Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To intensely dislike Keir Starmer

1000 replies

LemonyTicket · 27/09/2023 00:42

I can't stand Tories.
The current Tories are the worst

But I still intensely dislike Keir Starmer and will probably vote Green.

I find him phony, with no vision, like a terrible 6th form prefect. And to be honest his whole front bench are dreadful. Wes Streeting nauseates me.

Is it just me?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
28
IdleAnimations · 28/09/2023 16:10

BIossomtoes · 28/09/2023 16:04

That’s not what the point I addressed said. In any event, May was PM from 2016 to 2019 - not much advocacy there. Quite the reverse.

Again as I keep saying on this thread I’m not a Tory fanatic. What this is for me is I don’t trust any MP who thinks women are a feeling and can be appropriated. Starmer had made his stance quite clear until he realised the polls didn’t like it and he started backtracking. This makes me further question his integrity.

May was an awful PM who has recently come out stating she’s happy she was so ‘woke’ (quote). We all know she failed on many things when in power as have her predecessors. There are Tories even now such as Noakes who are pushing for Self-ID.

I am a single issue voter and that is keeping women defined in law as our sex and not a feeling. Because that ‘single issue’ I’m mocked for by many who follow the gender doctrine directly impacts me and the girls growing up in every area of our lives.

I will vote for the party who stands by this which will most likely end up being an independent.

eveoha · 28/09/2023 16:10

Decent people who purport to be Socialists do not allow part of society to have advantages re education - ie charitable status fit private schools/education as Sir Kier Starmer is allowing 😡

EasternStandard · 28/09/2023 16:12

ilovesooty · 28/09/2023 16:09

A shame for you maybe, since it seems you want to debate the issue with me.

I've made my position clear, I think, in terms of what I feel the priorities are for the next government. Yours aren't the same as mine, which I respect.

Have a pleasant afternoon.

Er you did quote me first. And so I responded as is normal.

Yes tough questions I’m sure… But I’d say it’s hard to back up your original point on ‘both sides’

ilovesooty · 28/09/2023 16:16

Yes, I quoted you because I didn't really like the implication that those who see toxicity on both sides are TRAs. I'm not one. If that isn't what you intended to imply, I do of course apologise.

EasternStandard · 28/09/2023 16:21

ilovesooty · 28/09/2023 16:16

Yes, I quoted you because I didn't really like the implication that those who see toxicity on both sides are TRAs. I'm not one. If that isn't what you intended to imply, I do of course apologise.

I’ll take the apology but really the ‘it’s a shame for me as I want the debate’ isn’t the case

I was quite happy not debating with you which is why no tags etc. I just responded to your quote as you replied to my post

randomrandom · 28/09/2023 16:31

What this is for me is I don’t trust any MP who thinks women are a feeling and can be appropriated. Starmer had made his stance quite clear until he realised the polls didn’t like it and he started backtracking. This makes me further question his integrity.

This, this, 100 times this

helford · 28/09/2023 16:51

@IdleAnimations & thats all very terrible for you and your mum but who has allowed all this to happen? Starmer and the Labour party OR the Tories with Cameron, May Johnson and Sunak at the helm?

10 years ago, my mum got all the social care she needed, she would ask for female carers and get them (having been beaten black and blue by my so called father) she wouldn't get that now.

Who has allowed care to become a min wage job? who shut DV and rape centres? who has allowed men into female rape centres?

It isn't Starmer.... .and thats my point you and others can moan about the state of the Labour party and Trans rights all you like but the fact remains its the Tories who have given us all this.

helford · 28/09/2023 16:53

EasternStandard · 28/09/2023 16:21

I’ll take the apology but really the ‘it’s a shame for me as I want the debate’ isn’t the case

I was quite happy not debating with you which is why no tags etc. I just responded to your quote as you replied to my post

TBH Easter, might be better for all if you just list who can reply to you, will save you typing out "i don't want to debate with you" (when you run out of argument) quite so often.

EasternStandard · 28/09/2023 16:58

YouSetTheTone · 28/09/2023 16:00

In all of these examples women are disproportionately affected.
**
Women are impacted by declining services in health care and rape crisis centres more than men.
If your elderly neighbour is a man he is less vulnerable to intimate care being provided by the opposite sex.

