Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Children on train seats!

426 replies

gg45 · 23/08/2023 10:09

It drives me mad when I see children over c6 yrs old not offering train seats to adults (esp older adults) standing in aisles on commuter trains (I have no problem with longer journeys when people have booked seats- but several commuter options you can't). When I was brought up we were expected to stand for elders. What is wrong with the world? AIBU??

OP posts:
TheInseparables · 23/08/2023 10:36

I'm mid 40s and offer my seat to children.

Original poster
gg45 · 23/08/2023 10:36

Clearly if there are safety issues (eg risk of crush) then children should sit. And obviously some are too young. But generally my issue with it is it that it is a simple action that teaches children respect, to think about others comfort before their own and that they are not the centre of the universe. Too much now seems to revolve around kids first that it is little wonder some grow up as "me me" generation. To be honest if I were offered a seat from a child I would thank them and say how thoughtful it is - but then refuse it unless I was ill. But frankly so often I now see really quite old children sitting while retirees are standing and the families are completely oblivious- it is really beginning to grate!

OP posts:
Belladonna56 · 23/08/2023 10:37

I am elderly, and in my day, young children would sit on a parent's lap and older ones would stand to let an adult sit down. I'm sure there must have been exceptions, if the child was unable to stand for some reason, but the norm was that adults should sit.
Today, you get the entitled 'why should my child stand up?'
Another example of declining standards of behaviour in the UK.

hdbs17 · 23/08/2023 10:37

If I've paid for my seat and my child's seat then we're sitting on them.

If someone who clearly needs a seat because they physically cannot stand (very elderly, disabled, pregnant, injured) is left standing in the aisle then I will give up my seat - but to just someone classed as 'an elder', no.

Potatooooooooo · 23/08/2023 10:39

This must be a joke. Surely a child is as entitled to a seat as an adult. Adults don’t deserve anymore respect than a child either. There are priority seats on trains, tubes and buses. It’s rare for there to be so many elderly, disabled or pregnant people in one carriage for all of these to be taken so don’t see an issue.

nettie434 · 23/08/2023 10:39

It's obvious why there are threads on it at the moment. There are more children travelling on trains during the summer holidays. In London I suspect commuters paying a lot for annual season tickets are a bit resentful when they see grandparents with freedom passes and grandchildren with zip oystercards travelling for free. Some train companies don't allow cheap tickets at rush hour which probably helps on some routes.

I personally wouldn't expect a child to give up their seat for me unless they were young enough to sit on a parent's lap comfortably and safely. I would give up my seat for a child. However, mostly the seats are occupied by other adults so whether or not a child would give up his or her seat for me or vice versa is entirely theoretical.

Wibblywobblylikejelly · 23/08/2023 10:39

gg45 · 23/08/2023 10:36

Clearly if there are safety issues (eg risk of crush) then children should sit. And obviously some are too young. But generally my issue with it is it that it is a simple action that teaches children respect, to think about others comfort before their own and that they are not the centre of the universe. Too much now seems to revolve around kids first that it is little wonder some grow up as "me me" generation. To be honest if I were offered a seat from a child I would thank them and say how thoughtful it is - but then refuse it unless I was ill. But frankly so often I now see really quite old children sitting while retirees are standing and the families are completely oblivious- it is really beginning to grate!

And where is the respect for the children?
What have these people done to deserve this respect?

willingtolearn · 23/08/2023 10:40

I disagree that this reflecting 'declining' standards.

It's simply a change to what you are used to and expect.

That's for you to manage, not for you to insist that everyone agrees with you.

ICanBuyMyOwnBooks · 23/08/2023 10:41

You don't know anything about the DCs who are sitting. You don't know their age, if they have any health issues, etc. Rather than assuming everyone is awful and selfish, why not assume they all have a reason that means they need to sit and feel grateful that you are able to stand? Exact same situation but completely different emotional result for you.

IsThisIt2021 · 23/08/2023 10:41

gg45 · 23/08/2023 10:36

Clearly if there are safety issues (eg risk of crush) then children should sit. And obviously some are too young. But generally my issue with it is it that it is a simple action that teaches children respect, to think about others comfort before their own and that they are not the centre of the universe. Too much now seems to revolve around kids first that it is little wonder some grow up as "me me" generation. To be honest if I were offered a seat from a child I would thank them and say how thoughtful it is - but then refuse it unless I was ill. But frankly so often I now see really quite old children sitting while retirees are standing and the families are completely oblivious- it is really beginning to grate!

You’d see my 12 year old sitting down in a seat and think he should give it up.
what you wouldn’t see is, he has autism, mobility issues. He wouldn’t know to hold on tight nor would he know to move to the left/right to allow someone past. He’d get caught up in the rush and end up getting off at the wrong stop. He’d also panic due to the sensory overload, which will result in a meltdown. Maybe not at the minute, it might happen later in the day but it WILL happen. I’ll keep him seated and put up with your judgement thanks.

