So many child haters here

[Sabrinasummersamples]

So many threads on here seem to attract the same sort of answer along the lines of
-In my day we'd have got a smack. Never did me any harm. Give em a clip round the ear.
-kids today are entitled shrieky brats
-kids should stand for adults
-kids shouldn't be allowed in restaurants

Yet often those same posters are the first to call "agism" when people disagree.
Why do so many people hold such contempt for kids?
I mean I know kids can be annoying but honestly you could say that about any group of people. Plus we were all kids once 🤷

You don't sound selfish to me @hecameoutroaring . You sound lovely and just the kind of teacher I'd like my kids to have. I'm sorry to hear of your infertility btw. I know how that feels. 6 rounds of IVF before I had my kids. I really don't think I could have worked with other people's kids whilst going through it though. It would have been too sad. So hats off to you

Thanks for your kind words @Sabrinasummersamples I am considering adoption (something I've always wanted to do) or IVF. I find the opposite- being around the children, teaching them, talking to them, having a joke with them etc. is sort of a tonic for me in my sadness. But I completely understand not everyone feels that way in infertility.

It suits some parents to blame us for being intolerant because it gives them an excuse to carry on with their ineffectual parenting and dismiss it as "kids will be kids....kids aren't developed yet....kids need to be loud...." rather than realising the other parents manage pretty well to bring their kids up properly.

Children crying and misbehaving slightly or being noisy is absolutely understandable.

I frequently see at a (very privileged area and school) local primary school toddlers and their 4/5 year old siblings defiantly disobeying their parents, screaming at the top of their lungs roaring and crying if they don’t get their way.

Parents gently begging, pleading and bargaining with their children whilst asking ‘okay okay what do YOU want to do darling?’

Huge 5 year olds demanding to be carried home while Mum pushes a pram with another huge 3 year old, or else they’ll sit on the pavement and not budge.

I consider myself a gentle and balanced parent but there’s no way in hell I’d raise my children to be so utterly entitled.

I certainly don't hate children, and don't know anyone who does.

But I do hate having a peaceful meal out or some such ruined by shouting, screaming children whose parents just ignore the situation, or beam around happily as if everyone should be delighted with their kids. These parents are a PITA.

I was sitting in one of two lounges in a hotel recently. The only other occupant was an elderly gentleman. we were both quietly reading. A group of parents with small children came in from the other noisier lounge and one of them said 'oh yes, it's much quieter in here' and they all settled in with their extremely noisy children, who were crying, shouting and generally creating a racket.

Myself and the gentleman just got up and left.

@Toomanythalias I do get what you're saying but you know I don't think that situation is only likely with families with kids. It's just what happens when you're somewhere quiet and a big group comes in. I was in a restaurant recently (well a few months ago - I think it was Feb or March?) with DH and our 8 year old twins. We were sat down eating a meal and hadn't noticed that a large table had been set up nearby. A group of 10 or maybe 12 adults came in to celebrate a 60th birthday. With helium balloons and much loud chatter and raucous laughter There was a fair bit of seat swapping going on as well (admittedly nobody was actually running around) but it was disruptive enough that we finished our meals and left without desert. Which is kid of a big deal for kids.
My point is it's easy to blame kids or parents or whatever but maybe it's the size of the group rather than who it's made up of?

But my point is that they actually moved out of a noisier lounge, remarked on how quiet this one was and then proceeded to bring their 3 small children in, who created a racket. That is lack of awareness not the size of the group.

I think there are quite a few complaints about children crying being lumped in with generally noisy/bad behaviour. Crying is a sign of distress and I don't believe it can be labelled bad behaviour or parenting. Not knowing how to be quiet in quiet spaces e.g. running around and playing noisily is something parents need to teach their children not to do, but I wouldn't include crying in this.

I am not blaming the child for crying or saying it was bad behaviour. But he was crying because he was prevented from going out the door or grabbing his parents' drinks off the table. Bringing a child that young and two other noisy children into a quiet room where two people were reading, when there were other places available, and actually choosing that room because it was 'nice and quiet' demonstrates a real lack of common sense and awareness,

Or maybe the noisy / busy room didn't have the space for them? I'm not meaning to come across as argumentative. It's just it's easy to see things only from one side. Maybe they were selfish or maybe there were reasons?

I hear this sort of thing a lot on here. Is it a regional thing?! I don’t know but I hardly ever witness badly behaved kids IRL.

@Toomanythalias I get mildly irritated by the way nobody is quiet in the library anymore, so I do sympathise! On the other hand, I can remember how overstimulated my children would get in busy and noisy environments, and that I would try to seek out quieter spaces for them to calm down. I've no idea why these parents did as they did, but as OP comments, there may be various reasons.

@washrinse me neither!! Honestly I really do hardly ever see very badly behaved kids, at least in adult spaces. I do sometimes see a kid being a PITA sitting at the top of a slide and not letting other kids go down while their parents ignore them in a playground and shrieking at softplay for example but those places are CHILD places.
On holiday recently there were a bunch of kids running around and being annoying in an outdoor restaurant (they weren't British FWIW) but it's unusual enough that it really stuck in my brain.

Babies and toddlers are cute and endearing. There is literally NOTHING appealing or cute about children older than 4/5

You sound horrible! Imagine the outcry if someone said there is nothing good about people over the age of 60 for example.

@Sabrinasummersamples lol truth hurts. Nobody finds your 8 year olds endearing

I think plenty of actually

Hahahhaa sure

There is nothing appealing about people over 18. 🤷‍♀️

@AngryGreasedSantaCatcus true

But also why endearing?? They're not hamsters! They're people. I can't imagine many people find you "endearing" either

@Sabrinasummersamples why you are so triggered, most people dislike others kids. Biologically we release endorphins looking at babies/toddlers. This is gone when they become children. I'm sorry your struggling to accept your kids are no longer appealing/cute to anyone. It's purely biological. I think most women want babies and toddlers and then just tollerate the kids they become. Sounds like you are struggling with this and the fact you are at the parenting stage that is generally perceived as unappealing. Nobody would be reproducing if women popped out 5 year olds, let's be honest.

I don't think any more people are child haters than usual. Clearly, some people experience more bad parenting than others. I can't say I have many problems round my way with children. So it makes my view a lot more optimistic. If every time I went out to a restaurant I couldn't walk to my table for tripping over children or saw near collisions with waiters I might have a different view.

Maybe it is a regional thing? But for the people experiencing the above I don't think it is right to say they hate children.

I much prefer children over 5 years old, preferably the 10-16 age group but 5+ is good, they are starting to get more interesting at that age

I'm hardly the only one, plenty of people actively volunteer with kids older than 5 so this feels more like your opinon than a general one

@Needsomeadvice33 you are the perfect example of someone who sees kids as "lesser humans" that plenty of PP were suggesting didn't exist. So thanks for proving my point. FWIW I don't think kids have to be "cute". Same as I don't think adults do. They are people.