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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To have lost it at DS aged 11

1000 replies

FluthyFeaffers · 26/09/2023 21:56

I have yelled at him this evening.
He is 11, soon to be 12.
Started Yr 7 in secondary school 3 weeks ago.
He is struggling so much with his (lack of) organisation in the mornings before school, I am at my wits end.
I spent the whole of year 5 and 6 battling, absolutely battling with him to get ready for school, but never succeeded. We were late every single day for 2 years.
"Eat your breakfast" gets distracted eating breakfast.
"Clean your teeth" goes upstairs to clean teeth but wanders around doing something else.
"Get dressed" goes in to bedroom to get dressed but ends up doing something else.
Etc. Etc. All through year 5 & 6.
It made us late because whilst this was going on I'm racing around trying to get myself ready for work and trying to get my other younger DC ready. Then I'd go and check on DS and he'd never ever have done what I'd sent him to do.
Nothing worked to motivate him. No reward system, no sticker chart, no amount of explaining about the repercussions of not doing as asked, no amount of explaining about the knock on effect of being late for school. I tried it all for 2 years. Nothing worked.
But because it was primary school, all that happened to him was we missed the school gate and had to go roundcto the front reception to be let in. He got a warm friendly greeting from teachers and I got a look of "Why can't you get your poor child in to school on time" and then I'd arrive late for work and get reprimanded for it.
So I spent the whole summer drilling it in to him that in Yr 7 he must must must get to school on time, because in secondary school if you're late you get a detention, because you're causing your sibling masses of stress by making them late for school every time you're late for school, because I am getting in to serious trouble at work because of arriving late every day because I drop you in late because you're not ready to leave on time, because it creates SO MUCH STRESS when you won't get ready in time to leave on time for school.
Yes yes yes yes yes mum, he said every time I brought it up over summer.
I promise, promise, promise I will change, he said.
4 weeks in to secondary school, and it is a nightmare every single morning.
He cannot, cannot get himself ready for school in time to leave.
I spell out for him every single morning what he needs to do. It's soooooo eeeeeasy. It's the same god damn things every single day! Nothing changes! Do x, y, z.
"Yes mum" wanders around.
"Have you done x, y and z?"
"No, sorry, I forgot. I'll do it now"
Wanders off.
"Why haven't you done x? Ive asked you twice now"
"Sorry"
"Do it now"
"Why haven't you done y? I've asked you 3 times"
"I'm sorry. I'll do it. I'm trying my best"
Last week he needed to take his PE bag on 1 of the says.
"Remember to take your PE bag today, it's hanging in the cupboard " I said.
"Oh yeah!!!!! PE!!!!! I forgot!!!!!! Thanks for reminding me!!!!!"
20 mins later:
"Have you got your PE bag?"
"Oh No! I forgot! I'll get it now...."
15 mins later, after non stop constant continuous marshalling to get ready, do this, do that, do this, do that:
"Right, come on, we're late again, pick up your rucksack and your PE bag we need to leave NOW"
DS hovers around putting on tie and blazer which I'd asked him to do the the past hour sling with all his other things he needs to do.
"NOW" I raise my voice, as he's making my other child late for school and me late for work.
He runs out the door, jumps in the car.
We get to school.
He turns pale and says "I've forgotten my PE bag"
"Tough" I say. " I have told you 3 times this morning to take your PE bag. I reminded you for the 3rd time right before we left home."
DS starts crying
"I will get a detention!!!!!!!!!"
His worst, absolute worst fear, is getting a detention. He's never had one, and is terrified of getting one.
"Maybe you'll learn if you get a detention " I say.
Then he starts begging and pleading with me to take him home to get his PE bag. He's crying sorry over and over again. He looks physically ill, sweating, clammy, pale.
So I drive him home to get PE bag.
My other child starts crying because now she is horribly late for school (different school) and is too young to go in by herself plus she has SEN and isn't mature enough to cope with going in by herself.
I drop him back to school. He's late. I drop DD toschool. She's late. I get 'the look' from her teachers. I drive to work. I'm late. I get disciplined by my boss.
That evening, I talk to DS for a very, very long time about the impact of his disorganisation in the mornings.
We work out that it would help him if I wrote down for him everything he needs to do in the mornings.
So I write it all out in very clear, bullet point steps. I show it to him, he thinks it's really helpful.
Great, I think.
Why didnt I think of this before.
1 week on, it's of no help at all.
This morning, he's wandering around telling me he's ready whilst simultaneously having forgotten 7 instructions in his morning list. I pointed each of the 7 things on the list out to him, staring each thing that was on the list that he hadn't done.
I told him to do them.
Went off to get other child ready to leave, I'm ready to leave, DS still not ready to leave. We were all late again.
Yesterday, he had something really important to take to school. His timetable. I askedchim SIX TIMES to put his timetable in to his rucksack (he'd got it out at home and I'd seen it in theclounge). I told him the night before, and again in the morning, 6 separate times in total "Put your timetable in to your rucksack now, otherwise you will forget" . 6 times. The 6th time was just before we left. I mean, I was getting more and more stern each time. "Put. Your. Timetable. In. To. Your. Rucksack. NOW. NOW!" We got to school. He turned pale. Panicked. "Mum I've forgotten my timetable!!!!!!!".
I point blank refused to go back and sent him in to school without it. He was really upset. Told me after school today that he'd gone to the wrong classroom at one point in the day as couldn't remember without his timetable. So I said "Go and put it in your rucksack now then, do it now".
"Ok" he says.
Dinnertime:
"Did you put your timetable in your rucksack?"
"Oh No! I got distracted! I'll do it now!"
Evening time
"Is your timetable in your rucksack?"
"No.......I forgot......."
"Go and do it immediately "
"OK...."
Bedtime, he's in bed, reading:
"Darling, is your timetable in your rucksack, did you do it?"
"No, sorry, I'm sorry mum, I forgot"
And that was that.
I lost it.
Yelled at him. For ages.
I have NEVER yelled at him before. Never.
He was devastated. So remorseful. Said sorry over and over again.
And finally, he broke my heart by sadly and quietly saying "I'm so sorry for being me. I really struggle with my short term memory mummy. I know it causes problems butvi cant help it".
He's soon to be 12.
He has not got SEN.
He's bright.
He's average at school except for maths where he's below average.
He's amazing in every other way.
He's such a good boy.
He tries so hard all of the time to do his best.
He's a clever boy.
He's a wonderful personality.
Fantastic sense of humour.
Loving.
Kind.
Affectionate.
Funny.
Friends love him.
Teachers complimentary about him.
What the hell is wrong with him in tbe mornings?????????
Am I being too hard?
Am I expecting too much????

