To wonder why relationship, marriage and kids are still seen as a ’ successful’ life?

[OnedayTwodays]

Reading here and also IRL so many people, still, thinks that this the ’LifePlan’ everyone not only wants, but must have.

Some thread about perhaps not so nice people, people say it brings them joy to know they end up alone and old - as in being single is seen as some kind of a punishment.

Single, or god forbid if your childfree, stilm have to explain why.
Say your single and when asked you say you don’t hook up or having casual arrangement or whatever, and people look at you like you have two heads.

Will we ever move on and stop assuming everyone wants/lives the same way?
Will the stigma ever go away?

Why is it that even now being in a relationship/kids is seen the proper, mature, right way to live?

I'm a single person and come across this attitude all the time, if I mention I'm happily single by choice people look at me like I'm deluded 😂

I think for some people they honestly can't believe a single person can ever be happy and I also think there's always been a general distrust of single women throughout history.

I think it's because for the vast majority of people, having people that they love around them is part of what makes life good. And up until recently, that was primarily conisdered in terms of "marriage+children". I think that last bit is changing a bit, but it's still true of many people that a good life invovles having a stable romantic life partner and some children.

Now the list must also include: good job that you love and pays well; interesting hobbies; strong circle of friends; tidy house and good appearance. It's impossible. No one can live this charmed life.

What I find really annoying is that life going well is synonymous with your life not really changing. So divorce is seen as bad, or even breaking up with a long term partner, even if you don't have children (but especially if you do).

@Girliefriendlikespuppies

I think for some people they honestly can't believe a single person can ever be happy and I also think there's always been a general distrust of single women throughout history.

This is true. Men are threatened by single women because they don’t need anything from them. Women who do need men can’t understand them.

I mean, I hear this the sort of sentiment you express a lot but I just don't think the fact that humans are social animals is ever going to change?
I get it, women should aim for more than marriage etc etc but the boring fact is a lot of people want intimate partnerships/to raise children/close ties to a community, usually of close friends and family?
Obviously this is more thorny in practice, especially for women, and can have many pitfalls and complications but I never why rugged individualism is supposed to be better/more evolved. Just would seem a bit shit and lonely at the end of your days.

I'm also a community nurse and completely disagree.

The most unhappy, lonely patients are the ones with children they never see or have unpleasant partners or are widowed but haven't ever made friends outside of their marriage.

The single people I can think of have led interesting lives and are very keen to remain independent. They also often have true friends and other relatives who help support if needed.

From a biological point of view we are here to reproduce - food in/babies out. I presume that was what Siameasy meant by our purpose.

But humans are way beyond that now. There are plenty of us reproducing and for most of us we have constructed a society that offers a lot more than finding food and reproducing.

Two of the happiest people I know are long term single - in one case I don't think she ever had a romantic or sexual relationship. Both are happy, connected, they have good friends, and live a life they have chosen for themselves.

I think the majority of people want that special person that has their back, that they can share life's ups and downs with. Its nice for most people to be someone's number 1. I don't think it is some big conspiracy just that most people wouldn't want to be alone, they love being in a loving relationship, with sex on tap and someone to run to the shop for them when they can't be arsed, so to them not having that would be shit.

It's nothing personal good, good for you it you happy single but I think the majority of people are always going to look for that comfy relationship feeling.

Yes, I'd echo all of that.

Couldn't agree more.

'But why don't you want someone? Aren't you lonely?' No on both counts. Besides, being in a relationship and having children doesn't mean you won't be lonely, so the argument doesn't hold. Still, I have heard it for 20+ years.

I think the majority of people are always going to look for that comfy relationship feeling.

A large proportion don’t actually find that though do they? You only have to look around these boards to see a large proportion of people in fundamentally unhappy relationships. That is no way to live imo.

Well, I don't think that means a successful life unless that's how the person concerned measures success. What would you like me to do about it?

You can see that that is skewed though right? Who posts on here about how fantastic their relationship is, what would be the point in me starting a thread about how awesome it is to be in a loving, caring relationship? I know loads of people in lovely relationships.