Men are less likely to be affected by rape crisis centres closing because the vast majority of victims of sexual assault are women.

I don’t know but interested too

EasternStandard · 28/09/2023 16:59

Ah wrong thread

StarbucksSmarterSister · 28/09/2023 17:41

SpidersAreShitheads · 27/09/2023 05:41

I completely agree.

I think the problem is that the public is so used to the loud blustering of people like Boris, that anyone who is quietly confident and reasonable may seem "uncharismatic". If you're not finger waving, making loud and ridiculous statements, and shouting everyone down with preposterous statement, then it's hard to make your mark.

Starmer did some real good in his time as DPP, and he is fiercely intelligent. He is razor sharp during debates, and nothing gets past him. He has principles and I think that he genuinely wants to do good. He's not just another power-hungry politician who's in it for the glory. I don't get that sense with him. For balance, I think ex-Tory Rory Stewart had the same energy. I don't agree with Rory Stewart on many policies, but I think he is a fundamentally decent human who failed in his bid as PM because he wasn't as loud and garish as Boris, despite being INFINITELY more qualified to be PM.

Back to Starmer, the difficulty is that he's trying too hard to appeal to everyone and in doing so comes across as a bit vapid. He's trying to unite a deeply divided party, and the left wing of the party would be very happy to get him out.

I would be extremely proud to have someone of his intellect as our PM. I do think he can be tough if needed, and I don't think anyone would ever get one over on him. He would be an excellent representative for the UK, and we wouldn't have other countries laughing at us as was the case with Boris.

Some of Starmer's policies though are problematic. It might not be a priority for all, but there are many women - including myself - who are deeply concerned about the impact of losing our protection under law to single sex spaces. Women have already been raped and sexually assaulted by male-bodied individuals in spaces that were SUPPOSED to be single sex - eg/hospitals, prisons, and toilets.

At the moment, trans rights are directly conflicting with women's rights in some areas, and women are being expected to shuffle to the side (as always) to accommodate male-bodied individuals. Women do not have penises. Trans women can have penises. It's not hate speech to differentiate. There are many, many women who would be fully supportive of helping to develop inclusive policies for trans people that didn't simply amount to "tough luck women, if some of you end up hurt, we don't really care."

Unfortunately, Starmer and Labour have been sticking their fingers in their ears and trying to ignore the issue by pursuing self-ID but now they're trying to subtly backtrack. Unfortunately there are many women who have lost faith in Labour because of their anti-women policies, and won't vote for Starmer - no matter what a decent guy he is in other ways.

But if Labour won't stand up for women's rights, who will? Certainly not the Lib Dems or the Greens - both of those parties have indicated that they will also allow male-bodied individuals into women's spaces if they demand access.

The Tories are saying all the right things - but they're the Tories, and a vote for them is hugely unpalatable for left-leaning voters like myself. So who the hell is left??? Why is it such a HUGE fucking ask to find a party that's willing to consider the issues that women are concerned about?!

SpidersAreShitheads

Excellent post. I have to admit I'm somewhat disappointed with Keir and that agree he's trying to be all things to all men in order to get elected, but I still think he's the only choice.

seafronty · 28/09/2023 20:47

Oh look. Another 7 pages of should be Labour voters eating each other. Welcome to our Tory overlords, make yourself comfy, you'll be here for decades....

LakieLady · 28/09/2023 20:54

Starmer's dull, so dull that I can't find anything about him to dislike or to like.

I find Wes Streeting bloody irritating though. He's like an over-enthusiastic school prefect, and he gives me the feeling that he might have a short temper.

Lastchancechica · 28/09/2023 20:56

seafronty · 28/09/2023 20:47

Oh look. Another 7 pages of should be Labour voters eating each other. Welcome to our Tory overlords, make yourself comfy, you'll be here for decades....

What do you expect? It’s shit. But the reality is Starmer will make a terrible PM. Labour have announced laughably awful policies that will only further damage our country and people. They are simply not up to the job in truth. There is no magical panacea to the issues we face. Across the whole of the west not just here.

