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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To have lost it at DS aged 11

1000 replies

FluthyFeaffers · 26/09/2023 21:56

I have yelled at him this evening.
He is 11, soon to be 12.
Started Yr 7 in secondary school 3 weeks ago.
He is struggling so much with his (lack of) organisation in the mornings before school, I am at my wits end.
I spent the whole of year 5 and 6 battling, absolutely battling with him to get ready for school, but never succeeded. We were late every single day for 2 years.
"Eat your breakfast" gets distracted eating breakfast.
"Clean your teeth" goes upstairs to clean teeth but wanders around doing something else.
"Get dressed" goes in to bedroom to get dressed but ends up doing something else.
Etc. Etc. All through year 5 & 6.
It made us late because whilst this was going on I'm racing around trying to get myself ready for work and trying to get my other younger DC ready. Then I'd go and check on DS and he'd never ever have done what I'd sent him to do.
Nothing worked to motivate him. No reward system, no sticker chart, no amount of explaining about the repercussions of not doing as asked, no amount of explaining about the knock on effect of being late for school. I tried it all for 2 years. Nothing worked.
But because it was primary school, all that happened to him was we missed the school gate and had to go roundcto the front reception to be let in. He got a warm friendly greeting from teachers and I got a look of "Why can't you get your poor child in to school on time" and then I'd arrive late for work and get reprimanded for it.
So I spent the whole summer drilling it in to him that in Yr 7 he must must must get to school on time, because in secondary school if you're late you get a detention, because you're causing your sibling masses of stress by making them late for school every time you're late for school, because I am getting in to serious trouble at work because of arriving late every day because I drop you in late because you're not ready to leave on time, because it creates SO MUCH STRESS when you won't get ready in time to leave on time for school.
Yes yes yes yes yes mum, he said every time I brought it up over summer.
I promise, promise, promise I will change, he said.
4 weeks in to secondary school, and it is a nightmare every single morning.
He cannot, cannot get himself ready for school in time to leave.
I spell out for him every single morning what he needs to do. It's soooooo eeeeeasy. It's the same god damn things every single day! Nothing changes! Do x, y, z.
"Yes mum" wanders around.
"Have you done x, y and z?"
"No, sorry, I forgot. I'll do it now"
Wanders off.
"Why haven't you done x? Ive asked you twice now"
"Sorry"
"Do it now"
"Why haven't you done y? I've asked you 3 times"
"I'm sorry. I'll do it. I'm trying my best"
Last week he needed to take his PE bag on 1 of the says.
"Remember to take your PE bag today, it's hanging in the cupboard " I said.
"Oh yeah!!!!! PE!!!!! I forgot!!!!!! Thanks for reminding me!!!!!"
20 mins later:
"Have you got your PE bag?"
"Oh No! I forgot! I'll get it now...."
15 mins later, after non stop constant continuous marshalling to get ready, do this, do that, do this, do that:
"Right, come on, we're late again, pick up your rucksack and your PE bag we need to leave NOW"
DS hovers around putting on tie and blazer which I'd asked him to do the the past hour sling with all his other things he needs to do.
"NOW" I raise my voice, as he's making my other child late for school and me late for work.
He runs out the door, jumps in the car.
We get to school.
He turns pale and says "I've forgotten my PE bag"
"Tough" I say. " I have told you 3 times this morning to take your PE bag. I reminded you for the 3rd time right before we left home."
DS starts crying
"I will get a detention!!!!!!!!!"
His worst, absolute worst fear, is getting a detention. He's never had one, and is terrified of getting one.
"Maybe you'll learn if you get a detention " I say.
Then he starts begging and pleading with me to take him home to get his PE bag. He's crying sorry over and over again. He looks physically ill, sweating, clammy, pale.
So I drive him home to get PE bag.
My other child starts crying because now she is horribly late for school (different school) and is too young to go in by herself plus she has SEN and isn't mature enough to cope with going in by herself.
I drop him back to school. He's late. I drop DD toschool. She's late. I get 'the look' from her teachers. I drive to work. I'm late. I get disciplined by my boss.
That evening, I talk to DS for a very, very long time about the impact of his disorganisation in the mornings.
We work out that it would help him if I wrote down for him everything he needs to do in the mornings.
So I write it all out in very clear, bullet point steps. I show it to him, he thinks it's really helpful.
Great, I think.
Why didnt I think of this before.
1 week on, it's of no help at all.
This morning, he's wandering around telling me he's ready whilst simultaneously having forgotten 7 instructions in his morning list. I pointed each of the 7 things on the list out to him, staring each thing that was on the list that he hadn't done.
I told him to do them.
Went off to get other child ready to leave, I'm ready to leave, DS still not ready to leave. We were all late again.
Yesterday, he had something really important to take to school. His timetable. I askedchim SIX TIMES to put his timetable in to his rucksack (he'd got it out at home and I'd seen it in theclounge). I told him the night before, and again in the morning, 6 separate times in total "Put your timetable in to your rucksack now, otherwise you will forget" . 6 times. The 6th time was just before we left. I mean, I was getting more and more stern each time. "Put. Your. Timetable. In. To. Your. Rucksack. NOW. NOW!" We got to school. He turned pale. Panicked. "Mum I've forgotten my timetable!!!!!!!".
I point blank refused to go back and sent him in to school without it. He was really upset. Told me after school today that he'd gone to the wrong classroom at one point in the day as couldn't remember without his timetable. So I said "Go and put it in your rucksack now then, do it now".
"Ok" he says.
Dinnertime:
"Did you put your timetable in your rucksack?"
"Oh No! I got distracted! I'll do it now!"
Evening time
"Is your timetable in your rucksack?"
"No.......I forgot......."
"Go and do it immediately "
"OK...."
Bedtime, he's in bed, reading:
"Darling, is your timetable in your rucksack, did you do it?"
"No, sorry, I'm sorry mum, I forgot"
And that was that.
I lost it.
Yelled at him. For ages.
I have NEVER yelled at him before. Never.
He was devastated. So remorseful. Said sorry over and over again.
And finally, he broke my heart by sadly and quietly saying "I'm so sorry for being me. I really struggle with my short term memory mummy. I know it causes problems butvi cant help it".
He's soon to be 12.
He has not got SEN.
He's bright.
He's average at school except for maths where he's below average.
He's amazing in every other way.
He's such a good boy.
He tries so hard all of the time to do his best.
He's a clever boy.
He's a wonderful personality.
Fantastic sense of humour.
Loving.
Kind.
Affectionate.
Funny.
Friends love him.
Teachers complimentary about him.
What the hell is wrong with him in tbe mornings?????????
Am I being too hard?
Am I expecting too much????