OP posts:
Thread gallery
10
GreenFritillary · 28/09/2023 19:50

he thinks he's got "listening problems". Spot on - poor auditory processing, plus poor short-term memory. Not low intelligence, lazy or defiant. Probably ADD, possibly ASD or dyslexia - get a referral for an assessment in this sort of area. I don't like drugs, but there is a place for them, and Ritalin can work wonders for a kid like this. Start the morning prep after tea the previous night, supervise but don't do any of it, until there is the bare minimum to do in the morning. I really feel for all of you.

Pinklemons9 · 28/09/2023 19:59

This is my 8 year old, is this normal 8 year old behaviour? I have questioned if she has adhd for so long. My 4 year old sometimes has a better attention span.

Newlydivorcedyay · 28/09/2023 19:59

Def sounds like inattentive add.
Aside from the assessments etc, can you work on "technical setups" that avoid issues?
Just one example, any piece of homework my kid brings home is instantly lost in all manner of unusual places, and my son has no clue how it even happens. So we have an arrangement with his teacher that all books stay in school and he does homework in breaks/at the end of the day (luckily his school doesn't give much homework). This way most homework gets done, and nearly none gets lost.
It's these technical solutions that make his (and my) life so much more manageable.

AnneMJAH · 28/09/2023 20:00

Your son’s disorganisation sounds like one of my sons. At the age of 16 he found out that he has ADHD. Knowing this helped him, and me too actually. At important times like exams he goes to a smaller room, can take supervised breaks if finds he is loosing focus. Bags are packed and put at the door the night before - he does it and I help tick off a list. All clothes left out night before. Shower before bed and wash in morning helps on very busy days. We are a much happier and less stressed household!

slore · 28/09/2023 20:09

I concur about time blindness. I just have no judgement of time whatsoever. apparently judgement of time is connected to circadian rhythm, and most people with ADHD have abnormal circadian rhythms. I am fully nocturnal.

