Would you prefer private school?

[Dontbeamenace]

I'm sure I would prefer private school for my children. Would it matter to you if money was no cost?

I am nervous of it because friends with children at private schools have come across 'mean girl' behaviour, which you don't seem to get so much in state schools. When I say 'mean', I mean really, really mean. Subtle, arrogant and extremely nasty. Behaviour in general at private schools is better, partly because they are selective, but the nastiness seems prevalent.

Not so much mean girl behaviour in state schools?!?! 🙈

I'm quite interested in this. Do you also shop at budget supermarkets on ethical grounds or are you happy to shop at Waitrose/M&S?

The reason I ask is that I think your ethical reasons are that all children should have an equal right to a good education regardless of wealth. I think you could also argue that all children should have an equal right to good quality food regardless of wealth, and therefore if you apply the same reasoning then rich people should ethically not shop at expensive supermarkets?

I'm very happy to have holes picked in my reasoning and feel free to tell me if I've barked up the wrong tree. And apologies if I come across as goady. I just think it's an interesting discussion.

I think it’s easy to have moral principles against private school if your children are happy at a decent state school. If they are at a failing school or just very unhappy and (as is often the case) you have no other state option it would imo be a very odd form of morality to leave them there if it was easily affordable to send them to a good private school.

And how do people know that everyone they have met who went to private school is a horrible person? I’ve never told any of my colleagues that I went to private school, for example. It just hasn’t come up. My (anecdotal) experience was that there was a lot of bullying at the state school I went to and I found that girls at my private school much more supportive to each other - doesn’t mean I think that everyone who went to state school is a bully.

'mean girl' behaviour, which you don't seem to get so much in state schools.

Are you actually kidding?!

Yes, if I had the money I would definitely send my dc to private schools. The attention from smaller classes, the confidence that so many have sets them up for life.

I can assure you that mean girl behaviour happens just as much in state schools.

Stage schools round us were dire - over subscribed and had a nasty issue with bullying that just wouldn’t shut down. Ours go to a small private - they are happy and not snobby as some have pointed out on here.

Interestingly, some of DD's closest friends were privately educated. Not one of them is arrogant or up themselves.

Roll on all the stereotypes about private school pupils not mixing with different backgrounds, living in bubbles, being superior…usually based on anecdotal evidence of one family or a couple of people at university 🙄

I believe I am agreeing with you.. there are a lot of stereotypes about about private schools and I'm sure I've heard them all... I have varying opinions.
I think private schools are lovely if you find the right one and can afford it.
I also think state schools and comps can be useful and beneficial.
I'm not on the post to hate state schools at all. I am fond of the private schools that I've chosen and just wondered how others felt.

Mine have just left. It was a huge financial struggle as we were both public sector workers. Our local London secondary did not feel safe so our principles went out of the window. My kids seemed to be the only ones who had never flown long-haul or gone skiing, though were never bullied for it. I am still aware it was a privilege to pay the fees.

It has been worth every penny. They have made friends for life and it has been lovely. My kids are not cool but said that even the cool, wealthy and sporty kids were nice. They left school with full sets of 9s and A stars and have all gone to RG universities and Oxbridge. They are inquiring and love to learn.

And because of us, they are grounded.
They are mixed race kids with public sector parents. Maybe this has ‘saved’ them from the posh/elitist mindset. Who knows. But they are kind and decent young adults with no airs or graces.

People who say all private school people are awful are prejudiced. There is a big range. And of course many people you meet, you have no idea where they went to school. Even the nice ones may have been to private school!

My lot recognise their privilege. They had online schooling throughout the pandemic. Even the last couple of years, they have been unaffected by strikes and teacher shortages. It’s a huge ‘top’ London school so they may have been luckier then smaller private schools with recruitment and retention issues.

I have no regrets but wish the local state offering had been better. It’s been an expensive time and I wish we hadn’t ‘needed’ it.

As it happens, I went to private school, under the old assisted places scheme. It was a place full of people from another world who had no idea how to educate those of us from shit backgrounds to make our own way in the world. It was always assumed that pupils had access to money and privilege and those of us who didn’t were regarded as being at fault in ourselves. There was no empathy whatsoever, and when there were issues we were simply abandoned. Things are even worse nowadays as it is accepted and acceptable to middle class people that people from shit backgrounds, especially girls, have no hope and no chance.

The solution to all of society’s ills does not rest in education or schools. Education is not a driver of social mobility without wholesale reform of Britain’s economic system.

The only good thing about the place was that it was single sex and prepared to teach girls science, but even that can’t help alone.

I can assure you that mean girl behaviour happens just as much in state schools.

Nonsense! All state school students are sweet, caring people. The only time violence has been witnessed in our local town was when children from the state school had to rush in and fight with private school children who were attempting to roast a child over a spit.