Iam4eels · 23/08/2023 10:42

Belladonna56 · 23/08/2023 10:37

I am elderly, and in my day, young children would sit on a parent's lap and older ones would stand to let an adult sit down. I'm sure there must have been exceptions, if the child was unable to stand for some reason, but the norm was that adults should sit.
Today, you get the entitled 'why should my child stand up?'
Another example of declining standards of behaviour in the UK.

And child fare used to be 20p with a condition of carriage being that they didn't occupy a seat needed by a full-fare paying passenger. Buses/trains also used to be designed differently with handles on the back/sides of seats and a seat back to ceiling bar every few seats or so.

Buses/trains now don't have the same handles, most of the ones here just have those loops from the ceiling that children won't be able to reach. Child fares are higher so come with the expectation of "I've paid so I should have the same chance of a seat as everyone else".

enchantedsquirrelwood · 23/08/2023 10:42

Back in the day children would always stand and let an adult sit; and often they can sit on a parent's knee.

However, a fit young 20 year old bloke is more able to stand than a 5 year old child, so it depends.

It would also help if people would avoid commuter trains in the holidays. You've got the rest of the day to travel, and it's cheaper anyway.

delilabell · 23/08/2023 10:42

If I've paid for my children's seats then they have just as much right to sit there as anyone else. Anybody should give up a seat for disabled/pregnant/elderly people not just children. I'd rather stand up and let my 7 year old sit down as else she'll fall all over the place.

ElizabethBest · 23/08/2023 10:42

My 6 year old has profound SEN. He may look "normal" but he needs a seat. So if you're on the same train as us, I'm afraid it'll just have to drive you mad, and enjoy standing up! Grin

RLmadmum · 23/08/2023 10:42

YABU. Easy for children to get barged into, hit in the face with again and may not be able to hold on properly which could cause them to fall over and potentially take someone else down with them.

wagnbobble · 23/08/2023 10:43

I’m a middle aged woman with hip / back issues and yes I’d be peeved if I was standing on my commute to work when young kids sat on their own seat ( and not on parents lap ) or teen kids didn’t offer their seat . Few reasons - I’m paying a full fare and commuting regularly , I’m doing/ will have done a full days work not going out for leisure . If I damage something due to a trip / fall it now takes years to heal whereas youngsters will invariably bounce back . It’s just polite and I was brought up to think about others needs and not always put myself first .

enchantedsquirrelwood · 23/08/2023 10:43

Buses/trains now don't have the same handles, most of the ones here just have those loops from the ceiling that children won't be able to reach

that also applies to shorter adults and is also a reason why people often won't move down a busy train, because they can't hold onto anything

fuzzwuss · 23/08/2023 10:43

If an older and infirm person is standing, then the parents should offer their seat. Cannot understand why you think a 7 year old should stand whilst an able bodied adult sits.

Isthatarealname · 23/08/2023 10:44

Laughing at the thought of children having better stability. I can imagine my 7 year old taking out a carriage of standers at the slighted jolt.

hdbs17 · 23/08/2023 10:44

gg45 · 23/08/2023 10:36

Clearly if there are safety issues (eg risk of crush) then children should sit. And obviously some are too young. But generally my issue with it is it that it is a simple action that teaches children respect, to think about others comfort before their own and that they are not the centre of the universe. Too much now seems to revolve around kids first that it is little wonder some grow up as "me me" generation. To be honest if I were offered a seat from a child I would thank them and say how thoughtful it is - but then refuse it unless I was ill. But frankly so often I now see really quite old children sitting while retirees are standing and the families are completely oblivious- it is really beginning to grate!

But respect is a two-way street, so how are you showing respect by expecting a child to give up their seat for you? How have you earned that child's respect by just being born before them?

This isn't declining standard at all - this is progression into treating everyone equally.

delilabell · 23/08/2023 10:45

Totally agree @willingtolearn . It was also acceptable for children to go up chimneys to clean them.....ideas change.

Offyoupoplove · 23/08/2023 10:45

I think YABU. If they are little they should sit on a parents lap (not always possible if there is also a younger child). But no, a 7year old shouldn’t stand for a grown adult I don’t think. I always gave up my seat pre-kids and am grateful when stranger now do that for my children.

CostelloJones · 23/08/2023 10:45

I fundamentally disagree with the age old “you must respect your elders” sentiment when the elders in question are being dicks.

Mariposista · 23/08/2023 10:46

Grumpyoldpersonwithcats · 23/08/2023 10:18

As a child I was raised (apologies for the pun) to give up my seat for an adult. Culturally, if one takes MN as a bellwether, this seems to have changed now.
But OP - I'm with you.

Me too.

Zodfa · 23/08/2023 10:46

My memory of being six is that it was significantly harder to stand in one place for any period of time that I now find it as an adult.