OP posts:
Thread gallery
10
Firstbornunicorn · 27/09/2023 16:38

I cried reading the OP because it described me at 12. I tried. I really did. But I just couldn’t do it. I wanted more than anything to be organised and get to school on time, but I couldn’t. It caused untold stress to my entire family and by year 9, I felt exhausted and stressed.

I was diagnosed with “twice exceptional” ADHD in university. That means my intelligence is above average, but my executive function is severely impaired. During school, everyone thought I was too intelligent to have any kind of SEN.

I’m glad you now know that your precious son likely has ADHD. I hope you have it in you to be his advocate and make sure he gets the support he needs. There is much better awareness now. In fact, I’ve raised it with my 4 year old’s teacher and she is happy to refer him.

LanaL · 27/09/2023 16:39

He has not got SEN.

This stood out to me too . Are you certain? Have you ever took him to anyone , or spoke to anyone about this? I only say because that is a lot of reminders you have gave him - repeatedly. My eldest is autistic and he gets like this , sometimes it’s the things that he’s so worried about not doing and that he’s forgot before that he tends to forget again. I find with him , he gets overloaded . I’ve had similar situations where I’ve repeatedly gave him instructions and it’s like he just shuts down .

Also, the “ sorry for being me” 😢 my son says things like this , he is very hard on himself and heavily blames himself for things . If not sen , maybe something even something mild is going on that affects his memory - like mild ADHD or something?