ADHD people only have two times: now and not now.

Also we tend to do things at the last minute because our low-dopamine brains need that extra hit of adrenaline from a looming deadline in order to function even slightly.

Nazzywish · 28/09/2023 20:11

OP just coming back to say having read your updates, your an amazing mum. Honestly so nice to see you taking the time to research and get to grips with it all. Really hope her gets the help he needs and give him an extra cuddle from this random mumsnetter please :)

LondonLass91 · 28/09/2023 20:12

Sounds like my son...no special educational needs, just a typical forgetful kid. But good luck OP, nightmare isn't it?! It will all pass soon enough, I should know..xx

FireFox0108 · 28/09/2023 20:14

This screams ADHD to me...

My daughter is 12 & does have ADHD {as do I & my mum ~ we were diagnosed in 2018 & this led my daughter to be assessed & also diagnosed} & has just started high school {we're in Scotland}

Girls can present differently to boys but she is a nightmare with organisation & being given instructions to do things {more than 1 or 2 instructions overwhelm her & nothing gets done ~ even if it's things that are done repetitively like getting organised for school etc} ~ I also struggle although have 30 odd years of learning to deal with it & finding things that help me {when I was able to work I was chronically late & that was with the majority of prep done the night before ~ everything that could be done the night before was done, I very rarely got it right & I am still late for most things} But I forget what it's like & expect her to be able to remember & do the things I ask her to...

Obviously there's a lot more to ADHD than just disorganisation but maybe worth a look?

Good luck

Kx

Twilight7777 · 28/09/2023 20:17

Yes OP hyper focus on enjoyed subjects is a major thing in ADHD. He sounds so like me at that age, but I was fortunate that my mum understood that it took me longer to do things, and would either keep prompt signs up, like a post it on the front door, ‘have you got Keys, phone, money’. We had a monthly calendar up as I found it easier to understand what I had to do when.

Havana2345 · 28/09/2023 20:18

It does sound a bit ADHD to me. There's lots of different types. He sounds just like my daughter, I feel your pain. It can be so, SO frustrating. My GP has referred my daughter to CAMHS, so we'll see from there whether she has or not. But she will need to be told umpteen times to get things done, nothing worked for her either. Actually, a timer for the shower does. She sets it for 15 mins and knows in that times she needs to wash her hair and body. She she has 5 mins dossing, 5 mins washing body and 5 mins washing hair. She also hyperfocuses and will talk the hind legs off a donkey, lol. She was also never picked up in primary but I was always told she was a daydreamer. It definitely got much worse when she went to high school. Her high school head of year not sure about whether she has it or not but it's common for girls to mask and I feel she majorly does this at school.
Hope you get on okay OP.

DartmoorDoughnut · 28/09/2023 20:20

I hope you can find some things that help him but yes I would 100% say he has ADHD i hope you can find some support for him - and you!

Short562 · 28/09/2023 20:23

It really sounds as though he has ADHD

CadhlaWren · 28/09/2023 20:24

Hi OP I already commented earlier but just wanted to add, don’t be too hard on yourself for not considering adhd until now. Inattentive adhd has never been as well known and Our understanding of what neurodiversity actually looks/feels/is has changed so much in recent years. Really I think you’re doing brilliantly.

slore · 28/09/2023 20:24

A good treatment for inattentive ADHD: atomoxetine (Strattera) is good for the inattentive subtype, and rather than working short term like methylphenidate (Ritalin, Focalin, Concerta etc) is takes a few weeks to work and is more long term.

I am holding out hope for transcranial magnetic stimulation: using powerful magnets to draw blood to the correct areas of the brain. It had shown promise in various mental health conditions, and unofficially in inattentive ADHD too, but it's not authorized yet.

Mrspenfold123 · 28/09/2023 20:26

You have to set a system in place that has what Japanese car manufacturers call poke-yoke built into it. He wants to watch TV on the evening? He has to present his packed bag to you before the TV goes on. Put an “I must take whiteboard” at the front door. A checklist he has to read before he goes out. It’s a pain to have to do this obviously, but you physically need to check he’s done thing 1 before he enjoys thing 2. You say he keeps getting distracted - sounds like ADHD to me.