Private isn't an option and DD has now left school. I used to be pissed off there were no grammar schools or other non-fee paying selective schools in my area to give DD the opportunity to go. Dsis lives in Kingston upon Thames, that's eye-opening compared to what's offered in my area.

What I've realised is that this also means the more academic pupils aren't creamed off making the state schools dumping grounds for the less able. We're fortunate to be in the catchment for by far the best local school. Several of DD's friends have admitted if they didn't get into that particular school they would have gone to the fairly mediocre local private school.

On balance I think being able to afford a private education is only part of the decision in my area. It isn't the difference between achieving and not that it might be elsewhere. DD is about to enter 6th form studying maths, further maths, physics and chemistry. The state system served her well.

TheaBrandt · Today 08:37
Dd (decent single sex state) has friends from the most deprived area of town with very challenging backgrounds and friends who live in Manor House’s

Do her friends from the most deprived area of town ever mix with the Manor House children under your roof?

I would argue that people saying you're not "living real life" is speculative and relative.
All experiences are real life.

Yes. State primary teacher, and like a lot of my colleagues, there’s no chance I’d send my DD to a state comp.

I did send my DC private. It was the right thing for them the local comprehensives weren’t as good academically or in terms of wider activities.

Unfortunately for those who claim they are avoiding their children living in a bubble research doesn’t fully back you up. The position is more nuanced.

Grammar schools have disproportionately low numbers on free school meals

“Pupils at grammar schools were much less likely than pupils at non-selective schools to be eligible for free school meals (around 6% compared to 21% in 2022). They were also much less likely to have special educational needs”
https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn07070/

And social mixing doesn’t occur as much as you might think in a comprehensive
Example of social mixing research

I love reading the difference between private school threads and the problems with secondary school threads.

Plenty of horrifying stories in the state system of chronic underfunding, substitute teachers, awful behaviour of students, appalling SEN support and the list goes on and on.

I went to private schools due to scholarships/bursaries and some people are horrible reverse snobs about private schools. Including my own step mother. They're gleeful about private school pupils who "fail" or make poor life choices.

I only have to ask in my local area how the schools are, particularly for SEN kids, and I get story after story of traumatised children who are now school refusers. My own neighbour's daughter wont drink all day as they've closed most of the toilets due to vaping issues. The news is full of absent children from the education system post covid.

If you have a bright compliant child and access to good schools private schools aren't necessary. For many children the small class sizes, and dedicated teachers who are not burnt out and paid well are valuable.

I have a daughter with SEN and I plan to send her to a private school in 2 years time. I'm terrified of Labour getting in and changing the VAT rate - we just wont be able to afford it.

We could afford to send our DC to private but won't for a number of reasons, in no particular order

• My own experience of attending a private secondary school on an academic scholarship, which was not positive
• The experiences of friends who work or have worked in private schools
• Conversations with friends who attended private schools and had similar experiences to mine
• I now work in a comprehensive school and every year we have kids transfer to us from local private schools with parents citing poor SEN provision and safeguarding issues being brushed under the carpet
• DH and I both fundamentally believe in comprehensive education, we want our DC to mix with people from a variety of backgrounds
• We live near excellent state schools, which I understand is a privileged position to be in.

My post wasn't targeted at you, it was directed at those making the stereotypes whilst refusing to acknowledge the privilege they have through access to a decent state option where bullying/knife crime/antisocial behaviour is not rife. All those who trot out the 'I can afford private but I choose not to' have access to a decent state option where their children can thrive and be happy. But instead of acknowledging that, they choose to belittle the privately educated with their nonsense stereotypes based on one person they went to university with.

Most adults do not shout about their schooling from the rooftops. When I started my new role approximately 2 years ago, I could not have identified which individuals were private and which were state educated (I lead a team of 20 from recently qualified to managers, all with professional qualifications). As time has gone on and we've got to know each other, I now know but it is not apparent in most cases.

No they do not. The gulf seems to be too great. Appreciate everything I say is totally anecdotal before I get leapt on!

Mine went to excellent state secondaries as there are plenty of those round here.

I work in a state secondary in an inner city area which is also excellent in terms of progress and behaviour.

The private schools in our area are nothing to write home about and the results aren’t that great, even though private schools are allowed to do easier exams in Maths than students in state schools!

Laughing at there not being mean girls in state! Where there are teen girls there are mean girls whether you are at St Paul’s girls or bog standard comp…

I always have to laugh at the anti-private snobbery. “Everyone who goes to private is horrible”, well that’s exactly why I don’t tell anyone I went to private school. Funnily enough, no one has ever guessed!

I’d love to send mine to private. We have a lovely little state primary, but I can’t imagine how my sensitive little SEN child will cope in the local secondary - outstanding, good results, but serious bullying issues. I’m hoping to move far enough up the career ladder to be able to afford it by then.