Finally, no I don’t think you are being too hard at all and it’s understandable that you flipped , you are stressed too ! Don’t be too hard on yourself x

supercatlady · 27/09/2023 16:43

You described my daughter to a T. Teachers weren’t concerned about her as she wasn’t disrupted, but I knew there was something. She was diagnosed with auditory processing disorder aged 10 and autism aged 14. She now suspects she has ADHD.
Best of luck
x

BackOfTheMum5net · 27/09/2023 16:47

Blatantly ADHD. You cannot be his external brain, he needs to figure out his own ways of organising himself. A diagnosis might help you both understand his strengths and weaknesses, and find coping strategies.

Would detention be the end of the world?

autumnmakesmehappy · 27/09/2023 16:48

Ah the poor lad! I don't blame you for your frustrations OP but I think, as others have said, there may be more to this and I think he needs help.

PreschoolMum4 · 27/09/2023 16:51

I have a daughter who is exactly like this in the morning. Currently going through an ADHD referral. We have a really good routine and structure we have had for years. Her siblings follow with very little prompting and yet every morning I have to help her get through each step before we leave the house. It’s the same thing at bedtime!

Excited101 · 27/09/2023 16:57

He’s got ADHD, I’d put money on it- I have it too.

nk2017 · 27/09/2023 16:58

Well better wake up 3 hours before the school. U r too soft on your son who play with your mind. U sound like he's in reception which I have to help but come on he's near 12!! Glad my daughter wake up 2 hours before to get ready for school even she not need but she want make sure everything is ready n pack herself.
You seem spoil him a lot instead let him do himself but u spoil him too much which is reason for bad habit. My kids go reception on time every day n even I drove to high school on time as I left 7.45am n took 15 mins to drop then come back to drop other kid for reception.

Stop make him spoilt brat n let him do his work n let him learn his own lesson by go detention n dont bother bring timetable let him. Let's see if school do something for u.

Or best of all leave home 7am n drop them 1 hour before so u won't be late for work! Not last min leave home n get late for work.

Why r u delay till last mins cos u want more sleeping .

Wake up all kids at 6am n leave 1 n half hours before son due open so he will be moody too early oh well u need be on time for work

nk2017 · 27/09/2023 17:01

Oh please it's not ADHD!! So all my kids n every single kids have ADHD!! Don't make an excuse label he's ADHD really. All kids of course very naughty mess about but should I send all.my kids n all niece nephew to special school cos don't listen me repeat when I said something.

He's playing with u

Nuttyroche · 27/09/2023 17:01

Did the op ever clarify:

  1. Why she was running around like a headless chicken at 5.30am?
  2. whether she had a partner?
  3. whether she then went on to work
InSpainTheRain · 27/09/2023 17:02

Do you get everything ready the night before? So school bag packed and PE kit or whatever by the door? School clothes out and ready on the chair? Shoes next to it. Your clothes and bag out and ready too? If there is no flaffing to find everything you have a head start. Also I wouldn't give in - if he forgets.something he gets detention, end of.

NDfamily · 27/09/2023 17:02

I would be extremely surprised if he didn't have ADHD. In my opinion you must seek a diagnosis or him and everyone around him will misunderstand him and his self esteem will collapse.

Zebedee55 · 27/09/2023 17:04

You'll be yelling a lot more before the teenage years are over. It's life.🙄

Wannago · 27/09/2023 17:07

Ormally · 27/09/2023 11:33

Just to say that from my point of view (knowing others with ADHD and dyspraxia, as well as having it), there are often some amazing traits that come with it too. Some of the most gifted, original, determined, caring and didactic people I will never forget have had and struggled with this cocktail of ND. Not just one; several.

I just wanted to come back on here and say something similar.

Greta Thunberg famously said that her autism is her super power. However frustrating ADHD is, there are also aspects of it that are actually a super power, although sometimes when you are parenting and scaffolding it can be very hard to see that.

I have a slightly different perspective, because while I have two DC with ADHD (DS2 and DD who is even younger), they are my "normal" DC- because DS1 has complex special needs, a life limiting condition that meant he wasn't expected to reach adulthood (he is now 22 and in a nursing home, fully wheelchair bound, frequent epileptic fitting, functions at the level of at most a 3-5 month baby). ADHD kids can go on to be high achieving, able and enormously productive and the difference between the life experiences of DS1 in and out of hospital and my younger DC is huge. On that spectrum, ADHD does feel so much closer to normality.