Cydonia · 28/09/2023 20:26

Plenty of replies from people with better knowledge and advice than me, but I just wanted to say you sound like a lovely person and an amazing mum and I really hope you manage to find a solution to make life easier for you all. Your son sounds like a more extreme version of mine, also year 7, also disorganised, easily distracted, bright and lovely, so I can certainly empathise.

Annierob · 28/09/2023 20:27

Have you tried putting a clock on the wall and saying we must leave the house at a certain time or we will be late. Then set the clock 15 minutes fast. 😊
Hard for year 7s. They deal with so much.

Jojo2820 · 28/09/2023 20:29

This is virtually a description of my mornings, my son is 15, he was diagnosed just over a year ago with inattentive adhd, he cannot focus on things that hold no interest for him and just forgets what he is doing. I spend my mornings going in and out of his bedroom every 5/10 mins to move him along to the next task, it’s tedious but it needs to be done. I sometimes shout and get angry too, it’s human emotions. Please don’t feel bad for losing your temper once! I would reach out to the doctors/school senco and try to get your child assessed as they have already recognised their short term memory problems, they may start to struggle at secondary without intervention and help early.

Codswallopcurry · 28/09/2023 20:29

Somebody probably said already, but there is ADD without hyperactivity. Also, hyper focusing is a tray of Attention Deficit Disorder.He might even be on AS.
It could be dyspraxia, too. He sounds lovely.
See the school psychologist, asap. Good luck.

Beety3ly · 28/09/2023 20:32

My son has ADHD and has a list that I wrote for him.... some kids prefer a visual timetable. Massively helped!

FeetupTvon · 28/09/2023 20:34

He is autistic, I’d put money on it.

DrSK2 · 28/09/2023 20:36

Omega 3 & 6 supplements may help. Xx

DelphiniumBlue · 28/09/2023 20:38

ADHD. Can affect life admin and processing skills. It's often not picked up in bright primary aged children and it's only as they get older that it becomes apparent that they are not at age related standards for personal organisation.
I'm sure DS3 has this; his personal organisation was a matter of real concern at secondary school but no help was forthcoming because he was academically very able. And I'm not sure that schools know what to do about it anyway.
Our experience is that procrastination is a real problem, and even now as an adult, he needs a lot of support in getting started on tasks.
My advice would be keep calm, get things done in advance ( eg night before rather than in the morning), help him make checklists, and don't allow any online gaming etc until he's shown you his bag packed and checklist ticked off. And if he has a smart phone, teach him how to set reminders and schedule tasks.

Anothertiredteacher · 28/09/2023 20:39

Have you thought about ADD? Attention deficit disorder.

I have known children with this who do well academically but can sometimes struggle to focus and families have really struggled with it. I would definitely get this checked out!

Deckchair1009 · 28/09/2023 20:42

Awww this made me tear up because I have a son that’s EXACTLY the same! Get a big wipe board in the kitchen and plan each day out. Every evening after tea, make sure all the kids (even the little ones) get everything they need for the morning. Get a “butler stand” for their rooms. They come home and immediately put their uniforms on it with clean pants/socks. Obviously wiping off some school dinner stains. Make sure they refer to the board again over breakfast. Yelling and emotions from you are all normal and, I tell myself, it teaches them about the range of emotions, but the mum guilt kills me! In the car ,on the school run, review the morning and score it out of 10. Or f the kids are good, play the “not allowed to stop game” basically what it says but the kids think it’s amazing! Keeps your mind on the road too as you cannot stop even for red lights (ie drive super slowly for the last 10 seconds 🤣)
He’s got a lot on his plate and is clearly conscientious at school, but that’s why he’s at school, to learn and independence is a big part of that. Keep up with the rewards, he can earn more and feel proud when it goes well. Can you put an alarm:blue tooth speaker upstairs on a timer, whilst he’s meant to be getting ready just to snap him out of his daydreams? Something like mission impossible? I have horrible memories of school mornings thanks to my mum being so stressed and angry, I’ve tried to change this with my kids, but it’s more stressful as they get older at times. Good luck xxx

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