a child back to bed endlessly gives me nightmares even thinking about it and it is morning so it doesn't seem right...just think a few years from now it will all be a distant memory and we will be trying to get them out of their beds.

The bustling post above made me laugh a bit

At least I am not alone, @Rosieroo20 . And that does help!

My eldest was the same, usually a 5:30 start but could be 4:30 in the summer. At one point I was doing a night feed for the younger one at 3:30 which would last until the eldest got up for the day.
It did get so much easier once the night feeds stopped. I just adapted my routine to fit in with them and was in bed at 9pm, my husband had really early starts for work so was happy to go to bed at that time too. I got to quite liking the early starts and was more productive in the mornings if I managed a decent night's sleep.

Hi !
Would like to add Gro Clocks DID NOT WORK FOR US. At all !! My son learnt to reprogram it by 3 years old. He had mostly been an early riser his whole life,and yes it sucks until they learn to play in their room ! He still wakes at around 5.30 but is 8 and learnt to play in his room at around 3 so hopefully that's not far away !
I'll be totally honest as a mum of 3 I used tablets to keep them quiet so I could get lie ins. We use amazon ones thst you can set time limits on.
No other thing worked and we tried ALL THE THINGS.
Sending empathy and support. X