DS2 is now at university, managing a very demanding course (medicine), while acting in and directing student theatre, heavily involved in student politics, working (being paid) on an hourly basis in a quasi managerial role for one charity and volunteering for another - all out of this extraordinarily high octaine energy that causes so many issues when he was a kid. Hyperactivity and hyper focus, if it can finally be harnessed, can turn into the most incredible force of nature - and I am not saying it is easy, I was lucky with DS2 that he tends to be fascinated by anything academic - which at least meant that so long as the teacher was knowledgeable and interested in their subject, it was hard for them not to be charmed by a kid who was literally jumping out of his chair in excitement due to what they were teaching him (just so long as they managed him and allowed the rest of the class to get a word in edgeways, he would answer every question if he could). With the teachers that were less engaged though, we had constant detentions for disruption and calling out (singing and dancing sometimes (sigh)) until he started taking some responsibility (he started talking to the teachers about where to sit him so he didn't get distracted and explaining what he needed as he got a bit more mature). The higher up the school, the better it got, as he got more dedicated teachers and his own ability to manage himself improved.

Harder at this point to see the super power nature of DD's inattentive ADHD, but I am convinced it is there. The approach I confess I have taken over the years (and maybe that is due to having DS1 who has always and will always need everything done for him, dressing, nappy changing, hoisting, bathing etc), but I took the attitude that I would do things for the other two DC until they told me they were ready to take on the responsibility - which they both did when they were ready. Step by step. That meant that I dressed DD in the morning until long after her peers were dressing themselves (and allowed a couple of hours in the evening so we could get her dressing herself, allowing multiple lack of focus periods). Then gradually we moved to - me just dressing the top half and putting knickers and tights in the toilet so she did the bottom half. Then leaving her clothes on the end of her bed the night before, then getting her to leave her clothes on the end of her bed the night before (this is even with a uniform, that should be so easy). Similarly with the bag packing. Always done the night before, but I did it for years after her peers were taking responsibilty, and then gradually, gradually stepped back, doing it with her, then at a later stage checking after she went to bed and adding in what she had forgotten, until that wasn't necessary any more. It is only now, in sixth form, that she has started telling me - "I can make my own lunch Mum", which she can, and while occasionally as she walks out the door I run down the list of (keys, phone, lanyard, oyster card, laptop, bag), it is not like it was. But doing it this way allowed us to prioritise working on the things that might make her look too different from her peers - so that, for example, around here all the secondary students catch the bus to school, and so when she went into Year 7, we practiced and practiced in the summer so that she could too, despite me being terrified she was going to get lost, because her peers didn't need to know about the secret help she was getting at home, but she needed to be able to manage the bus, in front of them. Knowing that she had all her equipment in her bag (at least at the beginning of the day) - and me having multiple (calculators, rulers, pencils, pens, pencil cases, water bottles, you name it) upstairs meant that she had a better chance of trying to deal with the overwhelming complexity of changing classes for different subjects, and going to different rooms (it took her years and years to no longer get lost in both primary and high school, even though they are really both small schools and not very difficult). She helped out at prospective parent/teacher this year, and took DC on tours of the school - given what she was like at Year 7, that is amazing, she knows her way around, and she can catch buses and now trains and use google maps and she doesn't get lost anymore, but it has been a long, hard journey. And I took the view that she didn't need to have to worry about whether she had the right equipment when she finally got to class, she couldn't have managed both in Year 7 (it was bad enough to remember to pack it up from the previous class, but at least it was in school somewhere if I had made sure it was in the bag).

But if you manage it like that - it really does get better. As they are ready, they take on more things, they really do tell you that they don't need you as much any more. That has been my experience anyway. Just ignore what DC are "supposed" to be doing at this age, and let them tell you when they are actually ready to be able to do it. And let them step forward inch by inch when they are ready. Prioritise those aspects that might mean they might be ridiculed by their peers. As that really doesn't help. It is a lot of work, but in the end much easier than trying to fight the impossible (and does mean you have more of a fighting chance of getting out on time).