The answer is certainly a transition to something completely new. The Labour vs conservatives is no longer fit for purpose or serving anyone.

bombastix · 28/09/2023 21:02

The thing is, as much as we don't like to admit it, a lot of voters will prefer Boris Johnson over a man like Rory Stewart. I've met both of these men and the difference is night and day. Rory Stewart is as sincere man, he does think, you can see it in his work, in how he writes. He admits when he gets thing wrong. He even learns from it.

Those aren't unique qualities but they are now rare in public life. Britain doesn't just have a problem in its leadership but also what it votes for.

Johnson was a stupid choice. He was known to be a terrible liar and so he proved. Millions of people voted for him. Stewart was nowhere near that. We have done this to ourselves. And unless we grow up significantly as s country and start coming together and saying no, we don't want an end of the pier act as PM, we don't want Laurence Fox on GB News, or a society that really elevates talentless people like say Russell Brand, then we've got to vote otherwise. I want to live in a serious country. I grew up in one. Even if I did not agree with the Conservatives I could see that they were serious people. I do not think that now.

EasternStandard · 28/09/2023 21:07

I think 2019 could have been different if Labour had another leader

That was a harsh lesson but they likely felt it

bombastix · 28/09/2023 21:09

The joke is on all of us. Stewart writes accurately about a political culture on the slide. We are on the slide

BIossomtoes · 28/09/2023 21:11

The answer is certainly a transition to something completely new. The Labour vs conservatives is no longer fit for purpose or serving anyone.

Somehow I doubt you’d be saying that if the Tories were 21 points ahead in the polls.

sep135 · 28/09/2023 22:03

Even if I did not agree with the Conservatives I could see that they were serious people. I do not think that now.

I like Rishi Sunak, his predecessors less so.

LemonyTicket · 28/09/2023 22:45

I find Wes Streeting bloody irritating though. He's like an over-enthusiastic school prefect, and he gives me the feeling that he might have a short temper

Wes Streeting reminds me of someone on the easyjet counter who pretends he can't help you and then slags you off when you walk away

OP posts:
Teateaandmoretea · 29/09/2023 05:37

BIossomtoes · 28/09/2023 21:11

The answer is certainly a transition to something completely new. The Labour vs conservatives is no longer fit for purpose or serving anyone.

Somehow I doubt you’d be saying that if the Tories were 21 points ahead in the polls.

Bizarre response. The country is in a mess. But the earnestness of the mumsnet Labour fanatics who really think that Labour are going to rescue us with socialism is unfathomable.

Teateaandmoretea · 29/09/2023 05:38

sep135 · 28/09/2023 22:03

Even if I did not agree with the Conservatives I could see that they were serious people. I do not think that now.

I like Rishi Sunak, his predecessors less so.

He was chancellor during Covid. He is very much directly responsible for a lot of the shit we are in.

CurlewKate · 29/09/2023 06:22

@LemonyTicket

Wes Streeting reminds me of someone on the easyjet counter who pretends he can't help you and then slags you off when you walk away"

Working class boy made good, huh? Guess he should just stay in his lane....

helford · 29/09/2023 06:26

Teateaandmoretea · 29/09/2023 05:37

Bizarre response. The country is in a mess. But the earnestness of the mumsnet Labour fanatics who really think that Labour are going to rescue us with socialism is unfathomable.

Apart from no one on this thread has said that Labour will "rescue us with socialism" nor do they appear to be fanatics, (or deluded) other than they want a different Govt to you.

Opposing views do seem get Tories frothing.

Anyway describing Labour as a socialist party is ridiculous, they aren't even left of centre.

Teateaandmoretea · 29/09/2023 06:32

helford · 29/09/2023 06:26

Apart from no one on this thread has said that Labour will "rescue us with socialism" nor do they appear to be fanatics, (or deluded) other than they want a different Govt to you.

Opposing views do seem get Tories frothing.

Anyway describing Labour as a socialist party is ridiculous, they aren't even left of centre.

Eh? Show me where I’ve said I want a conservative government.

Your response is exactly what I’m talking about any criticism of Labour = Tory voter. I voted Labour at the last election.

In terms of the left of centre argument the Tories have been left of centre during this term. Possibly you are right about Starmer being centrist but in which case he is going to hugely disappoint the mumsnetters whose views absolutely can be described as socialist.

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is not accepting new messages.
Swipe left for the next trending thread