I wouldn't agree with this from my (admittedly anecdotal) experience.

Myself, my sister and mother alternate days visiting my father in his nursing home, we also know the staff quite well and are told quite a lot how unusual it is for families to visit so much.

In fact, for many people in there I have never seen them have a visitor (except days like Mother's day/ Father's day when the place is busy etc.). Obviously we're not there all the time, but one of us is there every day and we keep in touch about what went on. Plus the staff tell us the same thing, that most people don't get regular visitors, whether they have children or not.

Also, as an aside, my brother has been no contact with our family for many years now, despite knowing our dad has dementia and near the end of his life. So even if you have children the relationship may break down at some point.

I think like you have said you are filtering it through your own perspective on not being happy single, so it suits the narrative that married people with children must be happier.

@Farmageddon

Im purely basing my opinion on people I have met. I have never worked in a nursing home so have very little experience in how people fare in them. I'm just basing it on the somewhat independent people I meet that live at home.

I should have caviated my prior posts with people who are in 'happy'marriages or people who have healthy relationships with their children. As @Girliefriendlikespuppies Says, yes, there are many unhappy people who do not have good relationships or bonds with their children but I still stand by what I said in previous post, in my opinion, the people with spouses and children seem to be more content in life.

I see a romantic relationship as a sign that you’ve succeeded in life because you’ve found someone willing to tolerate you for life. I see adult children that are close to their parents as a sign of success because it means you did a good job raising them.

I do not see having children/sex/a job (regardless of qualifications needed) as success.

I’d say as you get older your realise how important family is. We, as a species, aren’t really meant to be alone.

Because what else is there, really?

A successful life is one you're content with. To me it's as simple as that.

Of course contentment comes from many different sources. Some will find it in relationships/family, others from career, some others from being independent and able to please themselves. There's no right or wrong. Of course society still pushes the whole "family" thing. We need future tax payers! It's an economic pressure really at this point. The reality is we don't actually "need" any more people on the planet right now.

Some thread about perhaps not so nice people, people say it brings them joy to know they end up alone and old - as in being single is seen as some kind of a punishment.

I always though that sentiment was more to do with having burned through all social and familial connections rather than actual singles status - more everyone seeing who they are - which is also IMO naive as people have different faces for different people.

If my DP hadn't each other and us kids they'd literally see no-one - same age IL know everyone and see loads of people despite retirement and are very socially active - it's a combination of factors there but very noticeable difference.

I know happy older single people and very isolated couples most people want connections even distant ones with others - we are a troop animal and loneliness is apparently endemic and bad for our health but marriage and kids isn't only way to combat it and increasingly not the dominant way.

I can see why being single would be better than being in an abusive/bad relationship, but I would assume that that the vast majority of people would rather be in a happy relationship than single.

I understand totally that it’s not always easy to find the right person at the right time, and that people can have such bad experiences that it puts them off ever risking a relationship again.

I do know of people who have got together later in life though, so although it may become too late for children, it’s never too late to meet someone special.

Marriage, kids etc - none of these are "achievements".

Maintaining healthy and loving long-term (as in, decades long) relationships is an achievement.

Healthy and loving long-term relationships are not the only metric of a successful life, but imo they are integral to one.

I see a romantic relationship as a sign that you’ve succeeded in life because you’ve found someone willing to tolerate you for life.

Fair enough, but how realistic is 'for life' these days?

Well, quite, but that doesn’t alter the fact that a lot of people still post about unhappiness in relationships.

@readbooksdrinktea

49% last time I checked. Would be nice if it were higher.

I agree many people probably do feel like that but I think it’s a bit of a shame. I can honestly say that while my partner is a positive addition to my life, being single wouldn’t be worse than being with him, just different. There are pros and cons of being single and of being in a relationship. I do think it would be better for women in particular to focus on building the life they really want as an individual before, or at least concurrently to, looking for a partner, but I think some women disregard their own needs in favour of finding a partner at all costs.