Daftasabroom · 27/09/2023 17:12

@FluthyFeaffers
He can hyper focus on things though.
He can spend hours focusing on things that he's interested in, or is enjoying.
To me that's not consistent with ADHD, is it?

Pretty much one of the key traits of ADHD. Totally consistent with ADHD.

SleepyFergus · 27/09/2023 17:12

nk2017 · 27/09/2023 16:58

Well better wake up 3 hours before the school. U r too soft on your son who play with your mind. U sound like he's in reception which I have to help but come on he's near 12!! Glad my daughter wake up 2 hours before to get ready for school even she not need but she want make sure everything is ready n pack herself.
You seem spoil him a lot instead let him do himself but u spoil him too much which is reason for bad habit. My kids go reception on time every day n even I drove to high school on time as I left 7.45am n took 15 mins to drop then come back to drop other kid for reception.

Stop make him spoilt brat n let him do his work n let him learn his own lesson by go detention n dont bother bring timetable let him. Let's see if school do something for u.

Or best of all leave home 7am n drop them 1 hour before so u won't be late for work! Not last min leave home n get late for work.

Why r u delay till last mins cos u want more sleeping .

Wake up all kids at 6am n leave 1 n half hours before son due open so he will be moody too early oh well u need be on time for work

What a useless and pretty horrid post. Although I struggled to read it as your command of typing leaves a lot to be desired.

Perhaps you should read the thread properly, at least the OPs posts. You can see she has tried everything and has been given some great pointers by others on here. Unlike yourself.

quietlycontent · 27/09/2023 17:14

HI I don't have any knowledge of ADHD however my small tip is - does he have a device for school? My son has a tablet they use in lessons - I photographed the timetable and made it the wallpaper - so he now has to lose the tablet to lose the timetable.

Might not work but thought I would share

Good luck working things out

Nuttyroche · 27/09/2023 17:14

nk2017 · 27/09/2023 16:58

Well better wake up 3 hours before the school. U r too soft on your son who play with your mind. U sound like he's in reception which I have to help but come on he's near 12!! Glad my daughter wake up 2 hours before to get ready for school even she not need but she want make sure everything is ready n pack herself.
You seem spoil him a lot instead let him do himself but u spoil him too much which is reason for bad habit. My kids go reception on time every day n even I drove to high school on time as I left 7.45am n took 15 mins to drop then come back to drop other kid for reception.

Stop make him spoilt brat n let him do his work n let him learn his own lesson by go detention n dont bother bring timetable let him. Let's see if school do something for u.

Or best of all leave home 7am n drop them 1 hour before so u won't be late for work! Not last min leave home n get late for work.

Why r u delay till last mins cos u want more sleeping .

Wake up all kids at 6am n leave 1 n half hours before son due open so he will be moody too early oh well u need be on time for work

You come across as almost illiterate in this post

toobusymummy · 27/09/2023 17:16

oh my gosh, I can tell from your post just how totally frustrated you are with him! Its easy for others to give an opinion but unless you're parenting 'that child' advice is just that, advice - I have 3, the older 2 just get on with it, the younger one has what we call 'head butterflies' where they'll all be paying attention then the one of the end spots something interesting and all the others want to take a look too (she's 8, the analogy works!). I get her up earlier, she has half an hour to eat breakfast, if its not eaten by then tough, she has precisely 5 minutes in the bathroom - 2 for brushing her teeth and the other 3 for whatever else she needs to do - she has 10 minutes for getting dressed before she needs to be on the chair to have her hair brushed, and her bag and homework have to be done straight after school, before ANYTHING else and brought to me to be checked and put by the front door before she gets to do whatever else she wants. It took a while but its worked for her!

SamJL474 · 27/09/2023 17:18

I think your Son may have ADHD. Maybe ask doctor for a referral. The things you have described are symptoms.

User90121 · 27/09/2023 17:27

Sounds really like inattentive adhd.

scoobysnaxx · 27/09/2023 17:34

@FluthyFeaffers I am so glad you are taking all of our posts seriously and researching. You could easily be so so defensive and it wouldn't help anyone. Everything might start to make a lot of sense.

The frustration is real.

I have a daughter who is 14 and I fully suspect she has ADHD. Despite being a therapist and very familiar with ADHD and processing clients for adult assessments, I still find myself exasperated and very impatient with her. Makes me feel guilty. The things I ask her to do are so so simple so it's incredibly frustrating daily to have to tell someone multiple times to do something, multiple times a day. It can make like so so hard.

I really have to have a word with myself sometimes as I know she just can't help it at times.

Beccy1990 · 27/09/2023 17:34

I would almost definitely say that he has SEN. Quite possibly ADHD. Especially since you have another child with SEN.

I think your asking to much from him in the mornings. It really does sound like he can’t help what he’s doing. Clearly you asking him to to all the things repeatedly isn’t working.

Just have a shorted list that he needs to do and do the rest for him.
If you know he needs the planner just put it in his bag, take his pe bag to the car.

He already needs to get himself dressed, breakfast teeth that sort of thing himself.

Can you move his toothbrush downstairs so he can brush his teeth in the kitchen sink where you can keep him on track. Same with getting dressed I dunno if he’d want to get changed in front of you at 12 but let him get changed in a downstairs room so again you can keep him on track.

also join some adhd / autism FB groups preferably with neurodivergent admins I’d recommend this one - autism inclusivity. Lots of adhd people on there who can advice with techniques to help him.

Also be kind to yourself. It happens very often that you have a child with obvious SEN needs and then another child where their SEN needs are more subtle and they are missed.

Tamuchly · 27/09/2023 17:37

He can hyper focus on things though.
He can spend hours focusing on things that he's interested in, or is enjoying.
To me that's not consistent with ADHD, is it?
Or am I wrong?

Thats almost exactly consistent with ADHD!

I have recently been diagnosed with ADHD as an adult but you have described my life with my son (who also has ADHD) when he was school age. I was desperate for some kind of plan to help him as, unless I did everything for him, he would do nothing! I was lucky in that he could walk to school so I pushed him out the door at the appropriate time (including wandering about time as he could get distracted just getting there). We got everything ready for school the night before, I had a copy of his timetable on my notice board in the hallway so he never got his out of his bag, I had two PE bags ready to go and multiple uniform items as he often mislaid things at home and school. I insisted on homework done the day it was set and then carried around in his bag until it was due in (usually in a poly pocket to keep it in one piece). The primary school senco recommended I cut the morning routine down to its bare bones which for us was - get up, clean teeth, put on uniform, eat breakfast, grab bags and go! I know he should have had a wash or a shower but he took so long that those things had to happen the night before. It definitely wasn’t foolproof, substitute teachers threw him off, me not being well threw him off and the days when I was too tired to organise him caused chaos. With the benefit of hindsight, I probably should have done the same things for me as I do now!

As a tip from now that helps me immensely, look into pomodoro working where you set a timer to do a task for a set period of time then have a timed break before another timed burst of activity (I’ve probably explained this really badly, sorry) it really helps me get things done as I’m a terrible procrastinator!

jenpil · 27/09/2023 17:37

nk2017 · 27/09/2023 16:58

Well better wake up 3 hours before the school. U r too soft on your son who play with your mind. U sound like he's in reception which I have to help but come on he's near 12!! Glad my daughter wake up 2 hours before to get ready for school even she not need but she want make sure everything is ready n pack herself.
You seem spoil him a lot instead let him do himself but u spoil him too much which is reason for bad habit. My kids go reception on time every day n even I drove to high school on time as I left 7.45am n took 15 mins to drop then come back to drop other kid for reception.

Stop make him spoilt brat n let him do his work n let him learn his own lesson by go detention n dont bother bring timetable let him. Let's see if school do something for u.

Or best of all leave home 7am n drop them 1 hour before so u won't be late for work! Not last min leave home n get late for work.

Why r u delay till last mins cos u want more sleeping .

Wake up all kids at 6am n leave 1 n half hours before son due open so he will be moody too early oh well u need be on time for work

What a harsh, rude person you are, with absolutely no idea about children who are struggling with undiagnosed special needs!

I notice you seem to be struggling yourself, particularly with English - including reading, writing, spelling and grammar, so maybe brush up on those, and come back when you can write a legible post.

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